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I hear you, but my wife and I don't talk about the R at all. Partly at the advice of my DB coach. I was told to NOT talk about the R if there is nothing good to talk about. Actions are all I have; my words ring hollow to my W and only stir up negative feelings.
Yesterday I came home early and cleaned out half the garage, then steam cleaned one of our carpets and, after the kids were down, went outside it whatever remaining light there was and trimmed a weeping cherry tree we have that hangs over the driveway.

After I cleaned out the garage we took the kids for a walk and I showed her how much easier it was to pass on the side of my car. She hardly looked and only gave me a grunt and a few inaudible noises as if she refused to acknowledge what I did.

It's clear to me that my wife doesn't want to work on things (and this call her T made to my T will probably only confirm that further), but she doesn't have the will to force the issue. She doesn't want to hurt me and she wants to minimize the hurt on my end. She just wants me to wake up one day soon and "get it."

This is what got us into trouble in the first place. She expects me to just "know" what she's thinking and what she needs and wants from me. Rarely expressed it, just feels that when two people are connected they work in perfect concert with one another.

It's so hard to get my W to be playful and fun. I have argued with her brother that I sometimes wonder why she wanted children because a) she has no qualms about destroying their family and snatching away the hope of a normal family life and childhood; and b) she seems more interested at times about what tasks need to be done instead of cherishing the little moments with the kids. She'd rather be doing their laundry, cooking their food or running errands than being with them, it seems.

And when I watch the news I see the results of a broken home all the time. Just recently I heard about Billy Joel and Christie Brinkley's daughter Alexa Ray trying to commit suicide by swallowing sleeping pills. Fortunately she survived and seems to have learned something, but in interviews she talks about her need to be loved and how much she struggles with relationships and has negative opinion about finding the right guy. Where did that come from??? Her parents divorced when she was a child. Nobody can tell me that her lack of two parents raising her in a loving and supportive home didn't contribute to her issues today.

I really wish my W paid more attention to the facts.

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This weekend one of our sons was sick. My wife and I are great parents and we work together really well when caring for a sick child.

Most of the weekend my W kept her distance from me, called me mostly by my name instead of our pet name and seemed very disinterested in anything I did or said outside of the kids.

I was supposed to go to my nephew's 3rd birthday with both kids, but on Sat. morning my W built herself up to say that she didn't want me taking both because the party was on a beach and she was afraid one might slip by me and go in the water. She was borderline hysterical saying, "I am sorry but you are not taking both kids. As much as you'd try one of them WILL slip by you, so pick one."

I didn't want to fight with her over it b/c I could tell how much she put into putting on that performance. But then by Sunday we learned that they are both carrying a virus (via their doc) and one of my sons had a low fever. I said to my W on Sunday, "I think I should stay home and be with them." She said, "You can do whatever you want to do." Not showing any desire for me to stay home and help -- or show any appreciation. I myself wasn't feeling 100% and feared that I was carrying it, too, so I shouldn't be around a bunch of kids to possibly infect.

It was a tense weekend dealing with a sick son and a wife who refuses to accept or acknowledge anything I do to help or take care of her or the family. If I even sneezed I got no acknowledgement. It was as if I was taking up space.

But after the kids went to bed last night we got some dinner and ate together and she was strangely friendly and a bit conversational. When one of the kids woke up I ran upstairs to comfort him. After our pleasant meal, she vanished.

Tomorrow is our 8th wedding anniversary. I guess I will just treat it as Tuesday and act as though it's just another day. There is nothing to celebrate, nothing to say, nothing to acknowledge.

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gws - my anniversary just passed and I was contacted by my H's atty. He hasn't filed yet, but...

I've decided it was a bad anniversary to celebrate anyway. What, one more year of a bad marriage? I want to start celebrating when things become good. Those will be the anniversaries I will applaud - if my H decides to see if we can get there.

Keep posting and doing things for yourself and the kids. Try to focus on the positive.


He: WAH
Me: LBW
Precious: DD

~ I'm grateful for every day I have to improve the way I relate.
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Thanks, LRT.

I do try to stay focused on the positive, but I often find that I am banging my head against a wall and feel like I am in a perpetual nightmare. Even when I am playing with my kids and laughing with them I think how much better it all would be if my W and I were as fun-loving and playful with each other.

Joy needs to be shared with someone. I can have all the fun in the world with my kids, but it's not the same without my W. There is that truth: nobody will ever love your kids the way you and your spouse do. Nobody. And it's so true, it's what makes us look at each other and smile. It's what bonds us together. But it's not the whole equation. That bond I have with my kids is formed by unconditional love. At times like this, I don't know what the bond with my W is based on. It's seems phoney to deny the fact that our kids represent our love and devotion to each other.

There was an interesting piece on NBC this weekend regarding menopause. The segment on how it affects relationships sounded SO familiar with my sitch. The fact that H feel like aliens have invaded their spouses bodies. My W is 42 and went through 6 IVF cycles. How do I know that she is not also experiencing early menopause? Or symptoms? I just refuse to believe that this is 100% all about me.

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I am definitely in perimenopause and have been for years. It can start as early as age 35. IVF could trigger it to happen sooner. However, having said that, I have been to so many doctors and tried so many different meds, hormones, mail-order, etc, that I finaly said enough! Sadly, there really aren't a lot of answers out there for women with hormone imbalances. The best things that worked for me is to try to eat low carb and low sugar, especially during the last two weeks of a cycle. Otherwise the hormones go into overdrive.

