Just catching up on your thread! Congrats. Sounds like you are moving ahead positively. Praying for you that he doesn't duck back in and moves away from the mouth of the tunnel for good and all.
Mila, Cas, CW, SA, and punkin…….thanks for your feedback. I am a bit confused about how to proceed. XH and I clearly still have a special connection but my sense is that XH is afraid of that connection. When we played table tennis last time XH even made some kind of comment about balls in his pocket (pretty sure he was referring to the warm, soft kind) and made eye contact with me. I was a bit slow on the uptake so didn’t follow up with a comment.
After our fun times recently, XH has hopped into his car and “run away”. He e-mailed me, and copied his sister, a long e-mail on Friday talking about an interaction with his mother and his frustration that she can’t remember. I waited until last night and replied to him in kind (to him only, didn’t CC X-SIL). He replied today: “Hey....Thanks for your thoughts & observations on mom. I know there will be ups & downs with mom.... Like us all! I am heading North on Sat till Friday... Vaca & business trip. FYI………….(and a couple house-keeping things)………..Mr. GAG”. When I got this email I thought two things: (1)XH signed his full name, rather than his first initial (signing emails with only the 1st letter of our names was an affectionate thing he and I did --- I started signing my full name after the D; XH signed his full name for about 4 months after the bomb, but then resumed signing with the 1st letter almost always) and (2) this will be the 3rd extended work/recreational trip that I am aware of in the last month. This makes me suspicious that he is going out of town with an OW because this was something that he and I did early in our R and I know he has done this in other R’s too. I am puzzled because these trips would have been planned before or during the last 2 months when things began warming up between us.
This development (my suspicions about an OW) is juxtaposed with a very, very strong sense and a peacefulness on Saturday evening, that XH would be coming home in the future. This is the 2nd time that I have had such a strong intuitive sense in my situation. The first time was in March when I sensed that XH and his BMF (very BAD influence) were not on speaking terms. Four months later XH told me that he and BMF hadn’t been speaking………….I don’t normally have strong feelings like this, so who knows? But faith and grace have gotten me this far and I will rely on them to lead me forward.
I spoke with Jody on Saturday and want to summarize her thoughts here, but a college friend is visiting on business for a couple days and will be arriving at my house shortly. So I will post this now and return with Jody’s perspective when I have a chance.
Well that is interesting. You are legally divorced. How would that change what you are thinking?
It would mean that he is still in replay. I would keep watching and listening to see if your intuition is correct. You could be wrong. But maybe not. Don't rush to judgement until you have the facts.
'Running away' after time together is something i can relate to. H and I have an uneasiness when we first meet up again and then on departure. It's awkward.
Like Mr GAG, my H is inconsistent in many things. He has just started to use my name in email correspondence. I think he senses when he lets himself get too close and he backs off. Perhaps your XH is doing that too and that's why he has reverted to the more formal sign off.
Hope that peaceful feeling remains. Like your intuition!
So................I chatted with Jody on Saturday morning. She said that XH’s behavior over the past month has shown movement toward me. She advised that in order to test the waters of friendship with XH I needed to open up to him more (this is consistent with Schnarch’s recommendations for improving intimacy). She asked me to think about what important things were going on in my life right now. I replied that I have had a turbulent 6 months at work that has caused financial stress for me, but that as I understand DBing principles, if I talk to XH about this it will likely impose guilt (I left a very busy career for my current job because H/XH felt neglected because of my work schedule). Jody said that I can communicate this to XH in a guilt-free way. She suggested something like this: “New jobs all have stress. We always uncover some potholes, and boy am I finding out that there are some big black holes! I need a vacation. I’m trying to think about what short-term trips I can take”. She said I should let him know that I’m human too, but I’m dealing with my problem. She suggested that I collect some travel brochures and leave them out when he stops by. This will create an opportunity to talk to XH about my work sitch and talk about my planned solution (i.e. fun mini-vacation) with XH. She said to tell him “I’d like to pick your brain about this”. In summary, disclosing information from my personal life will increase intimacy, but when I present this info, rather than focusing on the problem I should talk about creative solutions (i.e. planning a mini-vacation, rather than b****ing).
