Most things are easier to see in hindsight.. Try not to focus on what won't be and focus instead on you and the chance you've been given to work on you...
20 minutes of peace will turn into 30... 30 to 40... You get the idea...
Re: lawyer...
Next rule to learn (#1 being focus on what you can control which is you) is when in doubt, do nothing as the answer will come to you when it needs to.
Seeing a lawyer is helpful to get the legal lowdown of your rights etc, but it won't help you work on yourself or your interactions with your H. If you feel the need to get a handle on the legal side of things, feel free, but I wouldn't tell your H you've gone.
Start asking yourself "if I do or say x does it bring me closer or farther from my goal?"
When you're not sure wait 24-48 hours before doing or saying it. (this is my biggest downfall...I'm the quick typer from he!! )
If you feel your H will be irresponsible with money, then consider separating the accounts. If you're not sure, do nothing. (see a pattern? )
Take your cues from H with regards to action, don't act when unsure or emotional, take care and be kind to yourself, work on you. All of the above is under your control. Your H and his thoughts or actions aren't.
(((forgingon)))
You'll be fine. Just remember to breathe...
Last edited by DiamondGirl; 06/07/1011:43 PM. Reason: Too much coffee
~ This Diamond now SHINES!! ;-p ~
My Sitch in MLC - http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Main=45253&Number=1901148#
Thanks DiamondGirl. You've been such a great help. I'm feeling a bit better today; not so emotional. It's still all I think about but now I'm getting mad that his lack of communication has resulted in pain for so many people including two little girls. I have faults but I do know that we had a good life and were working towards things together. In my mind, it's his loss. I have every desire to better myself because of what happened but will do this for me and no other reason.
As for D - I told him on Fri that I would look into it and let him know what I find out. He doesn't want lawyers involved (of course not). He's being quite agreeable right now. So I want to drop it - if he wants a D then I think he should look into it.
As for the bank accounts - he does still have financial obligation to this family; although I do make more than enough money to support myself. I was working part time but am now going full time so that won't be an issue.
He is wanting freedom and to gain confidence and his manhood back. I think the only way I can do that is to allow him to manage his own money without any interference from me. It's only fair. I want him to feel freedom and that I'm capable of giving up control of things....
I'm sorry for your situation and wish I could offer advice. I'm so new to this so thank you, thank you, thank you for your words of wisdom. You've really kept me going.....
I'm not sure if you've seen these before, but I've dug them up from the archives for you.. Hope it helps..
1. For walkaways you must understand theactions and behaviors that created the climate for the flight.
2.You have not only to change those behaviors but actually live them.
3. you can only control your actions
4. You cannot control the situation you are in but you can control how you react in it.
5 Anything you do or say through the process is remembered . NEVER SPEAK IN ANGER!!!
6. Become the man or woman your spouse would never think of leaving. The man or woman that all their freinds and support group would in times of crisis drive him/her back to you.
7. Listen and observe to every last detail from your H or W.
8. IF you are ever unsure how to act DONT.
9. When things dont seem to be going well redefine your short term goals.
10. Live in positive times, keep positive filters on.
11. Accept that it takes time.
12. Accept that no matter what the outcome YOU are a good person and you have done your best. at the end of the day we must live with ourselves.
MANDATORY DO'S
-Be patient, time is an asset even when it seems to be killing you.
-Listen carefully to what your spouse is REALLY saying to you.
-Learn quickly that anger is your enemy.
-Learn quickly to BACKOFF, shut up walk away when you want to speak out.
-Take care of yourself, Exercise, sleep laugh, and focus on all the other chances in your life that are not in turmoil.
-Be cool,strong confident and speak softly
-Know that if you can do a 180, your smallest actions will be noticed much more than any words you can say or write.
MANDATORY DO'S
-Do not be openly desperate or needy when you are hurting more than ever, and youare desperate and needy.
-Do not focus on your self when communicating with your spouse.
-Do not believe any of what you hear and only half of what you see. Your spouse will speak in absolute negatives because they are hurting and scared.
-Do not give up no matter how dark it is or how bad you feel.
-Do not backslide from your hard earned changes.
