WAW still around, DBing starting to work

[idontunderstand]

What Deep said. Dan too.

You have come so far. You know to expect the doubts and second thought from her. I don't mean to say that you shouldn't be devestated, I would be too.

Hopefully, it is part of your W realizing what a mess she has created. If the light bulb is just now going off over her head, she should feel like crap. She should feel guilty and like you could never forgive her. IDK what the answer is, sorry. Maybe agree with her. "You are right. What you have done is unforgiveable. But I am your husband and I take resposibilty for my part in this mess. You can't tell me what I can or can't get over. It is my choice to move past this and I can move past it only with your help. I will never hold it over your head in the future. That's not how I am wired. If your not sure about forgiving yourself, I can't help you with that. All that I can tell you is that together, we can be better than we ever were. We have both learned some hard lessons and won't make the same mistakes again."

That may be a little pie in the sky, but you get my point.(I think) Agree that she shouldn't be forgive but assure her that you are man enough to do it no matter if she deserves it or not.

I know you are crushed right now. Don't lose hope.

[gutwrenching]

thanks to all, I dont have much time to write, the movers are here and I snuck to computer before it gets packed

this means so much to me. I love some of the words
More later

I am crushed

She did tell me she wants D last night, can't live with anything else cause she cant even look at me and it is all she thinks about (being a cheater)

[gucci loafer]

Let her go Gut..

You aren't understanding human nature..

You need to REJECT the woman she is.

Once you reject her, then her guilt will change. She has guilt. Sounds like she is addicted to guilt.

So, USE her guilt to YOUR advantage...

Dump her and tell her that she is right. It won't work and you now realize it and you now wonder how you put up with it for so long..

Then let her go... After a period of time, her guilt will change. (she thinks it will go away and you must think that too,but it won't)

Since she is addicted to always feeling guilt in her life, when you let her go, that guilt will change to..


"What did I do, I let go of a man that did nothing but love me. Why did I do that. Will he take me back? "Oh no, I feel so GUILTY that he tried and I really didn't. I feel guilty that I was such a bad person to a good guy that loved me. I need to get him back to make up for the things I did or I will always feel GUILTY. I hope he can forgive me..."


Letting go and letting her know that she should feel guilty and that she is right, you ARE too good for her, will make her THEN feel guilty about THAT... She has a guilt addiction. Some women are always feeilng guilty about things just to escape boredom in their lives. They don't even realize they are addicted to guilt. When one guilt leaves them, they move on to another issue that they feel guilty for...

Get wise.

[gutwrenching]

Wow Gucci. Wow. Never thought of it like that. Deep stuff

All situations are complicated, this one no different. Complicated by fact that as I type, all of our stuff is in boxes and getting moved. We leave in 5 days towing a travel trailer we bought 6 weeks ago when things were on the upswing to drive across the country to our new location. From Alaska to the east coast of the US.

Everything is set in motion for that. About irreversible now. Not sure what to do about that. Guess I can still let her go as we travel with the kids.

This is the vacation we had been talking about for years. Literally years.

And I still worry about the suicidal talks of two weeks ago...that still lingers in the back of my mind.

Thoughts?

[gutwrenching]

Deep - wow thank you for the time on your post. As you know, it is so helpful when someone can share similar experiences.
So how did you all work past the guilt? Did you do as wise Gucci says and dump her? How did you handle the mental anguish? I have known from words, actions, and a little snooping that there was more than this EA. I didn't know exactly what, but I knew something and I was prepared to continue to work on things.

What she told me the other night hit hard and I've had to do more thinking, but so far, am in the same place. The PAs took place between 1999 and 2001. So a bit old. The EA still resonates hard because I knew about it all along and there was so much disrespectful sneaking that I caught them at and because it was an EA. Though I learned of the PAs, one was a one night stand and the other an EA/PA where she did fall in love with man. So that one stings too.

DId you ever get told, that's it, I'm done, I want the D? For reference, this is the 3rd time I've been told this. Then as W puts it, she gets scared over loss of security and/or friendship, she comes back, tries for a week and then the guilt takes over and she pulls away again. First time she tried for a week was mid Apr. Second time was early Jun, third time was last week. Each "try" has shown more and more effort. But each time she says she is done, she gets more and more stubborn about it.

[gutwrenching]

So - how has today been. Well, odd. We are both busy, she is being friendly, slightly distant. Not sure where her head is at, not worrying about it.

My big decision, and maybe this is a bit of journaling, is on the cross country trip. Do I let her go or tell her find a plane ticket. I am worried about her mental health which is the whole reason I dropped my boundary before. So a big part of me, says do the right thing, I could never live with myself if she hurt herself.

