I grinned and asked if I could have anything. I know I set myself up for a fall here, but I still had to ask.
NO, you did not "have" to ask! That is a huge turn-off to a WAW. Do you want to turn her off? Just keep thinking you "have" to do it and it will continue to push her away! God, you men are something else. You just HAD to ask. You knew the answer and yet you went there nevertheless.
The more despart you act and talk....the more it will leave her feeling cold. So...think about what you just have to do or say.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
God, you men are something else. You just HAD to ask. You knew the answer and yet you went there nevertheless.
That's right. Men are something else compared to women. That's why we aren't called women!
It sounded harmless enough the way I read it. MWD does talk about testing the waters as things improve. Should he get his needs from another woman instead? He's being honourable and a good husband right, despite the past and present problems in their relationship.
That's right. Men are something else compared to women. That's why we aren't called women!
It sounded harmless enough the way I read it. MWD does talk about testing the waters as things improve. Should he get his needs from another woman instead? He's being honourable and a good husband right, despite the past and present problems in their relationship.
I actually tried to go back and delete that part but had waited too long. I can always count on statements like that to step on some toes.
It has been a while since I read DR but as I recall...it is the WAS that tests the waters....NOT the LBS.
He was doing the same technique as saying ILY expecting something in return. LBS are told not to tell the WAS ILY. He "knew" in advance that hinting at having sex was not the right thing to do, but "he just had to do it". What I am saying is why do men go ahead and say something when the KNOW it is the wrong thing? He is acting like he had no power of what came out of his mouth and I'm saying that he did.
It sounded harmless enough to you b/c you have the same mind-set! I'm trying to help, here, and tell you guys that it is not the right thing to say to a WAW, and you are doing a lot of damange when you know not to say things like that but you go ahead and do it anyway.
The reason behind the statement I made about men is based on this same situation that I have read over & over in threads. Men know better to say or do that with a WAW, but they do it anyway.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
NO, you did not "have" to ask! That is a huge turn-off to a WAW. Do you want to turn her off? Just keep thinking you "have" to do it and it will continue to push her away! God, you men are something else. You just HAD to ask. You knew the answer and yet you went there nevertheless.
I see your point. I did not actually say anything but the grin alone was enough that she knew what I meant.
Originally Posted By: sandi2
The more despart you act and talk....the more it will leave her feeling cold. So...think about what you just have to do or say.
Unfortunately you are right. I do not act like I am desperate except for weak times like this. But the truth is, in my heart I am desperate to win the heart of my wife back. But what else can I do? I have changed a lot of what I did for the better. She has even mentioned this.(NO I DID NOT ASK) I have given her time and space that she asked for during the week. Other than sleeping in the same bed and being together, she acts like we did a long time ago. So I ask WHAT THE HELL ELSE CAN I DO? How can we be so close in so many ways and yet she be so distant? Sandi, you are the expert on this. What does she want? What can I do to draw her in without actually trying. I keep reading the book for answers and I have not found them. Hopefully your perspective will.
Oh, it can be saved, but she has to want to TRY. And SOMETHING (or someone) is blocking her from even wanting to try.
It makes me really angry when people don't even want to TRY to work on a marriage (unless of course there is abuse or something going on currently). 9 times out of 10, when these "symptoms" are presented, there's someone else in the picture, blocking them from wanting to try and messing with them physiologically.
Puppy
Puppy if you are reading, I know who is blocking my wife (other than the stupid things I do every once in a while) and I would love some advise on how to stop the negative influence. It is my MIL and SIL. They both feel that the woman wears the pants in the family and the husband is there to do their bidding. My W & I do not fit that mold and try to keep as even a relationship as possible and they TOTALLY resent me for it and put crap in her head. I know it is up to her whether or not to listen, but is there anythnig I can do? The biggest problem is that she works for the family business and hears from them both every day. Funny how she did not talk too much to her sister before becasue of a lot of things her sister did to her, but now that we are in trouble her sister makes sure that she calls W every day. SIL would love nothing more than to see us apart, that would make her the special daughter who is untainted. (She sure got that one wrong, most people hate her)
I havent been able to find any solid proof that my GF is with OM, but I would like to get her lady coworker away from her. I know she is a bad influence on my GF and is definately in her ear, but I dont know if there would be anything i could do to make that happen.
My heart goes out to you about the negative influence your in-laws have on your W. You have to look at that as being a challeng so that resentment will not turn your heart sour. If they are constantly preaching that she should be the one to wear the pants.....well that is going to be the hardest part, right there. If they just put you down, then it could have the opposite affect from what they wanted her to feel. In other words, I might blow off steam to my mother about how my H is this or that, but if "she" says something negative about him then I don't like it. I know, it's crazy.
