I'm more of an Aerosmith, AC/DC type of girl myself. Just had a crush on Michael Bolton back when he had hair. That's been the hardest part for me. We've shared 20 years of memeories, and it's like he's just forgotten all of them. I guess we both stopped being playful when we got so busy with life. I was working 10 hour days and he was building his career in the Army. Now, our entire family is coming apart at the seams, and everything is in ashes. At least that's the way it feels sometimes.
I must admit the AC/DC and Metallica helped fuel some vicious workouts to prevent me from doing something stupid to OM. Not sure Michael Bolton would have helped me much. On the flipside, I've found the dang tunes too often evocative of my time together with W. Ever notice how the lyrics start to pop out of songs you've heard many times before - reminding you of how you've been hurt or the times you spent together. Weird. Life events have definitely conspired against us. We are blessed to have the beautiful kids we have. I hope she sees that our challenges are not insurmountable. We've accomplished much together, but she too has shown the ability to burn it all down. Stay positive. I hope you find that beer - just one, well maybe two. Cheers!
M / W: 43 D8 S6 M 10 years / T 13 years W admitted EA/PA: 10.6.09 Separated in same house 10.6.09 W moved out 2.27.10
Didn't find any beer. Went to bed about 9:30 and woke up to an email from H telling me I could drop the games. Huh? What planet is he dialing from? Snodderly suggests that he is Paranoid, and that is truth.
Sometimes, it's just hard to sit down and keep my mouth shut. Well, honestly, all the time it's hard to shut up.
I have been thinking about your sitch today for a many different reasons, and while a majority of us are dealing with infidelity it does not make us all the same and therefore one approach may not fit the everyone's situation.
Typically, until the affair is busted/ends you really can't work on the marriage. This is true of MLC or WAS, you lay down a boundary to protect yourself and your family and wait it out. Your sitch is different in that you had a one night stand (ONS). Your W has gotten a little taste of her own medicine, doesn't make it right but it communicated to her that you certainly do not have to wait around on her to come around. You are in the in the position that she is in an ongoing A and has not stopped but is open to working on the M or at least it would seem that way.
Originally Posted By: crushednstuck
W's lease in ending and she is entertaining the idea of coming back and I told her that I couldn't allow her to keep seeing OM because its a boundary. She didn't scream and yell. She agreed.
So what to do from here???
Your W agrees that the A would need to end, I don't think you need to stop all the friendly contact with her until her affair ends but it would need to end at some point if the A doesn't stop. You are having good interactions with her and she is considering coming back to the house. I am not suggesting this as a long term effort but given your A, that changes things a bit.
I like that you guys are in counseling......but your marriage counselor SUCKS BIG TIME!!!!!!!
I would suggest doing some research on a counselor that is a MARRIAGE counselor and the MARRIAGE is the patient, not the two individuals. They are hard to find.
If she will not change counselors I am not sure about continuing to go to this counselor, but on the otherhand if you guys can talk about things with a "referee" then continuing to go might be better than no counseling at all.
If you guys go back to the MC that sucks you may want to give the Counselor and your W a copy of this excerpt from Penny Tupy, This was posted on another thread by Puppy back in January and I really liked the analogy. I would not give this to your W outside of MC, it might come across as controlling.
Holes in the Roof
Penny R. Tupy June 2004
I love houses. Always have. A favorite weekend recreation is to tour the semi annual parade of homes or to check out the newest open models in the upscale developments around the area. During my thirties I was an avid member of the National Trust for Historic Preservation; my fun reading was made up of publications such as "Early American Life" and "Preservation." I've lived in an old house, built at the turn of the last century, and in an historic house of a modern sort – built in the `40's with design elements which were decades ahead of their time. For several years I had a recreational decorating and design business. I helped restore a Victorian, once facing condemnation, to near museum quality standards. I've painted concrete floors to look like marble, designed my kitchen from the walls out, and made strategic suggestions for the structural elements of our current state of remodel. I love houses. And in fact, when I travel to other parts of the country I am far more likely to photograph the residential architecture than I am to record the family on vacation. (Much to the chagrin of my children in later years..)
So, what does this have to do with marriage? Well, I live in the upper Midwest where Mother Nature mesmerizes us with thunderstorms, floods, and tornadoes this time of year. Not long ago I watched a newscast about a house that was damaged when a tree came through the roof of a house in one of our many storms. (The man sleeping just under the spot where the tree entered the house was unharmed but definitely shaken!) It got me thinking about the correlation between marriage and houses.
