Not sure where to start, or end. WAW?

[john28]

Thanks for the 2x4's guys - I need them to wack me back into shape. I went 5 days before she came home being non-needy, not contolling, or anything. The moment she comes back I forget all that I have somewhat learned and tried to execute.

It's a pattern with us though, and I should have expected this. Every single time she comes back from a trip, that night we have a fight. ALWAYS. It's like a written script, I should have remembered that.

Woke up this morning, left her in bed. She shortly came out afterwards and was a little snuggly on the cough, put her feet up on me while I surfed the inet.

As far as getting her those small things, I don't think it's a big deal. In the past one of my things was I only thought about myself. She always hated that, pointed it out all the time. I said nothing about the toothpaste, S4's new toothbrush, some shampoo. She said nothing either. I just know she noticed, that's all. If she brings it up, I'll say "It's just something I wanted to do." and leave it at that.

This morning she noticed the mirror I had hung on the back of our door, and she said, "Where did you get that?" I told her I picked it up last week. Nothing more. She said, "I've been wanting one forever!"

She's an acts of service and quality time LL person. I'm not cramming it down her face - I'm just plotting along doing some of those things and saying NOTHING about them and seeking no validation. And honestly, it makes me feel good. It makes me feel like the "good" John, which I like.

Anyways - thanks for the 2x4's. I'm not going to let her control me or my emotions this weekend. I'm just going to do my thing, do what I need to do to avoid all R talks, and employ some of those sentences that Puppy gave me if the R talk is broached by her.

Thanks guys - I needed a kick in the nuts.

[john28]

And you guys are right about letting her go. The thing is, I know if I let her go, she'll come back to me and the M. So stupidly, since I know that, I act "as if" she's already back in it. What an idiot.

[john28]

Wow. Just caught myself before I did something stupid. If I hadn't read this just now I would have made a critical mistake. She is napping in bed right now and I thought about going in there and getting in bed with her.

Seriously, my mind is really F'd up right now that I would think to do that.

[pinhead]

John, we're both jacked up right now. I passed on going with the W and kids to the local waterpark, because I needed air after our talk.

Go out. Go to a hardware store, ogle wrenches. Go to the batting cages and beat the crap out of some balls.

Don't screw up anything more.

[sandi2]

Your W is very young and immature and still playing her games with you. It will take her time growing up and learning how adult R's work. She is very insecure and that is why she keeps asking so many questions. She may also think you are guilty of doing something...b/c she was guilty.

She will need you to be a strong leader for your family. She needs you to put her in her place when she's out of line. She needs you to call her out on bad behavior. She needs you to stand up to her instead of letting her walk on you.

I don't think you were able to get the idea of being mysterous b/c you had too much stuff on the brain. We were trying to tell you of one way that would make you appear more "interesting". It's not necessarily to make her jealous...but just to make her curious. But here's the thing, she works you and she gets you to answer too many questions.

Learn this lesson: You are not required to give an answer to every question. My H was the author of that lesson! All he had to do was just look at me...without saying a word. Sometime he would raise one eyebrow, sometimes he would just grin, or he may have an angry look or a look I couldn't read...but say nothing. He refused to answer. How do you fight with something like that? Yes, I would get angry, but I did not "win" at being angry and I sure didn't control him. He showed me that he was in control by saying nothing. See what I mean?

Then realize something else. She has, and will continue, to turn the tables around in this R to make you feel that you have to prove that you can be trusted. Hey....it wasn't you that had the A! Women are good at doing that little game, too. She is the one that needs to prove she can be trusted. You fell into that trap. She is making it sound like a two-way street....and ordinarily it would be, but the first thing you know...she's making it appear that YOU were the bad guy....not her. She has you on your knees trying to make up with her. Trying to make her happy, apologizing, etc. It's kind of strange that she was unfaithful but she wants to get you into all this open R, trust, transparency, etc. Don't misunderstand what I'm trying to say. It's just that she'll get the spotlight off her and put it onto you.

Be your own man. Do what you want to do and don't feel that you must ask her permission. I'm not telling you to be disrespectful in any way but I'm trying to get you out of this mind-set you're in.

Hopefully, you will have many years of M with this young woman. However, you need to break some of these patterns that she's setting. Why does she fight with you after a trip? Why is there a big blow-up every six months? Stop the pattern.

[john28]

Thanks Sandi. I do understand that she is young, and to be frank very immature. When it comes to serious R talk, she just says, "I'm not going to talk about this", particularily when it comes to something that SHE needs to do to repair this M. She has made NO effort to repair what she has done. Nothing. Instead, she turns the tables on me and trys to make me feel bad for asking for transparency - saying I'm being "controlling" and "like her father". I validate her feelings, and then tell her that I don't want to control her, that's her choice if she's transparent.

