question - what is the time line of your sitch, in particular, when did the bomb drop, when did he move out and when did he move back in and when did you notice a definite change?
if you have recited these things before, forgive me, i just can't find it
Jeannine, Tell me more how you figured out what his LL were. I think one of my H's is just plain talking, and it's SO hard to come up with stuff to talk about for some reason! I truly don't know what to ask him/say to him. I know he does not talk to me like he does other people. How do I get him to open up? We need to talk about things other than our kids and work, but what?? Current events? I hate the news and never watch it so I'm not real good at that topic. I don't thave problems talking to other people either, but to him I'm clueless what to say! Rachael
Quote: I love how you kindly cut through the chase...
Thanks. It's just that I remember how overwhelmed I felt during that initial period of disorientation that follows the dropping of the bomb. Simple things like...oh let's see...thinking... was too much of a challenge for me. I just wanted a simple recipe to follow. Or should I say, try to follow.
... and remember men love to teach about topics they are interested in... makes them feel important or something...
One good trick is to make a comment on something that directly goes against his pet theory... ('honey, I read somewhere so and so')... usually gets them going proving to you how incorrect that assertion is...
"You don't throw a whole life away just 'cause it's banged up a little"
Tom Smith in "Seabiscuit"
Quote: Tell me more how you figured out what his LL were.
Glad you asked. There is a book (which is a favorite around here) called "The five Love Languages" by Chapman. I highly recommend it and it should answer that question much more thoroughly than I can.
Quote: I truly don't know what to ask him/say to him.
Then be a good listener, ask questions. You can always use validation in order to keep the conversation going, and the plus side of that is you'll be accomplishing two positives at the same time. A true economy of energy.
Quote: We need to talk about things other than our kids and work, but what??
Agreed. What did you use to talk about when things were more comfortable between you? For my H and me, politics is a major topic, one in which we connect completely and have an endless stream of issues to choose from.
How about introducing something completely new?
Experiment.
Quote: I guess I have to learn the gift of gab huh?
Well...I'm not sure what that would entail - not sure about the kind of pressure you might be putting on yourself by thinking of it quite like that. Personally, I'd lean toward being an active listener to start with and then let it flow naturally from there.
Quote: question - what is the time line of your sitch, in particular, when did the bomb drop, when did he move out and when did he move back in and when did you notice a definite change?
We were in a state of decline for a few years, but it wasn't until October of last year that I noticed some unsettling changes in my H's demeanor and behavior. This coincided with the hiring of the woman who quickly became the OW.
H officially dropped the bomb in Janurary of 2003. He wanted to end our marriage at this point and pushed to leave. He gradually moved out over the following months but did not start the physical nights away (on a part time basis) until this past summer.
H appeared to lose interest in living else where midway into autumn. His changes were gradual and faltering.
I can't say that I noticed a definite change, because it unfolded by degree.
Quote: So, having said that... 1. I ceased all questions regarding OW. 2. I backed way off from discussing our relationship. 3. I kept my fear, insecurity and unhappiness out of the view of my H. (Okay, there were a few splippages - . We're only human afterall). 4. I explored and practiced my H's love language as often as possible. 5. I Practiced patience beyond any measure previously. 6. I learned to zip my lip and stop having the last word for the most part. 7. I practiced the fine art of doing nothing in times of doubt.
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OMG!!! This would be my list EXACTLY....
However, in my case, there eventually was a lot of discussion about OW (initiated and okayed by CJ...he may have come to regret that a few times).
But after I got my questions answered, over a period of a month or so??? Then a few lingering ones? That was pretty much it.
Now actually I'd LIKE more discussions of our R...
And I must agree with your and Pam's advice to Rachael (Hi R!) regarding the "conversation" thing. It IS mostly about active listening...the eye contact, the smile, the nod...the prompts..."really!?" "What else?"
Studies show that people rate as the best CONVERSATIONALISTS those who actually spend more time asking questions of them and then listening actively!!!
So, what does your H find interesting?
If it has anything to do with Psychology I'm your source!!!
was too much of a challenge for me. 