A marriage is much like a house. When it's new, everything is well kept. It's clean. The roof is good, the plumbing works well, the floors are level and unscathed. But inevitably, over time, things begin to break down. If one owns an older or historic home there are always things which clamor for attention – similar to a marriage that's been neglected or damaged by thoughtless choices, independent living and outright harmful actions. A marriage in trouble is much like a house needing significant repair.
It could be that the plumbing needs to updated, the wiring changed from old glass fuses to code compliant breakers, the walls may be cracked and the floors might need to be shorn up to make them level again. A marriage may have issues and conflicts surrounding in-laws, money, sex, child rearing, hobbies, or even pets. Like a house that needs significant work, those things need to be addressed in small steps, with thoughtful planning and oodles of frustrating starts and stops.
But what happens when a storm sends a tree crashing through the roof? No matter what the state of the home prior to that event, all work needs to stop and energies must be redirected toward emergency repair. The tree needs to be carefully removed, the roof repaired and any other structural damage investigated and repaired before work can resume on the pre-existing conditions.
This is exactly the same dynamic that occurs in marriage when there is infidelity. The marriage may need serious repair work in and of itself. But once an affair sends a tree crashing through the sheltering structure of the relationship all efforts directed at the underlying problems take a back seat to the emergency measures brought about by the affair itself. There's no point in attempting to fix the cracked walls and outdated electricity in the marriage when there is a tree protruding into the bedroom and the inner structure is exposed to the elements.
The affair partner must be completely and permanently removed from the relationship in the same way the tree must be removed from the roof. It's a horribly difficult and painful process. Often the affair partner has been a long time friend of one or both spouses. The loss of the friendship and the betrayal that is felt is heart wrenching, no matter what leg of the triangle one is on. But a friendship that has intruded into the intimate structure of a marriage can no longer be considered a friendship. Boundaries have been breached, and there is no way to return to a state of innocence. None of the needed repair work to the marriage can begin until this step is complete. Intermittently ending and resuming contact with an affair partner creates the same kind of damage as picking the tree up off the roof and dropping it back on again – it creates larger holes and more damage.
Once the affair partner is no longer in the picture, the hard work of repair can begin. First and foremost the gaping holes left by the affair must be mended. Depending on the length of the affair and how far into the emotional bonding of the marriage the affair partner was allowed to intrude, repair work could be replacement of the entire roof or simply a minimal patch job. The longer the affair, with the marriage being exposed to the damage of wind and rain, the more repair will be needed. The holes left by infidelity are things such as damaged trust, resentment, the inevitable withdrawal felt by the straying spouse when the affair ends, and stress on the underlying structure of the marriage.
Marriages rarely end in divorce due to the affair itself. But failure to repair the damage from the affair will almost without fail lead to complete destruction of the marriage. Marriages end because there the gaping holes remaining which continue to expose the relationship to more harm. Some couples can do the repair work themselves. These are the calmly methodical sorts who can read about the necessary measures and implement them in without becoming bogged down in the emotional tug of war recovery always entails. For most couples, as with homeowners, hiring a professional is indispensable in making sure the repairs are done well and in a timely manner.
As the holes are patched, the shingles replaced, and the structure found to be intact attention can once again be turned to the problems which existed before the tree made its untimely entrance into the lives of the homeowners. Those issues and conflicts may have become larger or more serious because of the damaged caused either directly or indirectly by the crisis of the storm – that's the nature of destructive events; they have far reaching consequences. Time, patience, persistence, and good professional help can make all the difference in repairing a storm damaged home or healing a marriage torn apart by an affair.
Oh and BTW, your posts aren't too long, LOL.....this one is long.
Formerly "missherlove"
Me49 XW49 M17 T19 S16 D20
Expose yourself to your deepest fear; after that, fear has no power, and the fear of freedom shrinks and vanishes. You are free.
