Husband being hateful and cruel. Is this a stage?

[AJM]

I am terrified that if he does not come to grips with what actually did happen in his horrible childhood before our divorce is final, it will devastate him when he realizes what damage he's done. But, again there is nothing I can do to stop that from happening. Yes, I pray constantly for him!

As JTB mentioned, there is no guarantee he will ever tell himself the truth. To be honest, and I know you may not want to hear it, he may never admit it to himself. He may blame you forever. More likely he will tell you he blames you for a very long time, but the risk exists with no mitigation.

I almost think it's easier for him to not face reality because he has moved away, doesn't see any family, doesn't go to our church anymore; basically doesn't have anyone around him that would challenge him or demand accountability. And, of course I realize that's what they do! They have to feel better about themselves, so they surround themselves with people who are worse off than they are. And those people certainly aren't going to criticize him since compared to them he's got it all together!

Yep. Exactly. The friends they keep! Sheesh. Night and day. And yet, I find that in my case, she also seeks out male friends with similar personality traits to mine. I find that amusing at this stage. I'll explain more of that later...

This afternoon I went to the doctor because my allergies are trying to kill me. sick I mentioned my husband's latest accusations towards me and the doc just brushed it off. He said "well, that's what happens in marriages. You've been married a long time and it takes 2 people to work on it. We may never find out what is really going on with him." At first I felt like him and h were ganging up on me. Then I realized I was the one acting paranoid and our doctor just can't be a go between for us. However, last November when this all started the doc let me know that my h had been talking to him for over a year about our marriage and how he had no feelings for me. Why the doc did not realize what was happening is beyond me! The medical assistant suggested that I change who is allowed to pick up scripts for me and can get medical info. about me. Right now it's still my h and my daughter. I haven't changed it yet. I asked her why she suggested this and if she could tell me if h changed his. She looked and sure enough, his says no one but himself can get any info. about him! Amazing. That makes me wonder if anything happened to him if I would be allowed to make emergency decisions for him and would be told anything about him. The medical assistant also told me my h is a completely different person than who she knew. She said she does not like this new guy. I am comforted just knowing someone else sees what I see.

Yeah, that is odd right? Except it fits. Mine has done similar. Still is especially when I pay attention. Go figure but it's part of it. It's as if the world is a stage....

At this point I pretty much find it amusing to see some of the things she does. Why? Because it would be like watching a teenager and their shenanigans. It is laughable to some degree. I also find it heartbreaking and disappointing. In the end of it all, the MLC'r has made their own decisions. Those decisions led to what they are doing now.
Will they ever "wake up" and figure out what they lost? Nobody knows. Your doctor told you that as well. I have to admit, I read your post describing things and you know what? I, like many others on this board, could have written it for you and just left <insert name> here.
But you have to realize he made his choices. He is living with them. You do already realize you cannot help him. You should also realize by now that it is NOT you. And therefore you cannot help him. Seems repetitive, but it's important to do that. You should also realize the immense pressure he is actually feeling even if just expressing it as anger towards you. Don't let him. He needs to have a reason to express his anger where it belongs and not at you. Not only would it tire you out even more, but it doesn't help anyone.
There will be more insane things and I think it's good that you questioned was it something else. Now put that to rest. It is like insanity. It is avoidance. It is not something you can do anything about.
I know that last part took me a long time to come to terms with and to internalize. The abuse I took helped drive that home.
I have no regrets for the things I've done. I'm just done and moving on. I don't think she ever will come back. At this point, even if she does, I'm not going to be there. I believe it will not only be that long, but she made the choices already. She could have chosen differently and that's a simple fact. She asked for the divorce and I've agreed to no longer fight her on it. I don't hate her though. For many of the same reasons you don't hate your husband.
It does have a long lead time - the year you spoke of? Mine did similar. The friends that don't like them anymore? Yep. The family they avoid? Yep. The idea that everyone else is wrong and they are right? Yep. The idea that if they saw somebody else doing what they are doing they would tell them to get a counselor. Yep, yep, and yep.

It's sad. But no need to be angry. No need to hate. It is. And that's about it.

