My game has changed from WAW to EA/PA HELP!!

[SunnyD]

To set this up, H emailed me after a few days after the text finding incident. His original email is in black. My replies to him are in blue. Then he replied in red, then me in green. SO...try to keep up! LOL He sent this on a Tuesday after I had gone to see FT on Monday. My current writing will all be in purple. This is probably more "conversational" than yours will be, since he initiated the process, but hopefully you will get an idea of some things I did right (or wrong!)

Looks like you have been doing some thinking this morning...or last night...or whenever. I have been thinking as well. Anyway, you can see my comments below, in blue.


Hello,

We haven’t talked much and I was happy to have a low stress day yesterday. Me too.
I’m glad you saw a councilor yesterday and that you can see change is possible. I’m sure you knew that but it’s always nice to hear it from a professional. Gives a person hope. :o) Well, it was very good in many ways. I don’t know what to tell you about us. I do love you and I enjoy sex with you a lot. The thing about sex is that it confuses issues. Things have been so intense lately and that makes sex intense. I can’t just go back to how things were 40 days ago. I am changed. I feel different about things. I have different needs and feel less patient about some things. You are right. It does confuse things. Mainly because you had told me several weeks ago that sex was basically "just sex" yet you understood it meant more to me...that it was emotional. Not saying that I have felt that things were "fine" because we had sex...but it does mean more to me than just a physical act and you are aware of that. It is a way of reconnecting and yet, I knew it wasn't a cure or anything like that. I like having sex with you as well. Yet, afterwards, it is even more isolating to me. Unless two people are totally committed to a relationship, sex should not be engaged in. Of course, there is a part of me that thinks, "What's wrong with two married people finding a way to feel good about each other," so it is confusing. Mostly, I feel it is an intimate act. I guess intimacy should not be forced. I wasn’t saying intimacy was forced>. :o) not what I meant to say. I just mean that intimacy should also come from ways other than sex and that sex is then a reflection of that intimacy. I wasn't saying you were forcing intimacy or felt forced to have sex... If that makes sense.

I do understand what you are saying. I can't go back to how things were 40 days ago either. I am also changed. I also feel different about things. I want more for myself - more for the kids - more for you even. I can't say that I know exactly how to go about getting all of that but I am committed to finding out. With some things it is tedious. For instance, I can't go from being unfit to fit in a short period of time. It's a tedious process when you are where I am at. However, something like just choosing my words more carefully to better my relationships - and watch my tongue - is very easy to do: a quick change with immediate results.
I’m sure your asking yourself, what does this mean? The truth is I don’t know. A large part of me wants to just start over. Make a place of my own and build my life with my security and still be there for the kids. I understand your feeling this way. It doesn't help that with your own family background that it's easier for you to cut loose and start over..it's not like you come from a very connected background. Not blaming anything on your family, just saying that is what has been modeled several times over. I can see that. I would be there for you too but it would not be the same. Maybe we could date or something? We need to learn to like each other again. I agree. We need to learn to want to be with each other again. I agree with this also. Not to just watch TV in the same bed. You are very right. We should be happy to be with each other when it’s just you and me and nothing is around to distract us. Yes, definitely. I’m not there now. I don’t enjoy alone time with you unless we are sleeping or having sex. Things feel forced or obligated and I am not going to reconnect with you under those conditions. Well, it is awkward for me as well because I have feelings to work through of my own. I do think I deserve to not be an obligation - and I don't want to be an obligation... And I want to be in a mutually satisfying relationship. No one can reconnect that way.That might not sound right. I’m not refusing I’m just saying it won’t work that way. Understand what I mean? I do.
So, we can look at options. I’ve made a list below and we can discuss them or add others but this is just a place to start.