Dont initiate any our realtionship (OR) talk, stop being so available, give them lots of time and space, stop expressing your interest so dramatically,establish independence again with style not in an angry or dramatic way, dont try to get in their head,if confronted with rejection dont take it personally, take the body blows smiling.
Workout,diet, get new clothes, haircut, and be happy when they see you....
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1)No matter what, don't spend too much time alone! Especially in the beginning, because without distractions, your mind will fixate on the pain. Keep yourself busy! Get involved with something that you always wanted to try, but never got around to it when you two were together, try to make it something that he would find surprising
2) The more they dislike us, the easier we are to forget about. So be prepared for a man that has programmed his memory to ERASE ALL GOOD MEMORIES! They don’t want us to be the good guy in their eyes.
3) Try your best to refrain from initiating any conversation that puts her out when you bring it up. Suggest that the two of you meet every Sunday night for at least an hour, so you guys can discuss legal matters, financial arrangements, visitation schedules, and any other serious issue that needs attention. NOTHING EMOTIONAL, or MARITAL, at least not for a while (this means no more venting your feelings). All questions and issues that deal with your failing marriage or your broken heart must be put on hold until she wants to talk about them, which can take a long time (it took my wife 4 months, and that is fast compared to others on this board). I know how hard this one was for me. I felt like she was constantly blowing me off, so I started forcing the issues every single time we talked. Big mistake, b/c she stopped returning my calls, until we agreed to meet weekly. Eventually, she was actually happy to hear from you. Of course, issues concerning children should not wait until your meeting, they are priority over EVERYTHING!
I don’t know about you, but I only got to briefly see my wife 2 or 3 times a week as we exchanged visitation, which usually involved a hi, or hello. I wanted her to hang out for a bit or just act like she could stand me. So, I started being more polite and relaxed every time I saw her. After a couple of weeks of this, these one syllable conversations started getting longer and more enjoyable, because she was no longer worried that I would ruin the day by complaining about some legal crap. THIS IS NOT EASY, but this was where I first noticed that my wife started warming up to me.
4)Her guilt is a time bomb, be careful. I think most women, especially my wife, can NOT handle the guilt of breaking up their family, so they avoid anything that may remind them. Sometimes they’ll start crying if you tell her how much you love her, or how miserable you’ve been since she left. But BE CAREFUL, these tears most often come from guilt, not true love. A good example: my wife and I were talking about all the bills that I needed to remove her name from (gas, credit card, etc.). Talking about the mortgage loan, she calmly stated that she wanted her name removed from that too, but that meant I’d have to re-finance, which we both knew I couldn’t qualify alone. So, that left only option…..sell the house. She began crying, and I thought it was because she knew she would never be able to come home. WRONG! She felt guilty b/c I bought the damn house for her, and now I was screwed. Her crying spells during our divorce talks, created false hope that she might not divorce me. 5)NEVER LOSE YOUR COOL!! Always smile and be polite. I had to always remind myself that my estranged wife and I were “casual neighbors” (it works).NEVER, NEVER, NEVER let her drag you into a ‘fight’, if you have to excuse yourself from the conversation, stating that you’ll return when you can talk, not yell. Remain stern and honest, but show her how cooperative you can be. Throw her off once or twice by giving in to her, without a struggle.
6)Don’t ever expect an apology or an admission of guilt for leaving you. I know how hard this was for me, but I quickly realized that waiting for her to say “sorry” only made it harder for me to think of anything else. The more you want her to apologize, the more disappointed you’ll be every day that she didn’t. She might surprise you. An example: One random evening, we were at the park with our daughter laughing away, when all of a sudden she broke down in tears. I gently asked “What’s wrong?”……(more tears)……”Do you want to talk about it, or do you need to be alone?”. She said that she had been wanting to talk, but what she wanted to say was obviously hard for her. After telling her that I wanted to listen, she hugged me and talked for hours. She was crying because she didn’t think I would forgive her. My wife says that she wanted to apologize to me, long before she actually did, but she didn’t think I would be able to accept it.