Which, by the way, she isn't being transparent anymore. When she gave me her email and FB passwords, I wanted to see if she was still talking to OM, so I tried to logon to her phone account online. Didn't have that pwd, so I reset it, and it emailed her. I got the email, read it - changed the pwd, logged into the phone account, didn't see anything. Well, she got a txt msg on her phone that her password had been changed. She said i violated her trust after she gave me the passwords, and was trying to control her by snooping into her phone account. She then changed the passwords. This was a week ago.

So, I've asked her several times since then if she would be willing to be transparent again, each time she responds with - "I'll think about it." When she was transparent, it felt GREAT... I could back off in confidence knowing that she wasn't doing anything behind my back. It was easy to back off then. But now, it's hard.

[pinhead]

John, re-read your entire thread. See the progress? See the miss-steps? They're all there for us. We just have to be able to step outside of the bubble and see what's really going on.

We can do this...

[john28]

Well, today has been OK i guess.

Morning went OK, did some things around the house, nothing exciting. Just pleasantries.

Well, this is where it gets weird. She is complaining about something with her shaving or something, and I suggest that she go back to waxing. Long story short - she ends up fully nude in front of me and asks me to help her wax (i usually do). Mind you, in the past 6 weeks she's been shy about being naked - things like turning her back to me when she's changing her top, putting on pants in bed... stuff like that.

Well, she got fully nude in front of me today.

Guys, I somehow managed to keep it together without pouncing on top of my wife and making a huge mistake.

But I have to say, that was pretty f*ing hard.

Well, after that I had some things to do around the house, had to run some errands. I went and did my thing. Came back, played with S4, put him down for a nap, and she said she was goinig out shopping.

She calls me from the store and says, "I need you to shop for me, I can't do it." In the past she has asked me to shop for her because I have good taste in clothing, and she always likes what I pick out. So, she comes right back home and says we'll go later together to shop. We played some cards for awhile, took a nap, read a little, shared a few good kisses in the interim. After her nap she wakes up and comes into the living room and I asked if she was ready to go shop, she said... "Would go please go for me?" in a puppy dog voice/look. So, I take this as she's trying to include me in doing an act of service for her - I say of course, I'd love to.

I went and shopped for her, and of course she LOVED what I bought her. She tried it on immidiately... again, in front of me, no inhibitions this time either.

We were cleaning tonight and she brought me a hair tie from our room, handed it to me. I asked her, "Huh, what's this?" She said, "Well, it's not mine." I told her it's not mine either, and just walked away. I wanted to launch into a HOW DARE YOU ACCUSE ME... yada yada... but held it together and walked away. I know what she was trying to do - lure me into R talk and make me feel like I CAN'T BE TRUSTED. No ma'am. Later she came up to me and asked who's it was. I told her, "It's yours." She said no, it isn't. "Then it must be one of your sisters." I said, and just shut her down. Again, she tried to pick a fight and I deflect it. It felt REALLY GOOD to do that! I wanted to bad to launch into the "stop this game" bullshit, but hey, I didn't!

Well, here we are tonight. Nothing crazy. I haven't paid her much attention tonight, been watching my Cowboys crush the Bengals. She just left to pickup some things from the store and gave me a kiss before she left. I'm sitting here, watching my Cowboys. Today has been a pretty good day.

And, quite honestly - a pretty unique day. I don't want to count this as progress, but it's better than yesterday.

ONE day at a TIME. But sh*t - my wife got fully nude with no inhibitions in front of me today. Weird.

[sandi2]

Hey, congrats to you for heading off another argument!

Remember, in situations like the hair thing, just shrug your sholders and say, "Don't know" and move on. If you begin the guessing game then you've entered the door to argue. You did head it off...so that was a great move for you.

When you've asked your W for password to FB, etc., have you gave yours to her? You see, if she has nothing to hide...then there would be no reason for her to withhold a password.

Are you thinking about what your boundaries will be?

Good job at not caving when you saw her nude! I know that must have been very difficult. Now, here's a word of warning, at some point she will probably use sex to see that she still can use that as her tool to control you. If you are strong enough to have the attitude of "Thanks but no thanks", that will show her that you are in control of yourself and that ML will not be a "controlling tool" in your M.

[Puppy Dog Tails]

Now, here's a word of warning, at some point she will probably use sex to see that she still can use that as her tool to control you. If you are strong enough to have the attitude of "Thanks but no thanks", that will show her that you are in control of yourself and that ML will not be a "controlling tool" in your M.

Yep.


Puppy