1: We just get divorced. We can still be great parents and be there for our kids. We can work together to meet their individual needs and be there to watch sports or whatever. You know this is not what I want. However, I have made up my mind that if this is your choice of action, I have to love you enough to let you go. I think back on when we first met and our happier years and I am reminded how you wanted to be with me of your own free will. I couldn't have forced it then and I can't now - not by guilt or twisting your arm or trying to bribe you in any way. Love, above all, is a choice - free will. Marriage also has to be a place of security. A place where two people have sanctuary against the world, with each other; not against each other. Family is "us against the world" not us against each other. Not that there aren't ups and downs or problems to work out in even the best of relationships - but I think you know what I mean: a soft place to fall. Well said

2: We separate and try dating. We could have a specific plan on when we go out and where we go. We could also have a fam night where we all go do something. I would stay close by. Maybe at marks apartments or something like that. I definitely think the dating thing needs to happen if we are to reconnect - no matter what. Separating is a big step, however. It usually is a way for someone to ease themself out when they know they just want to go. Once again, if this is what you want, I obviously have to let you go. If you need to be away from me that strongly, then, maybe you do. Dating would be great - but of course, you have to want to date for dating to be good.
3: I move into the home office and we give each other space. Well, I have been trying to give you your space. It's strange - I don't know how to behave around you. If I am happy - you take that as me thinking "everything is fine" and you have no patience for me acting like everything is fine - when you are thinking everything is not fine and you hope I am not thinking so. If I am more distant - then you say I am cold and I'm supposed to be nicer. If I give you your space then we are just roommates and not a couple. If I try and engage you, then I am trying to force you into an obligated relationship. You see what I mean??? I feel as though nothing I do can be right. It's either taken as a scheme to convince you of something or as an excuse for you to "move on". One time you are thankful I'm being rational and yet you'll make a statement such as I am not emotional enough over things. Please know I am not saying this to be accusatory. Just know that you can’t know things are ok until I tell you they are. Same goes for me until you tell me they are. If you understand that then I won’t think your thinking incorrect thoughts. :o) Same here.
In all three options we both work on ourselves to improve things that need to be improved or fixed. And we do this not for the other but for the individual. I wholeheartedly agree with this. You cannot give to someone else what you do not have in you to give. Two people do not make a whole. Two whole people make a partnership. And no, that's not something I got from counseling yesterday - it's a conclusion I have come up with on my own of late. Nice

I would agree to go to counseling but not as a couple yet. I think I would need to deal with individual issues and feelings before I tackle all the stuff I feel about you. I wholeheartedly agree with this also. As I told you yesterday - and I meant it - I value you as a person, regardless of circumstances. I do think it's important to find the right counselor as there are many out there that aren't good. I personally wanted someone who is based on behavior modification, not just someone who wants to delve into the past and childhood and go into poor ole - no wonder you are the way you are - me type stuff. I know why I am the way I am. It's more important as to where I am going, not to where I came from. I just say that because there are different types of philosophies. I found someone through the counseling center at church. They are professional counselors - not just church people. There are several there. Of course, she did mention that I could always also talk to one of our pastors in the church but this is strictly professional counseling and spiritual things/mindsets can be considered or not considered - whichever.

Having said all of that, there are marriage type workshops that are not counseling but supposedly worthwhile. I will forward you something I was told to look into.
Thoughts?
I know I haven't been very insightful as to what to do, specifically, about things - just shared some thoughts. The fact is, I am not sure what to do, H. It depends on a number of things. You want space... space to do what? To get away from me? To come and go as you please to some extent, yes....to figure things out Yes... to have other relationships Yes, I need other relationships, deeper friendships with other people.... notto explore your options not sure what this means... to play Xbox yes no These are questions you have to answer to yourself firand not worry about problems??? no. These are questions you have to answer for yourself first and foremost. I do love you, yet I'm not sure what to do - how to be. This is hard - and I will be strong, for all of our sakes. There is nothing wrong with personal space yet there are boundaries. Such as, would I think it inappropriate for you to be out all hours of the night partying it up (not saying you want to, just an example) and live at home? Yes, I would think that inappropriate. Having drinks with co-workers after work, appropriate. Do I have a problem with you having friendships? No, not if they are appropriate friendships. If you want inappropriate friendships - and you know what I mean by that - then you shouldn't live at home as it is emotional infidelity, in my book, even if not acted on. Exploring other options I guess is just a way of saying more than exploring friendships, but other, possible romantic relationships. If you want to explore your options romantically, that is not condusive at all to working towards trying to reconcile our relationship. We both know that when you put your feel down a path towards someone else, it can in no way restore the marriage. Therefore, if that is something you want to explore - other romantic relationships - you should not live at home whether in the office or not, in my opinion. I would say that if the goal is reconciliation, all actions have to be toward that goal. However, I do not know if that is your goal.