I shared with Jody that I wondered if XH was waiting for me to make the first move forward (wrote about this on my thread awhile back). She said that in her experience counseling individuals, that men are only slightly more assertive than women in sexual Rs. This is different than what is typically described in books on this topic. She said that having so many in women enter the workforce over the last 40 years has really changed the landscape in this regard and she thinks that books on M and Rs haven’t really caught up with this trend.
I told Jody that XH and I had a great time last week playing table tennis with a Chinese couple who didn’t speak English. Told her that the Chinese man had asked XH if I was his wife and that XH had commented on this at the end of the evening. XH said he didn’t quite know how to explain out situation to the Chinese man. Jody said this episode created an opportunity for me. She said that the fact that XH and I have a friendly R, even though we are D’ed, lies outside of social norms. She said that not being XH’s W creates a scenario where “we are so sophisticated that our R can’t be described”. “There is not a word that describes the nature of our R”. She said that I should go back and revisit this comment with XH by saying something like this: “I was thinking the other day about what you said about not knowing how to describe our R to the Chinese man….and realized that we don’t have to worry about what other people think about our R. There isn’t really a word to describe the kind of R we have because very few people are able to have the kind of R that we have. We’re living our own lives for ourselves, not for other people” (I will have to think about how to phrase this a bit more, but this was the gist.) This convo will help to relieve XH’s guilt and frame our current R in a new light.
Then I asked Jody if I should be trying to move our R into the next stage: Romance? (Early in coaching Jody outlined 4 stages of DB: (1) Reducing the negative climate of the R, (2) Friendship, (3) Romance/Dating, and (4) Reconciliation (understanding what your new covenant is)). She said that it is time to ramp up romantic energy, but that sexual overtones need to be seen as only a small part of romance. She said that I should now set my sights on moving into the Romance stage. She defined romance as “the security of knowing your feelings are reciprocated” --- “being in love and feeling in love”. This was interesting, because when I initially heard the 4 stages outlined, I envisioned the Romance stage as just dating……..but what she described was much different that what I had been thinking, so it was good to have that clarified. She said that $ex can occur in any of the 4 stages but it is important to know what feeling to attach to it when it occurs.
At the end of the conversation, Jody said that I had gotten to this point with XH because of my PATIENCE. Thought this was an important reminder to everyone AND myself.
………This session was encouraging, ……..but as I wrote earlier this week, finding out that XH is going away for a week for vacay and out of town work has made me wonder if there is a new OW. I e-mailed a bit with XH today, but still not sure………..so I will detach again, be patient, and think about how it might change my view if XH is involved with an OW now, 9 months post-D.
Hope this post provides food for thought for others.
GAG
Last edited by goodattitudegirl; 08/19/1004:16 AM.
I would keep watching and listening to see if your intuition is correct. You could be wrong. But maybe not. Don't rush to judgement until you have the facts.
Lance, very good advice, as always. Your feedback is always valued.
Originally Posted By: seeking answers
I read somewhere that during this crisis the LBS gets even more intuitive about the sitch. I have certainly found that to be true.
Keep listening to your gut instincts!
SA, thank you!!!!!!! This comment gives me direction. Much appreciated as always!
Originally Posted By: courageous wife
Like Mr GAG, my H is inconsistent in many things. He has just started to use my name in email correspondence. I think he senses when he lets himself get too close and he backs off. Perhaps your XH is doing that too and that's why he has reverted to the more formal sign off.
CW, thank you for sharing this! I think my XH has turned back toward the tunnel for a bit, so I appreciate your reminder a LOT! It's weird because XH had to be planning all of these trips while he was moving closer to me. I have a feeling that in time all will be revealed.
I do not know whether your EXH is in another R or not. However what I will say, is that we do have to keep our expectations at zero, and although you have this intuition, it is also somewhat an expectation. I think if he does have an OW it will become obvious as time goes along. However it does not mean that he is not peeking out of the tunnel looking at you! You must remain a safe place for him to land.
Jody gave you some good ideas. See how they turn out. I think it is good that you wrote them down here since you will be less likely to forget what was said, plus it reinforces the ideas.
I think that you are doing fine and paving the way back to you.