AJ

[covenantkeeper]

To be honest, and I know you may not want to hear it, he may never admit it to himself. He may blame you forever. More likely he will tell you he blames you for a very long time, but the risk exists with no mitigation.
[quote]

[quote]At this point I pretty much find it amusing to see some of the things she does. Why? Because it would be like watching a teenager and their shenanigans. It is laughable to some degree. I also find it heartbreaking and disappointing. In the end of it all, the MLC'r has made their own decisions. Those decisions led to what they are doing now.

You should also realize the immense pressure he is actually feeling even if just expressing it as anger towards you. Don't let him. He needs to have a reason to express his anger where it belongs and not at you.

Yes, in the back of my head I realize it's possible for him to blame me forever. And I know I am in denial of this. It's hard for me to be standing and believing for a reconciliation and at the same time acknowledge this. And yes I do know that almost all of us could just fill in our spouses' names with just about the same situations. That's the part that makes it so frustrating for me!! It's textbook MLC and there is nothing we can do to make them realize it! I know that some here say not to ever mention to them that they are in MLC. I agree and disagree with that. To me, it's like not telling a loved one we've noticed a health problem they are having. And instead of letting them know as gently and kindly as possible, and offering to take them to the doctor, we would just sit back and keep our mouths shut?! That just seems asinine to me! Not to mention cruel and irresponsible. However, I also realize the MLC'r will not listen or recognize they are in MLC.

As for them making their own decisions, yes they have. But, they made them with a mixed up mind. I wouldn't blame my grandmother when she made decisions that turned out not so great and then we found out she had dementia. I guess I am having a hard time knowing my h can ruin our entire lives while not taking responsibility for it and not owning up to the possibility of MLC. While I want to be understanding, patient, kind, loving......at the same time I am just plain ticked off!!! And that makes me even more ticked off at his family who is supporting him all the way. They are the real demented ones in my opinion. Who supports a man abandoning his family?! That's just crazy!! And majorly selfish! Which is what I've said about them for 33 years. H used to agree with me. Now he's just using them since they agree with him.

Today is a bittersweet day for me. It's the anniversary of h giving me my engagement ring. And it's also the anniversary of the day my father passed away. So, I have great memories of him giving me my ring and I also have wonderful memories of how attentive he was to me at that very difficult time when my dad died. It is beyond sad that this loving, compassionate man has changed so drastically. The man who would come home and say "have I told you today that I love you?" will not be here to celebrate/remember this day. So, today I am sad and allowing myself to cry.

The part about them feeling immense pressure is somehow comforting to me today. As a matter of fact, I hope he is somewhat miserable every day and thinks about what he has done. And what he has lost. I'm sorry, but I'm tired of being the strong, supportive, responsible sane spouse. I don't get to run away.

Ok, enough pity party for me today. I think I will go take out my anger on cleaning my house.

I am sorry that you are to the point where you don't feel like fighting her on the divorce anymore. I know you have been at this for a long time and you're tired. It's just sad that she couldn't see how much you wanted to keep your marriage together. She does not know what she is losing. I think she will eventually come to this realization. Unfortunately, it might be too late. And I'm sorry for that. Take care.

[Marked&Healed]

Ultimately, none of them realize what they are losing until it's too late.

[bel44]

wow. that sucks.

[AJM]

CK, let me start by saying thank you. Let me add to that, it's ok to cry. In fact, I think you should from time to time. You will feel these emotions. It's ok. It's normal. Being tired is normal.

I will point out that I did not give up. I was told that it was over by both my pastor and my MC. Neither of them gave up easily either. I asked for their help for that reason. I fought. I continued to fight, but I have to at some point acknowledge that there is nothing left to fight for. I have done that and I'm moving on. I realize I can't go back. Therefore neither can she.
Whether or not they ever realize that they drove away something worth keeping is to be determined. They did not lose something. They pushed it away, stomped on it and burned it to the ground. So be it.

I do sometimes feel sorry for her. But then I realize she made her choices and this is what she wanted. Right mind or not, and that's debatable, this is what she wanted. She is who she wants to be. Same for your husband. He is who he wants to be and regardless of how he feels, it is his choice how he wants to handle things.

Don't be sad for very long. Don't be angry for very long. It only hurts you. You know that, but it's harder to live it. The pain and feelings will come for a very long time - let them. Ride the wave..Learn to swim...Learn to surf these waves.