OK brother, I appreciate the thought given to my sitch. I did not go headlong into showing my W who was boss, but I definitely had the defenses down. I've been on numerous other trips out of the country with plenty of opportunity to cheat, but held my marriage as sacred, plus I was always scared of my own guilt. After the fling, I was mortified but oddly satisfied that I could "pull" without paying. I'm not an ogre but I guess needed my resources verified on some subliminal level. I feel that nothing I could have done during my M would justify her A (short of physical or mental abuse). Yet she seems content vilifying me for my shortcomings on projects around the house. I've taken on large projects to improve our home, but at times, they've taken a while as I've learned while doing. Your analogy to the home definitely applies here as this was the first home we built together. I sold my condo to move into her house (previously occupied by her 1st H) and tried to make it ours. The new home we built created opportunity yet it complicated things as my son was on the way and we needed to make quick, uninvolved improvement. She was not much help, but imagined she was. I painted, patched, tiled, wired and landscaped my way to unrecognized completion. She complained and cajoled. As your quote mentions, it's time to remove the tree. I'd love to take a chain saw to it, both figuratively and literally (ala Scarface) but I know that only provides sympathy for douche. The MC doesn't immediately seem to be helpful as I'm not hearing "solution-based" results, but I'm delighted she's even there. However, we've agreed (initially) to limit discussions to how we got where we are. Of course, this allows her to maintain her A. Eventhough the MC rightly notes that no progress can be made until the terms are agreed upon. I'm stuck yet again. However, we are closer than before. Her distrust of me means that any moment apart now means I'm with another and always have been. Her tracking my phone and researching that I've (only spoken) with women ironicallly younger and fitter than her further frustrates her. I've only met them through my GAL efforts at the gym. I've not entertained another relationship, only cultivating new friendships. This is no consolation to her of course. She's angry and always has been. I've no idea how to get her over her anger. Rambling, sorry....
M / W: 43 D8 S6 M 10 years / T 13 years W admitted EA/PA: 10.6.09 Separated in same house 10.6.09 W moved out 2.27.10
Grit beat me to it but I was thinking exactly the same thing when I read your post.
This is not something you can control. She will either come out of it or she won't. You must let go and let her work this out by herself.
Grit talks about working on yourself because no matter what, YOU are the only one that you have any control of.
We all need to learn what is happening to our MLC spouses. But we have no control of it. At least not in the first three stages. During rebuilding, there is a little more, but lets not discuss that right now.
The only thing that we can control in the first three stages is to step back and leave her alone. That is your prime mission. The single most important thing. Detachment.
How ya doin this fine morning? I'm not gong to swing any 2 x 4's at you, because, like me, I know you already know these things for yourself, you just need to have them repeated to you and re-enforced in your mind sometimes to keep from going crazy. The analogy about the house was great MHL. Grit speaks the truth, we can only control ourselves, as hard as that may be. Ever think how a married couple begins to work as One. Each with input and responsiblity. Suddenly, half of the equation goes off the deep end, and neither cares or wants your input or opinion.
Definitely tough on the ego and self respect, but somehow we get through it. You are not asking any questions or feeling any feelings we don't all feel/ask at some point. You are doing great.
I've been meaning to reply to you since you posted on my thread. Sounds like you are a serious biker! What kind of bike do you have? If you have any good pointers for increasing my biking performance, please feel free to share on my thread. Love biking but I have a lot to learn! I have a photo of my new bike in the alt. I was professionally measured to choose the bike and then had the bike customized a bit. The changes that were made made a huge difference in my enjoyment with riding.
Grit, Lance, and punkin have given you excellent direction: detach. One thing that I did when I detached was to begin learning about what makes marriages successful. This made me feel like I was moving in a positive direction for myself and my future while I was detached and allowing H/XH to find his way. I felt that the information I learned would be useful whether or not I reconciled with XH.
Here are some useful links with good information: --www.smartmarriages.com/index.html --www.drbilldoherty.org/
This is a directory of pro-marriage therapists: --www.marriagefriendlytherapists.com/
The book "Intimacy and Desire" by David Schnarch gave me a paradigm for how to build a healthy relationship. I really like the way Schnarch talks about how conflict is normal in relationships and helps to build intimacy when we respond to it in the right way.
GAG
Last edited by goodattitudegirl; 08/14/1002:51 PM.
CNS, I had to post to you cause I feel for you man! Projects around the house. Could not get them done fast enough huh? What is wrong with you? (I am just kidding here)
Bet you did not do them right either.
Realize that the MLC started way before you saw symptoms.
No matter how hard you worked on those projects it was never enough.
That my friend is key. When someone is never happy, never satisfied and makes demands of you, that is not love anymore.
One of her love languages is Acts of Service. You did these things out of love for her and for your own satisfaction too. You get a feeling of accomplishment and put your heart in to it even if it was not something you wanted to do. You convinced yourself that it will make her happy and that will make you happy too. Nothing wrong with that. Been there, done that.
The beast of MLC will kill this in you if you let it. I am talking about the resentment you feel.
Now is where you have to realize that it was not you or your shortcomings in these projects. The MLC'r has to find something to pin on you to justify their horrible actions.
Your new project is: To listen to what grit and lance are saying. The more you get this, the more all of this makes sense. Keep reading and reading.
Be careful of falling into the "If I only could finish this project or two, maybe she will come back" This will grow resentment when she does not give you the appreciation back. She can't and won't in the life form she is in right now.
It was never about the projects. You know it and I know it too.