I believe respect and sexual attraction is what keeps a woman happy in her M. First,she must respect you before she'll be sexually attracted to you. As long as she is attracted, then I personally believe that other things will take a back seat to that.
So, make sure that she treats you respectfully. If she talks down to you....you stop her right then and call her out on it. If you let her slide, then she will be worse the next time. It is especially important that she shows respect for you in front of others. You need to have something in mind for a consequence whenever she shows disrespect.
Do not get into a war of words over her family. Lay boundaries and expect her to respect them. You do not have to be around her family if they don't treat you right. You should not act like their cat to kick around. You show respect and you talk respectful, but you don't take cr@p off of them. Don't raise your voice, call them names, talk vulgar, etc.
As far as being sexy, well......how did you win her the first time around? Did somebody have to teach you how to act sexy? LOL.....I bet not. But somehow, we tend to forget how to be that way after M. Maybe some need a refresher course.
You know that old saying of how people want what they can't have, a WAW is very much that way. That is why the LBH is often told to go out at night, leaving her alone, and GAL. She sees him all decked out looking sexy and going out. He shows no interest in her. He is polite to her, but he is that way with "everyone". She doesn't seem to be anyone special or important to him. So, she starts to test things. She tries to flirt.....and he doesn't cave. Then she turns on the charm and even iniates sex, and it still doesn't seem to interest him. By now she is really wondering what is going on in his life and she has forgotten about the reasons she was using to leave. He has caused the sexual attraction to rise again!
Most of the LBH's won't hold out long enough. Most are wearing their heart on their sleeve and that is not attractive. Women love men who show strength......especially where the wife is concerned. But, I wonder if men get strength confused with negative things. Showing strength is not showing meaness or abusiveness. It is not being rude & crude. It is standing on one's principles and not giving in to what they believe is wrong.
Women do not want to be treated like a second class citizen, but they do like a man to be the leader God designed him to be. A lot of men are confused about what role they are suppose to have anymore. Think of it as the man being the president and the woman the vise-president.
The one thing that most women seem to think is really sexy is a man who is comfortable in his own skin......self-confidence. From what I've read, men think that about women, too. Can a H who is acting all needy, clingy, and desparate show self-confidence? Nope.
Well, I am a long way from being through with this subject, but this is probably enough for now.
Let me just add this once more, if my H would have acted as if he was dumping "me" when I was focused in on the OM, that EA would have been cut a lot shorter than it was. But, my H tried to smother me with his presence, his affection, saying he loved me (to get me to say it back), etc. All of that just turned me off. It was not sexy at all. See what I am saying?
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
My heart goes out to you about the negative influence your in-laws have on your W. You have to look at that as being a challeng so that resentment will not turn your heart sour.
Well I cannot let her off the hook on this one. I know that she is a bit of a drama queen and is not telling them the whole story of what is going on. W has issues with her family. She never gets attention from them until this. I think she is eating up the fact that she is getting attention, even though it is negative attention.
Originally Posted By: sandi2
If they just put you down, then it could have the opposite affect from what they wanted her to feel. In other words, I might blow off steam to my mother about how my H is this or that, but if "she" says something negative about him then I don't like it. I know, it's crazy.
Gret point. I now remember after you said this that one thing that was straining our relationship is she used to complain constantly about her family. I would join in becasue it REALLY hurt me to see the way they treat her. My mother told me to stop that becasue she noticed what efect it had. And my M came from a similar situation. I did not learn this valuable lesson until we split. So GREAT reminder Sandi. I need to remember not to insult her family and hope that their insults have a similar effectas weird as that sounds.
Originally Posted By: sandi2
You need to have something in mind for a consequence whenever she shows disrespect.
What would be a suitable punishment for example?
Originally Posted By: sandi2
As far as being sexy, well......how did you win her the first time around? Did somebody have to teach you how to act sexy? LOL.....I bet not. But somehow, we tend to forget how to be that way after M. Maybe some need a refresher course.
Here is a very sad truth, I DO NOT KNOW. I did not ever pursue her or any other girlfriend I had. They pursued me. I never felt "sexy", I was just me. But I was also 6'2" and 185lbs. star of the soccer team. Not so much now. Hell there were a lot of girls I found out later who were basically throwing themselves at me and I did not know it. My W is the only person I have ever "been" with and really I would like it to stay that way. But I guess I have to learn how to be Sexy. Are there books or something? LOL. I am working on losing weight, especially after the heart attack scare. But it will take some time.
Originally Posted By: sandi2
You know that old saying of how people want what they can't have, a WAW is very much that way. That is why the LBH is often told to go out at night, leaving her alone, and GAL. She sees him all decked out looking sexy and going out. He shows no interest in her. He is polite to her, but he is that way with "everyone". She doesn't seem to be anyone special or important to him.
