WAH and LBW separated and dark

[Greek]

greek - i don't want to make you re-live those years of turmoil. but i dare ask. what was going through your head when you walked out? can you honestly tell me that d was what you wanted?

No, I didn't want to be a divorced person. I preferred being happily married.

Going through my head when I left was that it would be awful to leave; upsetting to my children's lives; disappointing to my parents and siblings; leaving a beautiful and comfortable home for a spare lifestyle; tearing myself away from H whom I had lived with longer than I'd lived with my own parents...but staying was worse.

I didn't "want" to divorce. But I was unwilling to give up the rest of my life to the marriage we had. I got myself out.

greek? what are the similiarities?

Do you mean between me and your H? Or between your sitch with your inlaws and mine?

I do not know if your H and I, as walk-aways, are similar.

I picked up your thread b/c I saw similarities between your relationship with your inlaws and my relationship with my inlaws. I have learned valuable lessons during my 20+ year interaction with my inlaws, and wanted to share that with you.

I also saw some similarities btwn your H and mine in terms of how they dealt with their parents. Of course, the crowning difference between them is that my H changed the unhealthy balance with his parents in favor of healing our marriage. Had he not been willing to make that change, I would not have been able to come back.

greek, what did you "see" in my thread?

Read above.

I "see" a young woman who is desperate to be a member of an unhealthy family. I thought it might be helpful if you considered the ramifications of that.

Greek

[DumpedforMIL]

No, I didn't want to be a divorced person. I preferred being happily married.

yeah, my wah is truly adamant that d is the way to happiness.
he can't stand that i am entitled to half of everything.
money is more important than a best friend. a trusted friend.

Do you mean between me and your H?

yes. you and my h were/are the was.

I picked up your thread b/c I saw similarities between your relationship with your inlaws and my relationship with my inlaws. I have learned valuable lessons during my 20+ year interaction with my inlaws, and wanted to share that with you.

it's too late.
i no longer have a relationship with my inlaws.
to me, they are strangers now. there is no contact.
i do not send birthday cards or christmas cards.
and it's funny. there was no huge fight between us.
as soon as their son asked for a d, everything changed.
it became me vs. them.

I also saw some similarities btwn your H and mine in terms of how they dealt with their parents. Of course, the crowning difference between them is that my H changed the unhealthy balance with his parents in favor of healing our marriage. Had he not been willing to make that change, I would not have been able to come back.

he never saw me as being more important than them.
he no longer feels anything towards me but hatred because i have chosen to protect myself against a d that he asked for.

what was i supposed to do? give in and lose everything that i put into the last 6 years together?
protecting myself is justification for d-ing me?

I "see" a young woman who is desperate to be a member of an unhealthy family. I thought it might be helpful if you considered the ramifications of that.

often times, i don't know what i want.
i want my h back. or do i?
it makes me sad.
when i'm sad i tend to babble and write a lot.
i've started writing my story in my blog.
i want others to know, i didn't ask for it.

d4mil

[Coach]

Let me help you get in the mind of a co-dependent. They are so concerned with how otheres see them and not hurting any elses feelings they let other people cross boundaries in their world.

he tried hard to make the house look nice for his parents.

looking for their acceptance and approval, their love is conditional - if you loved me then you would do this for me.

when he says that if he ever died, all he could think about was his poor parents

he thinks he is responsible for all of their feelings, terrible burden.

because how people perceive him is something that is common in their family.
he badly dented his car once and when we went to the auto body shop to get it fixed, he asked me if he could tell them that i put the end in the car.
he didn't want to look like an idiot.
when it comes to negotiating the price for a car, he usually sends me in to negotiate because he doesn't want the sales guy to think he's cheap.
he doesn't want to do anything that makes him look bad.
he's afraid to do things that might make him look stupid.
they won't hang up on telemarketers for fear of looking rude.

The real reason is because he can't reject someone else. He knows how much that hurts and can't bear the thought of hurting someone else's feelings. He doesn't want to be responsible for their hurt.

He also has a hard time thinking he deserves anything done for him. Having love doled out with conditions makes you feel shame about who you are, there is something wrong with me and I must make it up. So talking to the auto repair guy makes him feel vunerable.

I am not excusing his behavior and I understand how it makes you feel. I just am trying to help you see things from his perspective. His parents have wounded him deeply, deep down he feels unlovable and is very angry at them.

