still separated, headed for D?

[newmama]

Thank you Mrs. A.

Mindfull, I realize you are relieved to divorce your husband and I know that makes a world of a difference! I am happy you embrace the divorce because then it makes things much easier.

And, I am not really sure what you need to talk to your H about (RE: a divorce). Like you said you have a parenting plan in place and an asset division plan in place. You have been open, kind and more than compassionate despite his behavior. IMO all you need to do is get the paperwork, sign it and have him served. He certainly didn't bend over backwards and get your input on HIS decisions so follow suit and do what is best for you.

Well you certainly are full of opinions about how other people should live our lives! I will explain what I am talking about in about 10 days. (the divorce talk)My goodness--I know we all love to see a good argument and conflict is sooo fun to watch! But I am tired of defending why I am doing what I am and Mrs. A-- you get it. Sorry Citygirl but you haven't caused me to change my mind! I guess I now feel more confident that for me, what I have done is what I can live with. I don't feel regret and I didn't do anything that violated the kind of person I want to be.


Gatsby- you are right- if it is scary that COULD mean it is a good thing! I think I did a very good job of showing my strength on 4/28 when I spent the month before planning and preparing how to execute my response and actions. I plan to spend the next 4 weeks doing the same. If my marriage is going to end I plan to go out with a bang!

[newmama]

Ok got the bedtime adjusted! I started asking him when S fell asleep over there and he said between 7-8. So I said that he falls asleep between 7:30-8 over here. I said I think he needs a consistent bedtime going back and forth. WH said he agrees and let's talk about it more. He will drop him off at 8 this week and we can try it out. I don't know what there is to talk about! But I just said "sounds good- I will make my plans accordingly. I do want you to be able to see him more, but maybe you could adjust your schedule on Mon and Thurs although I know you are busy!"

Thanks again, WN for noticing this bedtime issue!

[newmama]

Will this criticism help the person or hurt them more?
Will this make me "right" or make me happy?

Citygirl, I think you have some very good harsh truth observations that will help some people who are stuck.

But you also do have a way of going just a little too far that caused me to lose you.

Meaning instead of being angry but thinking "well, she could be right. I should think about that." I reacted with anger and "that is just plain mean and upsets me more than helps me! I can't do anything about it and she still needs to say it because it helps her to feel good about getting it off of her chest and BEING RIGHT!"


Citygirl- I was hanging in there with you on these points:

1)I am letting WH have all the power
2)I need to be sure that accommodations I am making are for S and not WH and OW
3)WH sees me as a mother and not the woman he wants to be with
4)WH has no motivation to divorce me because he doesn't have to in order to get what he is getting

BUT then there is a point where if you want the reader to be able to receive and process and consider what you are saying, you don't want to lose their affinity. Also, it makes me think "oh, she has this bias all along where because SHE THINKS my husband is scum, I SHOULD THINK he is and she is not seeing the points about him that I know. Therefore, her advice is NULL to me because she is being subjective."

How does saying this help me to accept divorce?
"The OW is a bad influence on your S and so is your H for choosing her."

Again, I have NO LEGAL grounds to prevent OW from seeing my son. I do not believe a second that anything I say to WH will cause him to leave OW. So IMO that comment is just hurtful. Sure, you can say that you didn't intend to hurt me. But please have some consideration for the power of words- they evoke emotions and create images! I have come soooo far in being able to ACCEPT divorce if that is what will happen!

There were other comments but because you just have to put the disclaimer of IMO and I am not intending to hurt you, it seems to give yourself permission to say whatever.

I know YOU did not cause ME to feel this way, I caused myself, I am in charge of my own reactions to people. So now I will need to find a way to comfort myself.

WORDS MATTER. Use them wisely! I am letting you know this publicly in case it might sink in and help you edit your responses to people. If I feel this way, I know others must as well.

[CityGirl]

Sorry to hear you feel that way. I am glad you are speaking for yourself, it is helpful so I know what is going on between me and you. If somebody else has something to say why not let them say it instead of speaking for them? IMO it is more productive to communicate one on one then say gossip elsewhere about how mean I am, no?

Unless I misread and misunderstood you totally you did say you were looking to get some alternate opinions.

The reason I put the "disclaimer" on my posts to you was really quite simple. You sort of got bent when I used to post often to Flowmom and way back then started alluding to the fact you thought I was mean and harsh. Instead of doing that dance with you again I thought perhaps I would let you know right off the bat my intention was to provide you with an alternate opinion NOT with the intent of being "mean" (again, gossip is not nice!) but to post what you said (or so I thought) you wanted... alternate opinions/viewpoints to your situation.

Yes, words do matter, I agree. Does that go for both of us or just me?

As I have said a few times I can't begin to imagine what it feels like to be left while you are pregnant. I just can't. While I am glad you have the support of the other women here who have been in the same situation (and I am equally as horrified for them) it also keeps you in a bubble so to speak. Sort of like it would be VERY easy for me to gather a group of women who have lupus and are very ill and had there H's leave them (which is what happened to me) and only view the situation through the bubble of *only* being sick or pregnant.