Can I do this with S at home? Part of her issue with me was that she did not feel I did enough with our S. Although he and I are spending a lot of time together now I fear she will think I am leaving him alone. I do not mind going out, I would love to. Have done it a few times since our split. I even went out and spent $200 on new clothes and cologne and stuff to go out the one time. Weird thing is that when I got home at 12:30AM she was in bed. Very weird for a Saturday night since she rarely goes to bed before 1 or 2AM.
Originally Posted By: sandi2
So, she starts to test things. She tries to flirt.....and he doesn't cave. Then she turns on the charm and even iniates sex, and it still doesn't seem to interest him. By now she is really wondering what is going on in his life and she has forgotten about the reasons she was using to leave. He has caused the sexual attraction to rise again!
Most of the LBH's won't hold out long enough. Most are wearing their heart on their sleeve and that is not attractive. Women love men who show strength......especially where the wife is concerned. But, I wonder if men get strength confused with negative things. Showing strength is not showing meaness or abusiveness. It is not being rude & crude. It is standing on one's principles and not giving in to what they believe is wrong.
I think I can do this if I work on it. It will be difficult, but if it means getting W back, I am in.
Originally Posted By: sandi2
The one thing that most women seem to think is really sexy is a man who is comfortable in his own skin......self-confidence. From what I've read, men think that about women, too. Can a H who is acting all needy, clingy, and desperate show self-confidence? Nope.
And this is why I am in the situation I am in. I lost all self confidence, and I do mean all including the will to live. That is why I turned my life around so quickly when she left. I knew that W and S were the last good things in my life. At least at the time that is how it felt. So I NEEDED to make those changes to keep them. What I realize now is that I needed those changes for ME. When I feel good, and I have self-confidence, everything else just falls into place. I feel like for the first time in my life that I have a life of my own (no other influence like parents). I feel like I have wanted to feel my whole life and I am sad it took this long to realize it. I just finished first semester in college and made Dean’s list(even with all of this drama going on), finished my first full season of soccer in 4 years and became one of the better players and reworked a loan on our house which took over a year. Been following up with things instead of letting them drop like I used to. I have shed the negative influences and baggage and am refreshed. The only thing that is bringing me down now is the lack of affection W gives me. She is my weakness. I really need to follow all you have said here and what you say is GOLD. It really all makes sense.
Originally Posted By: sandi2
Well, I am a long way from being through with this subject, but this is probably enough for now.
Let me just add this once more, if my H would have acted as if he was dumping "me" when I was focused in on the OM, that EA would have been cut a lot shorter than it was. But, my H tried to smother me with his presence, his affection, saying he loved me (to get me to say it back), etc. All of that just turned me off. It was not sexy at all. See what I am saying?
I think I understand. So what do you suggest since we are living in the same house. You gave me advise a while ago not to follow her around, and I don’t. I let her do her thing and I do mine. One place I slip WAY TOO MUCH is that she is in love with Facebook and texting. Constant texts and always on the freakin phone or computer. It is rude and she ignores S and I. I do sometimes ask, who that was or what’s up when she receives these texts. I cannot control her or her friends and I really do not want to. But it is annoying and hurtful that she would rather give her attention to all of her friends on a machine than to her family. Sorry for the long post, but this is great stuff you have Sandi, I thank you and everybody who has been helping me through this (OTM, Coach among others ) more than you could know. BTW Sandi… Did you ever think of writing some chapters with all of this perspective to submit to Ms. Weiner-Davis? It would be an invaluable addition to the DR so that LBH’s have a perspective of what is going through the mind of their WAW? Your rules for the WAW I printed and have in a safe personal spot and review them.
Sandi, I am understanding more of what you say every day. The last few nights W has been grouchy and irratable and snapping at S for almost no reason. It has been the best repellant I could ask for so that I do not want to be close to her. I ask her what is wrong and if she wants to talk, but she just says nothnig is wrong. I know her and I know that looks she has, and somethign is wrong. But let it go and stay in a good cordial mood and have fun with my S. Right now, between the way she has treated me and the constant bad mood, I am not sure I want to be with her anymore. But, I will not make that decision based on a few days, especially since it affects my innocent S.
Find a men's soccer team to play on. This should be at the top of your list. It will help you in so many ways. When did your wife find you attractive?
Quote:
I ask her what is wrong and if she wants to talk, but she just says nothnig is wrong. I know her and I know that looks she has, and somethign is wrong.
Classic DAM. That's how us guys talk to each other.
Try this next time. Stop everything, focus on her, make eye contact, have open body language, speak calmly and listen carefully to her.
"I can feel that something is bothering you. How can I help you right now?"
M22,H45,W45 S21/18D12 Retain faith that you will prevail in the end, regardless of the difficulties and at the same time confront the most brutal facts of your current reality, whatever they might be.
