New to this Community seeking advice

[fade]

Im certainly no vet so take my advice with a grain of salt, but it strikes me as completely unreasonable how your wife controls and limits access to your sons. I understand that your past anger caused her to be afraid for her and possibly your son's safety, but she is obviously no longer really concerned about their safety if she lets you take them back home without her for an extended visit. I think it is obviously a power play by her and your sons are the pawns. I recall that she did this before where she only let you see them for a very short period for no good reason. I would not stand for this. She gave in about Saturday only because the boys are with you and there is not much she can do about it, but I bet that she will seek revenge by trying to limit access to them in the future. If she tries to instigate a fight about the extra day, or later this issue comes up again I think you need to tell her, calmly, that you want (as is your right) to see your sons more, that they need to see their father more, and that it is unacceptable for her to hold this over you. She really does not have any real power here - you can force visitation through legal means if necessary. The only power she has over this issue is what you give her. Her power is that she can decide if SHE will see or speak to you. You should make sure she knows that you will respect her wishes on what she wants to do with her own life, but it really isnt for her to say whether you can or cant see your own sons.

That said, I think you should do all you can to help her out with the car. If she is driving around with your sons in a car that wont start or stalls, that is unacceptable and unsafe. Despite everything, you are still her husband and their father. You love them and ensuring their safety is the most important responsibility you have. Either switch cars this weekend or get her another car. And while you can offer to help her go car shopping or something, dont let her think that you are looking for some sort of attention reward for this - you are doing this because she deserves a decent car and you want them to be safe.

As for the respect thing, I dont really know if that is applicable for you. It seems that your wife left because she feared you, not because she thought you were an unattractive, conflict avoidant, spineless beta male. Stand up for your rights, set reasonable boundaries concerning things that directly affect you (finances, child contact etc.), but I would try to do so in a gentle, loving manner and always explain that your motivation is one of care, not control.

[pinhead]

I've been thinking more about this...The boys saw me stick up for that extra day with them. I think it's good they saw me do that.

In the great scheme of things, what's an extra day anyways, right? Maybe it's a power struggle with my W, a chance to test me and see if I have changed...who knows...

But in the eyes of my boys, I fought for that extra day and got it. The fact that we get to be together for one extra full day is important in their eyes. That's what matters most in the end.

Someone said on this forum that you have to win the respect of your WAS by standing your ground and not appear weak. Is this what we are talking about here? It's a fine line to show my w that I have changed by not fighting her on every point,and, standing my ground to get an extra day with my boys...

JR

Boys learn how to act from their fathers. If they see a doormat, they'll end up like doormats. You did the right thing, for the right reasons. Two thumbs up.

[JR09]

Thanks, Fade

Great wisdom all around. I agree with all the powerplay issue. It's unfortunate but it sounds accurate.

So far soo good. I had a great time with the boys and am prepping for the long trip back for the hand-off. W called the boys yesterday to check on them and tell them all about their new class schedules in school. That's good stuff. I'm glad she is on top of their schooling.

Anyway, more to follow this weekend...Stand by for news.

JR

[JR09]

Thanks Pinhead,

I stuck to the extra day and the boys are really happy about it too. W called yesterday to check on the boys. S12 said she didn't sound upset at all and was fine with the SAT hand-off.

Maybe she realized it wasn't a big deal after all. What's an extra day with Dad, right? Common sense prevailed. That's the good news.

Thanks again, Pinhead.

JR

[JR09]

I just returned from dropping off the boys 600 miles from here. We had a great drive and a great last evening. Lots of memories made. I felt alive. It was just great.

Linked up with W and did the hand-off. I asked W if she had a few minutes to talk. She agreed. This is a first. Usually W loads the boys' bags and leaves right away...While the boys unloaded their bags, W and I talked for about 20 min. I probably broke some DB/DR rules in the process. I told W the boys needed a father and I needed them. I also told her I needed her too. I told her I took responsibility for everything that caused W to leave, and asked for her forgiveness. I told her I wasn't the man I used to be 2 years ago.

W said she still has trust issues and doesn't believe that I changed. She repeated the arguments that brought her to leave: she is afraid to come back because she doesn't feel I am a changed man. She even said she's always afraid to leave the boys with me, even for this trip ( I tend to not believe that part...she KNOWS the boys are 100% safe with me and we always have a great time together for the past 2 years)

W said her and the boys are happier now that we are separated because there is no argument.

W said she is afraid to walk on eggs and fears that I'd yell at her or the boys for no reason. I agreed with her and acknowledged what she said. She said she is tired of my not listening to her, doing everything that I wanted, never doing what she wanted. She said I never did anything with the boys. She resents the fact that my career always came before the family. I agreed with EVERYTHING she said and restated it all to her. I told her I GET IT, I GET IT ALL, and I am sorry I didn't do enough to treat her with respect during all these years.

