Not sure where to start, or end. WAW?

[john28]

Goodness, it really is so hard to let go. My S4 is coming over in about an hour, W will drop him off.

Everytime I see her, my heart breaks. It hurts to know that letting go means that I will no longer be making new memories with her and our son as a family right now, and possibly in the future.

She doesn't tell me anything they do together. I called her to find out if she was dropping him off or I was picking him up - we didn't talk about it yesterday. I asked her how her day went, if they had fun. She said yes, they had a good day.

She wouldn't even make small talk. Tell me about what they did today. The usual comforts of a R and M that you can talk about your day with someone. We don't have that together anymore.

I know that shouldn't bother me, but it does. It's really going to take some time.

[TimeHeals]

I asked her how her day went,

Pursuing.

What does John want?

And don't answer "My wife back" because you see how she doesn't love you right now.

John is going through seperation anxiety because he wants his wife to love him, but she doesn't. You can tell by her actions.


John, you need to start doing things for John. Any little thing you do to improve your life and the quality of the time you spend with your kids is a step forward.

After enough steps forward, you might still want a woman who loves you, but you will accept your wife's feelings as they are instead of pursuing her, trying to convince her to somehow love you.

If she wants to love you, she will approach you, but right now you are chasing her, and you haven't let go, and she can't say hello without you chasing her and such. Let her feel what she feels. Give her enough space to think about something aside from escaping you.

[john28]

TH - thanks - I didn't even realize that trying to make small talk is pursuing. I'm really going to have to start analyzing everything I do or so, or just come here and post it so I can get 2x4's everytime

Tonight when she dropped the kid off, I gave her the letting go speech. How even though I didn't agree with her decision to leave, it was not my decision to make, and I've accepted it. In some twisted way, I respected her for making that decision because things really weren't going to get any better in our M. They never were 'better' in our entire M. I masked problems and glossed over them without dealing with the real issues at hand, and her decision to leave has forced me to look inside myself to see why I've done those things. In some way, I appreciated that she had done this, but more importantly, I was respecting her decision to do this - because it is what she needed to do right now and it was what I needed right now. Had we not separated, we'd be here anyways... it was just a matter of time.

And that is the truth. I am somehow happy she did this, because I'm able to peer into my soul and see what it is I want to be - knowing I am not that person today.

I also told her that I wouldn't ask her to come home again, and we wouldn't have that talk anymore. It wasn't time, nowhere near time to discuss that. Only when I feel comfortable with who I've become, and she feels comfortable with both who she is and I am, we'll have that talk.

We both agreed that we would give each other the opportunity to be with each other again should we both feel we've reached where we want to be as well as where the other wanted to be.

She said she loved me very much, and that she felt more comfortable around me now knowing that I was just there to love her, and not pressure her into coming back - or manipulating or controlling the situation. She felt the respect I had for her in this difficult time and that was something she hadn't ever felt before.

It was only a 5 minute conversation really, then we walked outside to her car, she initiated a hug and kiss and waved goodbye as she pulled out.

For some reason, I feel awfully free at this point. Free to start the changes I want to make without pressure to do so. Only internal pressure and integrity to do what is right by me.

[bustorama]

I asked her how her day went,

Pursuing.

Is making small talk really pursuing? Are we supposed to stand there mute and not speak?

Me: Hello
W: Why are you pursuing me?

[sandi2]

I didn't even realize that trying to make small talk is pursuing.

Told you!

Tonight when she dropped the kid off, I gave her the letting go speech.

The "letting go speech" is pursuing too. Aren't you the one I told to just keep your mouth shut? Everytime you open your mouth....you pursue.

[bustorama]

Everytime you open your mouth....you pursue.

How are we supposed to communicate/validate/be attractive if we don't open our mouths? Or by the "you" here did you mean the things john specifically has been saying?

I understand initiating stuff about R is pursuing, but my understanding of DR is that when we communicate most of it is supposed to be about WAS's feelings, events in day, etc (as opposed to our own)

[john28]

Tonight when she dropped the kid off, I gave her the letting go speech.

The "letting go speech" is pursuing too. Aren't you the one I told to just keep your mouth shut? Everytime you open your mouth....you pursue.

Sandi, I wanted to make it clear to her that I was GAL and working on myself from now on. I plan on not initiating any more R talk for a long time (well, 2 weeks until Retrouvaille). I thought it especially important to give the letting go speech especially before we go to Retrouvialle.

One of her biggest problems with me is that I'm controlling and manipulative in her mind. I squashed all of that tonight by telling her I respected her decisions even though i didn't agree with them, and I wasn't going to try to change her mind anymore. I was letting her make this decision on her own.

I accomplished 3 things tonight within 5 minutes with that speech:
1. Gave the letting go speech. No more pursuing.
2. Validated her concerns by recognizing I was controlling and manipulative and I was no longer going to do that, but let her make her own deicions.
3. Showed her an amazing amount of respect.


Had I not given that speech, she would have pulled away from me because I was pulling away. At first, that is natural. If one pulls away, the other pulls. Then the second person starts to move back to the middle, then crosses over the middle. That's the whole cycle of GAL.

My problem is, I don't have the luxury of months before going to Retrouvaille. I have two weeks. Had I pulled away quickly, she would look at that as hostile. Not respectful. Now, I am able to respectfully give her space and pull away.

[john28]

I'm going to start working on my give/get mentality (from No More Mr. Nice Guy) where I always give something expecting it in return rather than just giving out of love. That's a huge problem with me that I know that I've always struggled with.

I'm signing up to start working for the Food Bank or the Soup Kitchen.

I know that will not only allow me to become more humble since I'm a highly successful businessman, but it will also teach me humility and giving when there is NO way I can get anything in return.

Honestly, I can't wait.

[pinhead]

John,

When you give the "Letting Go" speech, you are still trying to control her. You want her to FEEL that you're going to do the things in the speech. That's why Sandi said you should be quiet. Instead of telling her the speech, show her the actions in the speech.

You and I are both way past the speech. It's time for actions.

[john28]

OH I've got a good one that I didn't mention.

11:30pm last night when I'm having my "party" (she claims) but I'm really just hanging with the guys, I get this txt:

W: Have to remember to bring his blanket here. Otherwise consider getting one for your house and I will keep that one I made it for him. He was sad not to have it tonight.

I almost reponded with "Sorry, I'll remember" but my buddy stopped me and said - "John, seriously? Apologizing? Just tell her that you'll get your own blanket. Throw her off."

Me: Ok. I will get a new blanket and you can keep that one since you made it... I want to make it easy on him.
W: Or just do your best to bring it from now one. Enjoy your night.
Me: No worries, I will get him a new one.
W: OK


She brought it up again today. Said that I just needed to remember to pack it each time. I told her, look, I'm getting another one for him it's not a big deal. She said - Oh you don't have to do that, just remember better next time, it's easy.

I told her I was getting a new one, that she shouldn't worry this.

Completely threw her for a loop. The old John would have turned this into a stupid power struggle - i.e. "Spoon fight"