My H has some very difficult traits, yet I am not ready to throw in the towel. There are those good things I would like to have with him that you mention above. I always knew if I stayed in this M I took the good with the bad. I figured I wasn't perfect either but we could still laugh and we were great parents.

I like the DB/DR idea of focusing on yourself, because you are the only one you can change. Still, I found out on my own (despite all the doctors) that my diet greatly affected my moods, annoyances, sweats. If she doesn't know, it might be worth mentioning in passing.


He: WAH
Me: LBW
Precious: DD

~ I'm grateful for every day I have to improve the way I relate.
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Had a great DB session and my coach gave me some great advice. Was told not to talk to my W in a way that puts pressure on her, or seeks her approval. Make my own decisions and stick to them and don't feel like I need validation for anything. She doesn't want to give it to me and apparently the way I speak to her puts pressure on her.

For ex., if I do something like clean the garage I would show her what I did. She would barely acknowledge it. If I decide to stay home with my sick son I would say, "I think I am going to stay home to be with him" instead of "I have decided to stay home and help take care of him." I learned that my W probably thinks I am trying to please her with the way I speak to her, and my changes are putting pressure on my W to change her mind. I need to stop pandering.

Ok, so last night after the kids went to bed I did not ask her if I could fetch dinner. I let her fend for herself and after she had something I went to the kitchen and fed myself. I went outside and changed a lightbulb in the lamp post without telling her what I was doing. I left for work this AM without saying goodbye (she usually does the same to me -- she'll go upstairs to shower and not say goodbye). But last night I almost felt like it bothered her that I didn't collaborate with her on dinner. Made me a little confused.

I am trying to be there for the kids yet give her space and stop talking to her in a tone that makes her think I have an ulterior motive.

My DB coach said to me that feels like for a long time I wasn't as invested in the M as she was, and now she may see my actions as the equivalent of tossing pennies into a fountain. Too little too late. I have to give her more emotional space even though it feels wrong and demonstrate more confidence.

Does anyone else have any experiences they could share with me where distancing yourself from your spouse actually drew them back to you?

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So did you say anything about the anniversary or let it passed unnoticed?

For me, we were already disconnected and distanced, so a 180 would be more interaction. I've tried to do this in soft ways - asking neutral questions, tossing compliments. I have not mentioned his feelings/thoughts on the M, but I will probably mention tonight that I need to respond to his lawyer.


He: WAH
Me: LBW
Precious: DD

~ I'm grateful for every day I have to improve the way I relate.
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I said nothing about our anniversary. I didn't acknowledge the flowers and card her relatives sent over and my W propped up in the kitchen. I guess to her they were just pretty flowers.

We are VERY distant emotionally in terms of talking about our relationship directly. We show care in other ways.

My DB coach said that the less I manipulate her by doing and saying things that appear to fish for validation the better off I will be. She will hopefully feel that I finally understand her feelings.

The funny thing is that the other night her baby helper ended up staying at our house until 9pm because there were tornado warnings along her route home. My W cooked dinner and the three of us ate, had a beer and talked. We were behaving just like H and W. We communicated openly, laughed and had a good time. It was amazing to see how company, a guest in the house, made up behave "normally." After she went home my W remained friendly and seemed relaxed, almost forgetting that she was supposed to be cold and distant. She said goodnight and went to bed.

I am trying to be supportive, complimentary etc. within reason and only when it makes sense. No needless compliments, no pandering. I asked if she wanted dinner last night, she said no, so I went out. End of story.

Much of my behavior has been partially out of guilt and the other part was just a changed me. My coach thinks that I need to show more confidence and stop talking and doing as if I am seeking approval. THAT is what is pressuring her to think she has to change her mind. It's not honest. It appears manipulative. It's a fine line, but it's something I think I can do.

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With one of my sons talking...and talking and talking...my W seems totally overwhelmed by his persistent talking and questions. There were times this weekend where she seemed at the end of her rope. Overwhelmed. I took the kids out when I saw it was getting to be too much.

I don't know how to make an overwhelmed W see the value in me and keeping our F together. I am doing everything I can and it seems when there is something she doesn't like she will say something in a negative tone. For instance, I wiped my son's face with a "cold" washcloth. My W said, "This is cold! Warm it up!" Not seeing all the good I do, only the one little negative.

I think part of what's making her stay is the fact that I help her so much. But I don't want to feel like hired help.

When I saw her getting frustrated I said I was going to take the boys to the supermarket to get milk and stuff. It was raining outside. She said, "You're not taking the kids. It's raining." I said, "They have a covered parking garage." She said, "Yes, and what about the walk from the garage to the front door? They are going to get wet and then go into an air conditioned store." The walk from the garage to the store mind you is about 40 feet...AND the kids would be covered by the little car they sit in attached to the shopping wagon. I had to tell her that I would hold an umbrella over them. Totally neurotic.

Even when I bathed the boys, she had to come in and watch a few minutes. She couldn't just go sit down for a few and relax.

How can I feel like I am helping the M when I feel like I am dealing with someone who can't see the bigger picture? I don't know. It's frustrating.

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W called me at work shortly after I left this morning to ask if she can come to my next session with my therapist.

I don't think it's a good thing. I think she's coming to tell me off because we are in this state of limbo.

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