7)SEEK COUNSELING FOR FAMILIES GOING THROUGH DIVORCE! As loving parents you both will learn a lot about what your both doing right now to your kids if your being careless in your conflicts, it will also help you two strengthen your general concern for getting along. Without a doubt, this allowed my wife to remember how committed I am to being a wonderful father and husband. It being my idea, she saw that no matter how much pain I had to endure, I was not going to let this divorce hurt us any more.
When you choose a new therapist make sure they are both Licensed Family Therapist AND Licensed Marriage Therapist. Make sure she is involved in the selection process, so she won’t suspect hidden agendas. When we went to our first parent counseling session, he asked what each of us wanted to achieve through therapy. We answered the same on all goals (anger management, communication, etc) but I added that if I was allowed to, in later sessions I would like to discuss what went so wrong with our marriage, and if it could ever be fixed. It was never brought up again. Two months later, as we sat down to start, she just blurted out that she was ready to talk about us and our marriage. The counselor and I both sh#t our pants!
8)If she ever hints that there is a small chance that you could work things out, treat the situation with extreme care. Show genuine gratitude for their bravery in telling you this, comfort them by letting them know that your scared too. DON’T TAKE THE MONEY AND RUN, but certainly pay soft attention to it. Never say or do anything that makes them embarrassed or ashamed for wanting to change their mind.
9)DO NOT EVER ARGUE ABOUT HOW SHE FEELS, because it will only make her feelings stronger. I know, they change every 5 minutes later, and are as unpredictable as the weather, but you have to let them know that you respect their feelings, even if you have a problem with them. A great example of how I changed is this: my wife used to complain that I was never affectionate towards, which made her feel unattractive. I used to say “well that’s silly to feel that way. I tell you all the time how beautiful I think you are. You just need to pay more attention and give me some credit”. WRONG! Now I say: “Tell me what I need to do more of, because I think you’re extremely attractive.”
10)No gifts, I love you’s, special occasions, or anything other than a very helpful father and kind friend.
11)Read every book you can get your hands on, on improving communication between a male and a female. The more I read about the differences in a man and a woman the more amazed I become at how easy it is for me to approach my wife, without ruffling a single feather. As a matter of fact, I have gotten so good at being cooperative and fair in all disagreements, that I think she has started to ask how I changed so fast. (I also found two of my books in her bag). Remember that communication is only half talking, the other half is listening.
Books: Divorce Busting Love Must Be Tough Between Love & Hate Light Her Fire His Needs Her Needs
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~ This Diamond now SHINES!! ;-p ~
My Sitch in MLC - http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Main=45253&Number=1901148#
Thank you DiamondGirl. Appreciate this and the fact you took the time to type it out for me. I printed it and have already reviewed it twice today.
Today is hard. I'm trying to stay positive but I'm so heart broken and the pain at times is unbearable. I've just finished yet another crying fit.
Does this ever get better? I know that I'm supposed to find something to do with myself but it's hard when I work all day then care for my 2 and 12 year old.
Tell me how to deal with this pain...I'm terrified of losing him for good. All I can think about is our hopes/dreams gone and how he changed instantly over night.
Do WAS have regrets? Do they come back? I need some hope!
I know this is a tough, tough stage you are in. It is full of confusion and pain. Best advice you are recieving here is to focus on your children and keep yourself busy. Of course this is hard, but you will save yourself so much extra suffering that some of us can really vouge for and wish we had tried harder not to suffer so much. It isnt healthy and I know you said you lost 9 lbs and I did the same. I could barely eat and hardly ever could get myself to come to work.
Now, in your last post you asked if WAS have regrets and do they come back.... yes in some cases they do. For me, my H "came back" (never actually went anywhere physically but thats because of our circumstances, otherwise he would have) and he does have regrets. Now that he is re-committed to our M, I didnt hear "Im sorry" or "I wish I hadnt done that" as much as I felt I needed to hear those kinds of things, but I can see it on his face when certain things come up. You can tell sometimes, when they come out of their fog, maybe after they have some sore of revelation about what they were going thru and how they handled things, they do feel bad and wish they hadnt hurt the family in that way. So that is something positive that could happen in your situation.