I then told her I was NOT that man anymore. I told her I don't know how else to prove her that I am a completely different man, but that I am not the man she left 2 years ago. She said she also changed in the last 2 years and said she won't come back. She said each time she thinks about coming back, she always cries because she is afraid she will make the wrong decision.

She said her biggest issue is trusting me again. W then said she had to go while she was crying, and made her way back to her car. Then I said my final goodbyes to the boys as I gave each one long hugs and lots of kisses. W waited in the car, watching all along.W also talked to me with her sunglasses on...She cried while she spoke all along.

After she drove away with the boys, I was crushed. But then I remembered the rule to " not believe anything she says, and only believe half of what I see". During the entire conversation, W never brought up the issue of divorce, or refiling for divorce.
I never countered anything she said to prove my point. I just listened, and she carefully listened to me as well when I spoke. She did nod her head several times when I restated what she said.

Anyway. She really didn't mention anything new for the past 2 years. I feel she needed to re-justify being separated by mentioning everything I didn't do with her and the boys. But that was 2 years ago...For some reason I feel it was a good exchange, a chance for me to tell her face to face what I've had on my mind for a long time, and a chance for her to tell me what she thought without yelling or hanging up on me. I have to say she broke contact first because she was getting very emotional.

That's it. I am crushed because I saw the boys' face look at me as they drove away. But for some reason, I feel good about this exchange mainly because W agreed to talk face to face, never mentioned divorce, and really didn't mention anything new. But she had a chance to seize me up, see the "changed" JR, even agree with my restatements, and see how much I am close to the boys.

JR

[MichelleLT]

Sorry I've been off the boards. Had annual training.

Glad you had a good time with the boys. And glad you got the extra day.

Interesting conversation. The things you noticed are definitely positives.

I agree that the car is a legitimate expense and important for the boys. I can't remember how much money she has access to each month, but if she has extra maybe you guys can work something out where it goes on the credit card and then you give her $50 less a month to pay it off or some such? Otherwise, probably just need to pay for it and get it done.

[JR09]

Michelle,

What's your take on the conversation? What's interesting about it? Just curious how you'd read into it...

JR

[MichelleLT]

I find it interesting that she hasn't gone back to her "I'm filing for D any day now" routine. Could be positive.

Mostly I'm just trying to figure out what specifically her hang-up is. I know she said trusting you. Trusting that you have changed for the better I'm assuming. I'm curious what it would take for her to start trusting you again.

Trust is built on risks. You have to be a little vulnerable with someone, to ask them for help, to rely on them for something and then have them come through for you. If you are never vulnerable with someone you never build a stronger R and build trust. On the flip side, if you are forced to rely on someone, you build a very strong R very quickly - you see it in the military very often (course, it's also good for finding out who the scammers are LOL).

Maybe you should just ask her what things would help rebuild her trust.

I kind of suspect that she doesn't really know.

But, on the other hand, you taking the kids for an extended period away from her was definitely an act of trust. And you of course took care of the kids and had a blast. And I'm sure she'll be happy that you remembered the medication schedule, which in her mind probably is a great example of responsibility and trustworthiness.

I definitely see all of that as positive.

Give it time. See what happens in the next couple weeks.

Keep focusing on the kids. Try and keep building the friendly R with her when you can. And give it time.

Be prepared in case she withdraws for a little bit. Also be prepared that she may soften. It's always hard to tell.

But you have as long as you are willing to wait.

[JR09]

Michelle,

My W is afraid that I would resume my anger outbursts towards her or the boys. It is true I used to be like that after I came back from Iraq. It did put a heavy emotional toll on my W and children.

When we linked up last SAT, that was my W's main concern with the trust issue. How can she be sure that I don't behave that way anymore? I only told her I am not the man I used to be two years ago. But it seems she still harbors mistrust feelings and still feels unsafe to return. That's what she's been saying two years ago. And I get that. It's fully understandable.

I also know she probably overcame some of these mistrust issues since she's allowed me to be with the boys at least six times in the past two years. And she even allowed me to take the boys all the way back to CO last week...Maybe she was testing me...troubleshooting if I would explode again...I never did. Always kept my cool throughout the conversation...

JR

[JR09]

Called the boys this evening to say Hi. They seem to be back in their routine which is good. School resumes next week. They don't talk as much as when they were here last week. Just a few words. Maybe they feel awkward. They don't know what to say. Who knows. Maybe they don't want to say too much because W is right there next to them...

I did talk to W as well and asked how she was doing. After inquiring about her parents, I told her I want to be a better parent. She said the boys were mad at her because they blame her for not wanting to come back and be a family again. W was pretty upset about that. I didn't say much. W said she needed to go, so I said goodbye. So did she.

JR