John, do you want to know what your W is thinking? Then listen to me.....and hear what the mind of a WAW would think. She would think, "OMG! John is so disgusting with his pathetic self and all his crying. He makes me sick! I don't know what I ever saw in him." She would think much more than this and even though these words are harsh...your WAW is thinking even worse.
You are so screwed up right now with all the DB lingo and you don't know one DB principle from the other. You just need to keep your mouth shut and don't say a darn word to her.....except that you think she may be right about the M and single life is looking pretty good to you. I know you won't do it but you should! That is the only thing that is going to get the slightest bit of positive attention from her.
She told you to not distrub her after she went to bed and so when Lotus talks to you about the retreat, you go in at 2:00 a.m. to ask your W if she'd agree to it. That made you look like a little desparate boy. Stop it! Leave her alone!
Quote:
I start to really detach
You've never detached!! You don't know what detaching is...and futhermore, you don't WANT to detach! You don't have the b@lls to detach b/c you want to hang on her skirt-tail and whimper and hope she'll come around. You've got your head so far up her behind that you can't see she's in another A, and you don't want to believe it anyway. She had three that you know about....what's to stop her from having more?
Think about it John....the timeframe of when she left to go to Walmart and "sat" in the car was about the same time that you came home after date-night and she was ready to leave you. She is making her A contact during those times. Her OM was probably dropping her sorry a$$ was why she was so clingly to you after her little meltdown, then something else happened when you left her alone and went out. Didn't you find it odd that she was so "fine" with you leaving her to go out after she'd been on a date with you? Fact is, she knew as soon as you left that freed her up for a contact. Also, she was fine with being transparent with email b/c she doesn't have any to OM....but she asked more than once if you were sure you didn't check her phone (her boundary object). Wake-up John.
BTW, do your crying in the bathroom or the back woods but don't do it in front of your 4 yr old baby boy. He needs to "see" a strong man filling the role of his father.
If you want your son 50% of the time, then go for it. It's the 21st Cen.and why women think they auto get custody is crazy. But it's "you" that is handing her the reigns in all of that.
Don't tell her you are still fighting to save the M. Stop with all that cr@p. Just shut up, stand up, and man up.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
Thank you Sandi. Thank you so much. I know you're right. I know all the advice on here I've gotten is right. But, like most LBS I work from the heart and not the head. That's the trouble with being a LBS.
So, I just gave her the "letting go" robx/gucci speech.
I told her:
"I realize now that you may be right. We may not be able to work this out. You've said the following things to me: You don't want to be with me, You don't love me like you know you should, You aren't attracted to me, You can't live with me anymore, and You don't want to try anymore. I get it. I get it now. You think you would be happier without me. I get it. And, frankly, I know right now that I would be happier without you. I don't want to be with you right now either. But, I've preferred to stay and work on this M and fight for it. Well, that hasn't worked. So, I'm starting to think you're right. So, I'm letting go. I'm letting you completely go because I think you may be right. And whether you stay here or go, I'm still letting go."
Then shutup.
Last edited by john28; 08/21/1005:13 PM.
----"Et tu, Brute?"---- me:28 W:24 S4 T:6 M:4 EA Exposed: 5/21/10 Bomb: 6/20/10 (Father's Day) NC w/ OM: 7/10/10 W moved out 8/21/10 http://bit.ly/aOrZne - My sitch
John. Listen to what Sandi is saying. We've both lost 2 months of our lives in totally unproductive activity. Perhaps we have to go through this pain to get beyond our marriages, but enough is enough for both of us. They're gone. They've checked out months ago. We don't know them anymore, they are not the same as when we married them. We've been clinging to a memory of our loving relationships that probably never existed except in our minds.
Your son needs you. Needs a strong man to show him what it is to be a man. Read Wild at Heart to see how important a good father is to a son.
I don't feel like the letting her go speech had any affect whatsoever. Is it right to feel that? I guess that speech doesn't mean anything if I don't truly let go. I have to if I want any chance to save my M.
PH - we've been together on this every step of the way. It's like we're long lost twins who married the same W. i know we've beenn following each other closely.
Thanks for the support, bro.
----"Et tu, Brute?"---- me:28 W:24 S4 T:6 M:4 EA Exposed: 5/21/10 Bomb: 6/20/10 (Father's Day) NC w/ OM: 7/10/10 W moved out 8/21/10 http://bit.ly/aOrZne - My sitch
To her, they are just words. She's heard so much from you the last two months (and earlier) that they won't sink in. That's why you have to not only say the script, but follow it action wise. I've backtracked 3 times after giving her the script, partially because I've been weak, partially because I've let her control me to keep her soft cushion landing intact.
See the ball, be the ball. Really let go.
If you need inspiration, read Officer In Need's thread, especially the comments by Gucci... It's tough medicine, and very hard to swallow. But you don't have much choice now.