The DB thing to do is absolutely, telling her your decision, go deal with it, I don't need you around. She knows I don't need her around, she has told me that and it was a trigger to the low point of depression which led to the suicide thoughts.

We are so far down the road of this trip, it is also the easier thing to do, is press with that. That might not be the right thing to do. We are supposed to depart on MOnday. Still loading moving trucks, multiple dr appointments for kids, vehicle to drop off to get shipped, medical appointment for me, pack truck and trailer, make reservations along the way, and I could go on an on. Lots to be done and I'm already sleep deprived.

I still have boundary in place and re-iterated it today: we don't leave until she sees doctor for depression and guilt. She has called a couple of places, but is waiting on return calls. I also just re-iterated, we will pay even if not covered by our insurance. It is one visit, get the treatment started.

[Steve McQueen]

As much as you want to save someone from their own personal demons, you can't. You, me, your wife, anyone, as Gucci wrote, needs to come to the realization, "What did I do" or "What am I doing" then seek the help themselves.

Such the phrase "hit rock bottom"

Imagine yourself an alcholic or a drug addict. Your family can hound you day and night to quit your behaviours, but would you? could you? You can read about alot men in such a predictament on this site. You may know some in your own life that could not make the realization until the ultimatum had come and gone.

"What have I done? She is gone. She took the kids. She wont talk to me anymore."

If you would like to hear some stories for yourself go to an AA meeting or two. You may hear a few people say, "there was nothing anyone could do for me and it wasn't until they were gone did I realize what I did."

Says current EA is over. They still exchange an email every once in a while, last time being 10 days ago.

That is an addiction. Almost like an alcholic saying they quit drinking then hiding beers in the rafters of the garage and drinking them warm after they tell their family they'll just be outside mowing the lawn. But worse, you are enabling this behavior by not doing anything!

Does she have family in Alaska she can stay with?

Did you do as wise Gucci says and dump her?

Dump her. I like that phrase. But it doesnt always sit well with a lot of nay sayers, does it? In retrospect, I would define it

More like let them go so they can figure things out for themselves and make some choices that they need to make for their self. But also, realize there are also somethings you still need to learn about yourself. "Get Wise." So true.

[gutwrenching]

Didn't have time to post for a couple of days due to move. As always thanks for the great advice and perspectives.

Let me answer the question:
No, there is no family here. We are both in military and both have to be to new base soon.

I really thought she hit rock bottom a couple of weeks ago with the suicidal thoughts and realization she needed help. Nope. Then again with the night of crying "I am broke, I need help, I don't know why I am broke"...nope. And I am getting it that I can't convince her to fix herself, your posts helped.

Dump her/let her go. That has finally sunk in. It will happen. I have to do it. The roller coaster was tough, but this lately is more than a roller coaster and I just can't take it.

I am very concerned though. I am watching carefully. In the last 24 hours she has gone downhill. Only time I've ever seen her lower was when she was talking suicide...so if she continues to get worse...I worry she could get to that point again. Can I fix it, no. But she is the mother of my children, so I do worry.

Yes you are right, there are still things to learn about myself. My journey is certainly not over.
Thanks Gucci and Steve

[gutwrenching]

Not so good update. We are done, headed to D. We basically dumped each other. She said she couldn't try any more, there are no feelings left, she has no love left. I told her I deserved better, after all that I've done and put up with. That's the short version of a long discussion that covered a lot territory. Things are still amicable and friendly. There were some tears shed on both sides.

In the end, it was classic WAW script. I tried for 14 years and now the love is dead and I can't get it back.

And now that we've reached this point, now she tells me she actually has depression meds that she got back in March and she agreed to start taking them tonight.

No real details discussed on D or just separation, but I can tell from conversation she is thinking D.

First question for friends/experts: do I push the D and get it over with or do I make her do all the work. I suspect it would take her a while.

We are still on tight timelines to get to next duty location. We agreed we have to pull it together to get there and get settled. She is going drive about half way or more with me and then fly. Its complicated, but that works. And she is even offering to do all the leg work to help find a place for me to live. We have agreed to attempt to live in same school district. Do I allow this? She clearly understands that once we go down this path, our friendship is over.

I am not happy about this, but am not devastated either.

[Lotus]

I'm sorry to hear that. She is in no shape to really make such a big decision and actually stick to it. There are way too many moving pieces. Take her seriously; go along with her and do the separation stuff, get settled, get two lives. The pendulum may swing back the other way after a while. Moving, just by itself, is traumatic. All the other stuff is just too much.