One of the biggest lessons I learned was to "love myself" first. (Love your neighbor as yourself.) You can't fix your H but you can model healthy behavior, be aware of the triggers for him and love yourself.

Cheers

[DumpedforMIL]

looking for their acceptance and approval, their love is conditional - if you loved me then you would do this for me.

this is so sad. to have parents who love you conditionally and make you win their approval.

The real reason is because he can't reject someone else. He knows how much that hurts and can't bear the thought of hurting someone else's feelings. He doesn't want to be responsible for their hurt.

why was it okay to hurt me?
if he can't bear the thought of hurting someone else's feelings, why did he hurt me in so many ways?
why did he give me a blank stare when i told him flat out that his words hurt me?

here's another question.
i won't be intimate with him if i don't feel that emotional connection or if he hurts me with his words. is that like putting conditions on my love?

I am not excusing his behavior and I understand how it makes you feel. I just am trying to help you see things from his perspective. His parents have wounded him deeply, deep down he feels unlovable and is very angry at them.

that is sad. it baffled me as to why he would want to be with them despite all of those things they've done to him. and it just hurts to see him this way.

i've never made him choose between me and his parents. but had he chose to side with me .. i would have worked hard to repair his relationship with his parents. if he loved me, i would love him and love what is important to him. i just needed to know that i was important to him. i never felt important to him so i didn't love what he loved (ie. his parents).

despite the hurt he's doled out, i am still capable of loving him. i love myself but i really gotta learn how to go to bed earlier.

thanks coach.

[Coach]

if he can't bear the thought of hurting someone else's feelings, why did he hurt me in so many ways?

he felt squeezed like he can't please anybody, this is the worst part about it you try to please everybody and you can't then you are miserable

why did he give me a blank stare when i told him flat out that his words hurt me?

shame. he tries so hard to please you and everybody(love you in his mind) and you are still hurt. feeds that "snake on a brain" that something is wrong with him. that's why boundaries are so important- his behavior is what bothers you not him as a person. he sees your hurt as a validation that he is bad, unlovable, broken ..... he takes things personally

i won't be intimate with him if i don't feel that emotional connection or if he hurts me with his words. is that like putting conditions on my love?

no, i think he knows when he hurts you. I have a pretty good radar on how people are feeling comes with being responsible for everybodies feelings.

But he might think if I do this then she will do that. = conditions

it baffled me as to why he would want to be with them despite all of those things they've done to him

I joined the military and moved halfway across the country to get away. I understand the paradox. I also know what is healthy for me now.

i just needed to know that i was important to him. i never felt important to him so i didn't love what he loved (ie. his parents).

That's the worst part, he doesn't think he is important so he struggles to make you feel important. The shame makes you not want to let people see inside of you. He might be shielding your from his parents.

All of this is from my perpsective. I knew that I had problems and it came from my FOO. I never had to the tools to effectively deal with the issues. I searched, read, prayed and so wanted to feel better. Almost losing my family and my wife made me really focus on changing my thoughts, actions and feelings.


I am offering this to you to help you have some compassion and empathy for your H. Took me 40+ yrs to let it go and let myself become responsible for my happiness and no one elses. I have to be aware of what triggers the snakes and how to quiet them.

How was the sushi?

[DumpedforMIL]

he felt squeezed like he can't please anybody, this is the worst part about it you try to please everybody and you can't then you are miserable

so he decides to hurt me?
my theory is that he's still trying to win his parents approval by getting me out of his life. they said after 4 yrs of marriage, they questioned his judgement in marrying me. so now he's doing whatever he can to win back their approval by taking as much as he can from our marriage and getting rid of me. they have made him feel stupid by not serving me with a pre-nup before we got married.

i feel like a scapegoat.

that's why boundaries are so important- his behavior is what bothers you not him as a person. he sees your hurt as a validation that he is bad, unlovable, broken ..... he takes things personally

i love him as a person but the way he's handled all of this is disappointing. it's almost embarrassing. during our m, i worked hard to prevent him from making a fool out of himself.

I joined the military and moved halfway across the country to get away. I understand the paradox. I also know what is healthy for me now.

so did h.
and they still have him wrapped around his finger.