Your advice to John is the absolute BEST advice I have read so far on these forums.
I did exactly what John is doing-during the bomb, and 3-4 times after, I cried, begged, pleaded, etc. I could see in my H's eyes he despised me for being weak. So I finally stopped all that. I started agreeing with everything he said. I treat my H as the stranger/alien he is. How liberating!
Today, H said " you sure seem detached". I just smiled. Inside I am thinking "you are an a-----e! lol. But I smile and agree.I will smile and agree until it makes my face freeze into a permanent smile.
The whole splitting up thing still HURTS, and I have fear of the future, but I won't EVER let H see my vulnerability again. I can tell he is curious that I am so "together" now and there is so much POWER in that. And it's about time all of us LBS remember that, and act on it.
"I need to recognize I need to be myself and be squeaky clean and a role model of health in order for another to recognize there is something wrong with them that needs changing". (detaching website).
The clinging a LBS does prevents the WAS from looking at their own responsibility in the M failure. When we cry, cling, beg, they pity and blame us.
Thank you Sandi. Thank you so much. I know you're right. I know all the advice on here I've gotten is right. But, like most LBS I work from the heart and not the head. That's the trouble with being a LBS.
No, John, that sir is a CHOICE. And the sooner you make it, and start being stronger for your son, the sooner you'll be ready to lead your family thru the shitstorm that just re-landed on your doorstep.
I'll give you 24 hours to wallow. But starting tomorrow, I expect to see you man up and start to work from your HEAD, and NOT your feelings and emotions. Or else no one's going to keep posting to you.
I know you're hurting, but your son needs you right now.
I don't feel like the letting her go speech had any affect whatsoever. Is it right to feel that?
It's like Pinhead said, she has heard so many speeches already that she has you tuned out. IMO, many H's won't give up expecting the WAW to "respond" to the long R talks or speeches, and she isn't going to do it. That is why you will need to start right now practicing to speak to her in one-three word sentences. For example: "Maybe....could be...don't know....we'll see....No....perhaps..." etc. Hold back the temptation of "explaining" your reasons, actions or plans.
Practice being the man you "need" to be--even if you don't "feel" the emotions right now. We all need an image of a better self--in whatever high standard we believe. Don't wait to feel the emotion of detachment....behave, act, pretend that you are. Have an attitude of "I could really care less what you do b/c I am focused on my life and my son". You don't tell her that....you just show the overt behavior as one who thinks it.
So....you need to brace yourself for the worse. Expect anything to happen. I suspect the first test will be you wanting to rescue her from whatever drama she produces. Time for her to put her big girl panties on and realize she's got to be responsible for her own poop and that you aren't cleaning it up any more!
If you truly let go of that rope, then she'll probably stumble and fall several times. Your job is to allow the circumstances that she has created...become the consequences she must endure. It's called "tough love".
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
You are in NC. A no fault divorce requires a year seperation, there is no real thing as legal seperation, and an at fault divorce takes 3 months. If you can get overwhelming evidence of her affairs, NC has the toughest adultery laws around: 3 month at cause divorce, divorce from bed and board (an emergency temporary order to kick her out of the house and typically you keep the kids), no alimony, you can sue OM for alienation of affection. And although it isnt part of the child support calculation, adultery may be considered by the judge when deciding child placement. The problem is getting enough evidence - I think it varies a lot so talk to your lawyer about whether you need evidence of sex or if multiple EAs are enough.
If Sandi is right and she is still having an affair (which was my guess too), look into getting more evidence - like a VAR to catch her on an affair phone or skype. And embarrasing audio played in a court room is certainly good for your case.
If you want to show her you have a backbone and can detatch, dont just agree with her, go on the offensive and hit her with everything. Reality will hit her quickly and you will feel like you are getting control of this which will do a world of good for your emotional strength.
She said, "I have made my mind up. I am going to leave you. I do not want to try anymore. I can not try anymore. I do not want to be married to you anymore."
Hello John,
I just wanted to say with all sincerity, that I'm sorry for what you are going through and just experienced. These words are more crushing than the thought of an Affair IMO. Just so you know, you are not alone and you can be thankful that Sandi2 wrote those words a couple posts up. I too, am suffering this weekend very badly, all the detachment process was going smoothly, but yesterday I woke up so depressed that I called in sick. Now it's Saturday and I've tried everything to pull my head out of my ass and to fight this. Just reading Sandi2's post helped a lot, but I'm going to have to read Robx's approach AGAIN, because I can't find motivation to get out of my funk right now.
I hope you have friends John, because I don't right now. If you do, I strongly advise you use them to get out of the house today and go do something different. Anything! Fight the wallow and accept it. Lord knows, that's what I have to go do. I'm going to read some posts and then go out and do some yard work and probably scare the neighbors while I cry the whole F'n time. But John, we will succeed bud, that which doesn't kill us only makes us stronger. We can do it friend.