Being the strong one? You are though. It's like being the older and responsible sibling - you were chosen to be that person. To think otherwise invites a slide into their world. That would be worse if you ask me.

Live well. Regardless of what he does. Live well.

Any further word on the job front?

AJ

[covenantkeeper]

AJM,
A long time ago a pastor and a counselor told me I should divorce my husband. I didn't go that route and they later came to me and apologized to me saying they were wrong. So, I hope you aren't making a decision based upon these 2 opinions. Make sure it's what you feel inside, which I'm sure you have.

No job yet, but I do have a possible lead.

As you know, I have only contacted my h about business stuff. And I do that by leaving him a voice mail message or texting him briefly. Usually I get no response out of him at all and I leave it at that. Yesterday, for the 1st time, I actually saw the rebellious teenager in him. I know he's acted that way before, but this was the first time I knew what it was when it happened. And I laughed! Of course, he doesn't know that since I just sent back a text to him and remained brief and to the point in my response. I swear this Monster in him is really pathetic. If our own kids had acted like that when they were teens, he would have wanted to smack them!

I told him that I had found some more of his books while going through some boxes and that after I found them all I would drop them off at his place. And then I would also give him the mail he's received here and the electric bill that the court ordered him to pay. He threw a major temper tantrum and told me not to come near his place. He wanted to receive the electric bill in the mail by Wednesday and said he would get the rest of his stuff in Nov. when the divorce is final. He went on to say I disgusted him, he hated the sight of me and the sound of my voice, he couldn't wait to be rid of me, and the real kicker was goodbye and good riddance! Good grief. I imagined him stomping his feet while he said all of that. I would have thought if I really disgusted him, he would have felt that way a couple of months ago when he was taking me out to dinner once a week. But, he started saying all this crap after our last court date when I told him I thought he was playing me and I had decided to only talk to him about business stuff.

The more I stay away from him, the worse he gets! It all sounds like projection to me. I think he's really disgusted by his own actions and the sound of my voice and seeing me is just a reminder of his own failure. The only thing that I said to him was that I hoped we could act like adults with whatever brief encounters we had with each other. That went over like a wet balloon.

I plan on going to talk to our pastor sometime this week. I haven't actually sat down and talked to him about all of this since h left. So, I have a lot to fill him in on. I've only told him a few details. My husband went to talk to him quite a few times before he left. Pastor told me he was concerned about him spiritually and that he thought he even had a low opinion of who he was in Christ. I told him I thought that's because his depression is so bad. He doesn't believe anything good about himself, even if it's from God! I also think h feels so bad about himself that he's trying to push me away.

I have read the threads about midlife crisis stages, but I can't remember if these child and teenage personalities are present in every stage. I think they can be until they start to come out of MLC.

The funny part about what you said about being the oldest in the family is that we both are the oldest in our families. However, since my husband's mother got remarried and his stepfather already had one son and they went on to have 2 more boys, I think h had a lot more adjustments than I had. Of course, everyone reacts differently to life even when the situations are similar. Maybe I am stronger than I think I am. Right now I'm just tired of it going on and I lose patience in waiting and standing every now and then. I suppose that could be normal. There are times when I want to scream at h and tell him it's time to man up and come home and be responsible again. Of course, I know not to do that and I know the end of MLC isn't as easy as that. Oh, but do I wish it were! I mean come on, with all the new medications and cures to stuff out there, you would think someone would figure out something to make this MLC stuff shorter. Maybe acupuncture. LOL! Of course then all the MLC spouses would want to be the ones to stick the needles in them....so that forget that idea! Ha!

[Marked&Healed]

I am so sorry H is being so hateful. I know you said you laughed, but it must have stunned you also. Please know it's entirely projection, as you said. Don't even let a little bit of his negativity affect you.

You're doing so well. Keep it up! Man, I have three teens living in my house, two are twins who fight CONSTANTLY - plus, their mom just moved half way down the US, and they feel that she abandoned them, and then suddenly, their dad moves out and an alien-teen moves in... imagine my grief. LOLOL. I hear you about "If our own kids had acted like that when they were teens, he would have wanted to smack them!"

Remember, He gives us what He knows we can handle... you ARE stronger than you think.