You had posted that a great concern you had was your son bonding with OW so you thought the best course of action was to have your H over more so your son would have less exposure to OW. I know I am not crazy, I know you posted that. My point was if you do divorce you will have less "control" (and control is probably not the best word to use) over who your son spends time with when he is not in your care.

I understand legally you may have no recourse. What I said was just because the law says there is nothing you can do it doesn't prevent you from having a discussion with your H about it. On the flip side if you do divorce and you do start dating somebody would you be appalled if your H came to talk to you about the role your new boyfriend would play in your son's life? Seeing how hard you work to be a good mother I would speculate that although it would be an uncomfortable/difficult discussion to have it might be good for the BOTH of you.

You said you see no benefit it talking to your H. Or you asked what the benefit would be. Well, to me the benefit would be you and your H are being open and honest about the people you both expose your son to in his formative years and the level of involvement "they" (they = his GF, a future BF of yours) will have in your child's life.

While I have confidence in you that you will choose a quality man to share your time with in the future, from what you have posted it seems your H has chosen a woman who is not of your caliber. And there is not a whole lot you can do about that (his choices I mean) but his choices (or yours for that matter) should not prevent you from having any discussion you feel is important. And if you worry (or whatever feeling you have) about the OW and your son, despite the fact you have no legal recourse, why not simply put it out there in a reasonable manner with your H? In turn, maybe one day he will have to come to you and have the same conversation about the man in your life. None of that was suggested to you as some grand design to get your H to leave the OW. It was suggested to you because you seemed to be concerned about your son bonding with OW.

I feel you think that when I suggest you set firm boundaries or do something different or reclaim your power you equate that to some sort of dramatic, trailer trash, hair pulling scene. IMO quiet action is far more effective and never once did I suggest you go in swinging.

I don't think your H is scum. I don't know your H. What I have surmised based on what you have shared is he has made some very bad choices for himself, you and his son. I never once said your H was scum.

And a person who makes long term bad and harmful choices is not void of good qualities but had your H not made these choices you would not be here, no?

As I told you y'day I went back and read your threads posted in your signature. IIRC one of the first people to respond to you was a poster named "no code blue" and he/she essentially expressed the same thing I have... while your H might have good qualities the choices he is making as a husband and father are not good.

I don't say anything to anybody in order to make myself "feel good". I would like to be wrong 10,000% of the time when it comes to this site. I would like for there to be NO NEED for this site to exist.

I really hope you are able to find a solution that is best for you and your son. If you have a problem with me I would much prefer direct communication rather that gossip and attacks. But right now what is most important is for you to keep moving forward so you can make the best life you can for you. I know somehow you will find a way to do that.

Take care.

[newmama]

I mean this honestly- you will make a fantastic lawyer but I think you should be a trial lawyer! I suck at arguing and conflict. No wonder I am getting divorced, HA!

[newmama]

Ok so today I took S with me to do some shopping. As soon as we entered the clothing store he started fussing! I tried my best to distract him. There were several stylish spring/summer blouses and capri pants I wanted to try on and where to upcoming events but S just was not a happy camper!

So I tried on several clothes. loved a couple, but ended up needing to walk out the store without buying any. What gets me is that before I had kids, I was sooo judgmental!If I was in the dressing room and heard a baby crying I would think "now why in the world would she take him shopping?"

But now I see, obviously, that some moms do not have fathers of their children around to watch the kids. Shame on me!

Then after, I took S to get his hair cut. We went to a walk in place. He sure squirmed and fussed but his hair was getting that mullet look so I had to get it done! What is funny is that the place WH chose cost $17 for a hair cut for S, this place cost $12, and let's just say sometimes "you get what you pay for!"

Hey, it is still better than if I tried to cut it!

Turns out S likes grocery stores way more than clothing stores (what a boy!) so we were able to pick up a few items and I am making mango salsa tomorrow. But tonight am about to head to the Single Parents Sunday night dinner! J almost flaked out but then decided that you just never know who you might meet (she is on the market!) so we are carpooling. It is so nice to not be alone!!

[courageous wife]

Hi NM

Just stopping by to say hello!! My kids are 11 and 14 and I still don't like shopping for myself when they are with!!!

I bet S's haircut is cute no matter what!

Have a great time tonight! You are doing very good at galing!!!

[newmama]

Thanks CW- yeah I guess there is no age for shopping with kids!

Well just got back from the dinner. This time there were people closer to my age. Mid-late 30s, early 40s. The youngest kids were 3 though.

We had a good time, S was happy and loved "playing" with the other kids. But I was chatting with a couple parents, one was a dad, and he asked me my story. Of course all I said was "we are about to start the process. He has a girlfriend, left when I was pregnant,and we have been separated since.He chose her!"

