OK - item by item -

Originally Posted By: Bworl
You don't detach to stop loving her.

You don't detach to start hating her.

You don't detach to figure out how to ignore her.

I would imagine that detaching should have little to do with her at all.

Originally Posted By: Bworl
You seem so set on insulating yourself from more potential hurt, that you're trying to cut off your wife from your life.

Mmmmmm... I'd say it's more like I'm squirming. Trying to find some comfortable position.

Originally Posted By: Bworl
Ironically, to me at least, this is a sign that you are NOT detached at all - at least in the way I understand and experienced it.

Very possibly. And I know that I'm still responding to the thoughts of hurt, which is starting to feel self-indulgent in my moments of clarity. And - when I focus on MY life and things I'M doing - that's when I feel the best. I imagine that's the real road to detachment. Finding happiness in what I'm doing - vs. some awareness of separateness.

Originally Posted By: Bworl
she never really stopped loving the man she fell in love with.

Yes, I have some good indication that that is true.

Originally Posted By: Bworl
there is great possibility in your situation that your marriage can be rebuilt and renewed.

I made the analogy to someone recently that I think it's like this concept of, if you keep moving forward and travel around the earth, you will end up in the place you started. Maybe.

Originally Posted By: Bworl
I thought the truth was that both sides carry responsibility for what made the marriage less than it should have been. Both sides - not just the side that chose to leave. So she made decisions you would never have made. That doesn't make her mistakes any more significant than yours.

Yep. I know it. But it's damn easy to be angry, isn't it? I have moments of clarity also and I understand this.

Originally Posted By: Bworl
it is a fruitless endeavor to even consider any type of reconciliation, regardless of what she might say she wants at some point.

Yep, and that's the killer, knowing that I would be best walking away anyway. What if? Don't I value marriage? Don't I want to keep my family together, raise my kids in an intact home? Yes to all. And I'd get so indignant that she would choose to walk, see it as selfish, would I be a hypocrite to not choose the marriage? Well it's academic, as the opportunity isn't offered. But, this thinking makes me sqirm.

Originally Posted By: Bworl
TM is a diversion for you, and she has made this more difficult for you.

I know.

Originally Posted By: Bworl
More importantly, the TM matter is causing you to become hardline with your wife.

You picked up on that, huh? Yeah I've come to understand this. And when it comes down to it its not something that is particularly relevant or important with regard to the real stuff going on.

Originally Posted By: Bworl
Yeah, the work is hard and the times suck, but is marriage special enough to be worth the tough times?

Everything in my values says yes.
The trick right now I guess is for me to navigate and accept my current circumstances without becoming cynical.

Originally Posted By: Bworl
Why can't you be you and be satisfied with that for now? Why can't you just enjoy being Dad to your kids, the one who provides and cares for them? Why can't you find joy where you are at

I have experienced these moments in the past month. I can.

Originally Posted By: Bworl
Sometimes we have to be willing to be the rock.


Mmmmm. It's become a matter of necessity. There isn't a lot of alternative.

Originally Posted By: Bworl

Just my opinion/thoughts.


Thank you Bill. I do appreciate it.


I'm having a hard week, but I'm pulling it together. Haven't been getting enough sleep (going to remedy that in a moment), and I'm aware that I'm wigging about the appointment to sign on Monday. There's kind of more to say, but maybe not right now. Night, guys -