Now, I think you will get some people who say that there might be OW in the picture. Doesnt sound like you have any reason yet to suspect that. You dont sound like you have any evidence of that. But you had mentioned that maybe there is someone boosting his ego, maybe at work or something, and you could very well be right. My H had that going on, I dont suspect anything physical either, but def some ego boosting and in my case, what I would consider an emotional affair. So that is a possibility. But even so, I wouldnt focus on that thought too much unless some more concrete evidence comes your way.
What is most important right now is to focus on the things you do know where a problem in the M. You have pointed out some faults that you do know you have, and if you are anything like me, you havent acknowledged ever to H in the course of your M that you were wrong for those things, whatever they might be. Now, H plays a role in the breakdown of the M too, but it is not your job right now to point out his faults. It is only about you right now. I would suggest some individual counseling for yourself to help you explore those things and work on them. Cause like you said before, the goal here is to fix those things about yourself, even if it has no benefit on your M, or brings your H back. You wouldnt want to be that way in a future relationship either.
Now, you might also consider paying for the DB phone coaching. I dont know that very many people on these boards would recommend this, but my DB coach suggested that I send my H a "letter of release" and in my un-professional opinion, I think it could help in your situation. You might have read about it in my thread, but basically its a letter letting H know that you do understand his complaints in the M and you agree that things really could have been better. You basically validate all of their feelings, but in a way to let them know that you do want the M to continue, but you get why they feel that way and you understand. Its not written in a needy, desperate tone at all.... its more like "hey you know what, I get it, our M was not turning out the way either of us expected it to and there are some things I really need to work on about myself." Its kinda like, you know what, you're right H. If you want to know more about my letter, let me know.
You might get other adivise not to do that, and its up to you of course. I think you need to get your hands on the DB books before you do anything... I suggest Divorce Remedy over Divorce Busting, but thats me. Also, read some other books as suggested in earlier threads. I was kind of aggressive in my M too and controlling and the books I read really helped me to see what I was doing and how H feels about it.
Me: 25 H:25 M: 2yrs T: 4yrs No Kids Bomb: 11 Feb 10 Newcomers Story
Thank you for your reply. I appreciate your comments. It is so hard to go on some days; last night was particularly bad and this morning is as well - I've been awake since 3am and still need to deal with my kids and work all day.
The despair I feel is indescribable.
About the letter - please let me know more...no I haven't really said sorry often enough to my H and know that this is an issue of his with me. I'm terrified of contacting him tho as I don't want to push him farther away.
We've had no contact since he dropped our D off on Sunday and he'll be picking her up tomorrow and I'm scared to see him.
Help me, I'm really losing hope about everything including making it through this.
Thank you for your reply. I appreciate your comments. It is so hard to go on some days; last night was particularly bad and this morning is as well - I've been awake since 3am and still need to deal with my kids and work all day.
The despair I feel is indescribable.
About the letter - please let me know more...no I haven't really said sorry often enough to my H and know that this is an issue of his with me. I'm terrified of contacting him tho as I don't want to push him farther away.
We've had no contact since he dropped our D off on Sunday and he'll be picking her up tomorrow and I'm scared to see him.
Help me, I'm really losing hope about everything including making it through this.
Don't send a letter now you are not in the right frame of mind. Take care of yourself first - sleep, diet, exercise, prayer, talking. Fill your physical, mental, spiritual and emotional needs yourself.
- Make a list of all you are grateful for.
- Help someone else today.
- Play with your kids.
- List some short term goals.
You can handle it.
The Stockdale Paradox helped me stay focused.
Cheers Coach
M22,H45,W45 S21/18D12 Retain faith that you will prevail in the end, regardless of the difficulties and at the same time confront the most brutal facts of your current reality, whatever they might be.
Thank you Coach for your reply. I'm pretty sure that I've read every post on this website looking for answers to something I just simply have no control over.
I'm giving this to the Universe to sort out. I will read and work on myself but I can no longer obsess about this. I need to focus on healing and on my kids - they deserve that much.
My biggest struggle is forgiving myself. Hindsight is 20/20 - I would have done so many things differently...but my H won't even consider working on this...
Coach - are you and Greek married? How did you two work it out; did one of you have no desire; and how long did it take for you to be back together?
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