And I hear ya about the medications... LOL. I found an article that said that in the early stages of an A, you could give antidepressants and it would block the receptors so the infatuation chemicals would not take hold... take a guess how quickly I was trying to figure out how to get a hold of some of those meds? LOL. Couldn't figure out how to morally feed a man drugs that he didn't know he was getting, so crossed that off my list right quick... but it would have been nice. Now that I know he's in MLC, it would have been bad, probably prolonged it.

[MrBond]

covenantkeeper,

Have you thought of having him pick up the mail from your home on his own? I mean if you are that hideous to be around, it seems like he should be the one to get his own stuff when he feels like it. If he gets in trouble with the court it's his problem.

He's projecting big time and you are right not to engage him when he's int hose moods.

[covenantkeeper]

MrBond,

LOL! Oh yes I suggested he pick up the mail, but you can probably guess his answer. He tells me to mail it to him. I told him since I am practically destitute, I don't have any extra money to go buy large envelopes and mail stuff. He's just being childish. And I think he's trying his best to be in control. He wants me to jump when he tells me something. And that is the exact opposite of the man I married.

Marked&Healed,

Yes, it does hurt when he says hateful stuff. It's one of the ways Satan can then attempt to sit on my shoulder and whisper lies in my ears. He repeats all those lies to me over and over again. So, besides learning to deal with the craziness of MLC, I am learning to stand my ground and tell Satan where he can go! Ha!

I'll admit I have periods of weakness where I am just tired of all this. I know people who are in depression don't realize everything they do or say. However, since my h has been in depression in one way or another for 33 years, I am a lot less patient. I have told him many times in the past before this MLC came up that denying he has a problem and refusing to go to the doctor is irresponsible, selfish, and lets him play the martyr act. And his behavior was an example to our children. Unfortunately, one of my boys is just like him. We used to kid him by saying he was a clone of his father. Now, it's not so funny. Thankfully, his twin brother is exactly the opposite. He laughs all the time, and never lets anything get to him. Their 2nd grade teacher told me that he was the kind of person who would never get an ulcer...he'd just cause others around him to get one! He didn't turn out to be as bad as she predicted. However, they prove that being an identical twin does not mean everything they do is the same. It's just their physical makeup that's identical! And, yes I still get them mixed up sometimes. If I just glance at them or if I only hear them say a few words without looking at them, I have no idea which is which. They give me a hard time about it....exclaiming that certainly by now their own mother would know the difference! And mine fought all the time!!! Being boys, their fights got physical and I always swore they were trying to kill each other. So much so that on one occasion that was the first thing that went through my mind. I had left them at home (they were in junior high) and went to pick up my daughter at school. The boys were getting over the flu, so had stayed home that day. I was not gone more than 15 minutes. and I came home to an ambulance in front of my house. I thought they had killed each other. But, it was my laid back son who had a seizure. His brother did everything perfect in getting help for him. Well, all except for punching him in the stomach because he thought his brother was faking and trying to scare him to death! Ha! But, besides that minor detail, he was perfect. LOL!

[AJM]

AJM,
A long time ago a pastor and a counselor told me I should divorce my husband. I didn't go that route and they later came to me and apologized to me saying they were wrong. So, I hope you aren't making a decision based upon these 2 opinions. Make sure it's what you feel inside, which I'm sure you have.

You are right. I know there is a part of me that still doesn't want this. But they were not the only ones I talked to and my reasons were not that I quit, but rather stopped fighting her for the divorce. Part of me knows that after several years of carrying this alone, it's time for her to carry things - either apart or together. What I've done is to stop fighting her on the divorce. Am I done? Not yet but I'm working on it. I have given up hope that things will be different. I have to at this point since I'm completely out of options. I have no regrets and I have nothing I would differently. It was time to face the reality and let her go. If she tries to come back, that's one thing, but I can't see that happening. It's painful because I see that she killed the old her - I have the triple whammy of watching the train wreck/bridge building process, seeing her walk away from the kids as well as me and old friends, and being totally exhausted. This has been going for years and there literally are no other options for me. She wants this. She gave up long ago and I'm having to go with it. Time to move on.
That's not to say I hate her. I don't. I don't feel much of anything.

You are doing a very good job. You are very strong and much stronger than you ever thought you would be. Really. It may be a while, but you are doing very well and should keep up the good work. He is not done. He has way too much emotion towards you. Hang in there.

AJ