That's the worst part, he doesn't think he is important so he struggles to make you feel important. The shame makes you not want to let people see inside of you. He might be shielding your from his parents.

i've never betrayed his trust.
i've seen the inner person in him. i know things about him that he has been afraid to talk about. things i found out accidentally on my own. i tried to be gentle and non-judgemental. i told him that it was okay and that i loved him anyway. his fears will always be safe with me .. regardless of how ruthless, vindictive, petty, and spiteful our battle is. i have to be true to myself.

I am offering this to you to help you have some compassion and empathy for your H.

it helps a bit. but i have to admit that i lose sight from time to time.
i still try to piece together things from the last six months and so much of what has come out of his mouth, he denies he ever said. he doesn't remember saying certain things. and it makes you wonder what is really going on and why this is happening.
he said i was frugal on spending and that i never asked for any expensive gifts. yet, he turns around and calls me money hungry.
he'd say that his mom exaggerates her statements most of the time and he never knows when she's telling the truth or not. but he'll believe her when she says that i was threatening to her. he had eyes and ears.

why do i hear so many contradictory statements? what is the truth?
i don't why he feels the need to get away from me.
why am i suddenly so revolting? because i've decided to protect myself?

my heart is sitting at the bottom of my stomach.

How was the sushi?

sushi was good. i tried to be feminine and didn't pig out too much.
the company was fun.

d.

[Forrest Gump]

"i feel like a scapegoat."

Why do you just feel like one.. you are.

"so he decides to hurt me?"

If people do things to a fault.. who would you hurt first?

"i love him as a person but the way he's handled all of this is disappointing."

Welcome to the club.. you need a trophy or something?

"it's almost embarrassing. during our m, i worked hard to prevent him from making a fool out of himself."

So.. you did mother him.

"so did h.
and they still have him wrapped around his finger."

People go with what they know.

What now?

[DumpedforMIL]

"i feel like a scapegoat."

Why do you just feel like one.. you are.

that should be my login name - the Scapegoat .. baaaaa baaaa.

"so he decides to hurt me?"

If people do things to a fault.. who would you hurt first?

my mother.

"i love him as a person but the way he's handled all of this is disappointing."

Welcome to the club.. you need a trophy or something?

yes, i do. it goes next to my bitch of the year award.

"it's almost embarrassing. during our m, i worked hard to prevent him from making a fool out of himself."

So.. you did mother him.

i don't know if you call it mothering.
i was more like a business advisor. i didn't wipe his mouth when he had ketchup on the side of his mouth. nor did i spoon feed him his oatmeal. that's what his mother did.

People go with what they know.

What now?

let's put the focus back on me. shall we?

[Coach]

let's put the focus back on me. shall we?

OK. Do you see why he left you and is still "bonded" with his parents? This is your path to take. Look at your situation like you are looking into a fishbowl. What do you "see" ?

Why would your H be attracted to you in the first place? What did you have that was priceless to him? What have you learned since then that will help you?

To walk down the parallel paths requires you to "lovingly detach." Having no expectations helps with the fear and anger. Love yourself enough to arrive down the path as a stronger, wiser and healthier you. You can handle it.

Cheers

[DumpedforMIL]

Do you see why he left you and is still "bonded" with his parents?

honestly, coach .. i don't see why he left me and still bonded with his parents.
why is hurting me even an option? why is it better to hurt me? i didn't know loving someone meant hurting them.

This is your path to take. Look at your situation like you are looking into a fishbowl. What do you "see" ?

i see a man who feels a greater responsibility for his parents than to himself. i see a man who doesn't love himself. i still love him. i want to show him that he is deserving of unconditional love. because that's how i grew up and i know it exists.

Why would your H be attracted to you in the first place? What did you have that was priceless to him? What have you learned since then that will help you?

some days i don't remember why he was attracted to me.
i think in many ways, physically .. i am his type.
i was a good girl - just like he is a good boy.
we had similiar morals and values. we had a similiar sense of humour.
i was the only person he trusted to get close to him.
what did i have that was priceless to him? my flower, my friendship, my trust. which is why i have kept a few things out of my discussions. there are lines i do not cross.

but i have learned that i didn't fully trust him in some aspects.
it almost seemed like the closer i watched him bond with his parents, the less i trusted him.

To walk down the parallel paths requires you to "lovingly detach." Having no expectations helps with the fear and anger. Love yourself enough to arrive down the path as a stronger, wiser and healthier you. You can handle it.

i need to be strong now. wiser? more like guarded.
if i didn't love myself, i wouldn't be here. i would be dead.