Uhmm...duh- sometimes I do not think before speaking (a lot) and I think I didn't need to add 'he chose her!' because after that, the dad totally ignored me! Now I was just being friendly but I clearly got the impression that something was wrong with me for being cheated on or I was coming across as someone with baggage?
I don't know- I do know I need to find a way to explain why I have an 11 month old and am separated.

So maybe just say "well we are separated and probably headed for divorce" and that is that? ANd like I have said, I won't date until I am ready.

But I did hear from several that the divorce takes a year at least. These people used lawyers. One person said they had to tell their lawyers "please do what we are asking you to do." because the lawyers wanted to drag it out for money. NOw I don't know if that is true because I have read a bunch of stories now where the attorneys are not encouraging the couple to divorce!

J was able to find a dad she liked and although there was a cute, petite, friendly woman who was chatting him up at first, J was able to end the night talking to him! Yippee! I think she said I was good "encouragement" or she felt supported even though I did nothing!

So I do still feel self conscious being single with a young baby, but I do the "fake it til you make it" thing and act confident, I befriend the mothers in the group first, and dress conservatively. I'm being serious!

[CityGirl]

Newmama - you are doing a very good job at your GAL adventures.

There is one last thing I would like to clear up then I will refrain from further comment.

I am not arguing with you. I am posting alternative viewpoints. You might not like them or you might feel challenged by them but that doesn't have to mean it's a conflict.

I have followed your thread for a while now for a few reasons:

#1. I am sort of amazed you are still standing after being left while pregnant AND having to deal with an OW and a young child. That is a compliment.

#2. I admire the fact you have tried *many* different approaches with your husband even though I might not agree or understand why you do things the way you do. Since you have mastered flexibility and I have not; I follow your thread to see what I can learn from you.

#3. You have said a few times that you are very certain your H lives with OW but has not officially said so. I can relate to that 110% because my H did the same thing for a long time and it nearly killed me. I can openly admit to this day, even though this happened over a year ago, it still hurts my feelings and makes me very upset when I think about. I was actually curious as to how you seem to deal with it since you clearly are dealing with it much better than I did.

IOW I didn't go trolling on your thread to argue with you. You stated you wanted some alternative viewpoints so I offered them. Now that is just fine if you didn't like them, no problem, but it doesn't have to mean we are arguing or having a conflict.

You said yourself you were going to try and not analyze everything little thing your H said or did. That is not easy, I know. IMO that also means you are so emotionally twisted up in this situation (and who wouldn't be?) that maybe you are glossing over certain things because you are just so involved.

We are both strong in different ways. Two strong women challenging one another doesn't have to mean we are arguing or one of us is "mean".

It is sort of difficult to know how to communicate with you when you ask for alternative viewpoints and when they are expressed you say "well, you sure do know how to run somebody else's life!". I am lucky I can run my own life and I don't want to run your life or anybody else's for that matter. I was just providing what you requested.

You have decided what you think of me and that is fine. You have made your feelings more than clear. But your personal feelings for me don't make my thoughts less valid or worthy of consideration. Or at the very least I am not sure I deserve to be lashed out at.

Part of the reason I read through your old threads was my first reaction to allowing your H come over all the time was "geesh, this woman is STUPID for allowing this". Then I read through everything you had posted and better understood WHY you made that choice (if your H was at your house with your son it lessened the bonding time with OW). And then I thought "geesh, this woman is pretty damn smart". So I am glad I didn't post my first initial reaction until I had read through all the facts you had posted.

That is all I really wanted to say. Thanks.

[newmama]

Citygirl- I was not gossiping about you! I need to go back to Flowmom's thread and see what I said! I think you said I insulted you, right?

Was it "wow, Citygirl that was harsh?" I am sorry. You are right- I was not thinking of the power of my words. I think I thought it was ok to say it because if someone said "Newmama, wow, that was harsh!" when I told someone they needed to choose one plan and stick to it or something like that, (I don't remember what you told Flowmom) I would not be hurt or offended but take it as "oh, really? was I?" But you see that is ME.

So it is wrong of me to think that other people would react the same as me- and I don't even know you so I shouldn't feel like I can criticize you. I am sorry. You have mentioned this a couple of times so I can see that it did, truly, hurt your feelings! I was wrong! I will defend myself though if I feel insulted! I was just telling you that I took the unnecessary comment to be mean and self serving. I should have followed the 48 hour rule and not said anything at all.


I think you DO care about people and want to help them by breaking their false view of things. We need this. This is why I asked for other viewpoints. BUt just as it was wrong of me to say "that was harsh!" to you (please let me know what I said), I still think you should consider what you want to say and think about the point in saying it. I hope I have improved my tact since Daybyday was offended by me saying her husband was cuckoo for wanting to leave her.

It may be true, but is it hurtful more than helpful or vice versa?

I should have said "your husband will surely regret his decision one day. He is damn lucky to have you." or not said anything at all!


And I will let you have the last word if you want to respond because, seriously, I would recommend your legal services to anyone! In fact, I referred posters to you for advice several times! It's good you will get paid one day.