Looking for help with WAW

[soleil]

You sound like you are doing so much better, I sense a calmness in your posts. So kudos to you.

Are you planning on seeing her again soon?

The thing with M's is that I think people become really comfortable and forget they are supposed to work at it. Courting eachother, supporting eachother, doing the little things, a phone call, etc.

[mza8]

Thank you soleil, I do feel calm. I know what the problems were in the M and I've done my part to correct them in the past 6 months. I've gotten the jobs, going to IC, GAL, done 180s, etc. I've kept it all up consistently. I'm not sure there is anything else I can do at this point for my W but if there is I would love to know.

We don't have any immediate plans to see each other. We are usually at the gym at the same time every night. Sometimes she will look my way and smile and wave, sometimes not. I usually stay on the opposite side of the gym so not to bother her. She is either by herself or with her GF. She was there last night by herself.

We have been emailing regularly. This week it's been updates with the house being for sale. She has been initiating the emails. We seem to be getting along ok. There has been absolutely no R talk for over a month.

I always did support her in the M but didn't do such a good job courting her for the past two years probably because of my depression and other issues at the time. I'd love to begin courting her again like I used to but I know that would be pursuing.

Life for me is pretty good now. I feel like I'm back. Life could be better if W was with me. I think all I can do now is continue my life and maybe she will eventually feel comfortable enough to talk. We'll see...

[gr8 day 2B alive]

mza8,
how's it going? any new developments?

[mza8]

Hi gr8, thanks for checking in. Been busy lately.

Not too much new to update with W. I haven't heard from her since last Thursday. It's been over a week since we communicated with each other and that was by email about the house. She usually emails me every two or three days. I haven't contacted her at all. Her birthday is today. Another tough day to get through not being with my W. I still see her most nights during the week at the gym. No contact though. I continue to give her space. Not much else I can do. My IC thinks that there is progress being made and to remain paitent, so that's what I'm doing.

I've taken a major step in my life. I have enrolled to finish my college degree. It's something that I have always wanted to do. I'm also going for my MBA once I finish my BA degree. I can't wait. I'm looking forward to this new journey.

I'm still keeping busy with work and GAL. I continue to take care of the housework myself. Still go to church every Sunday, meet with IC, and also met with my priest this past week again. Go to gym, walk the dogs, read books, etc. I have maintained all of my changes and continue to improve. I feel pretty good about it too. I feel like my changes are real now. My changes are less work now and come more natural.

If I could have been this new person a couple of years ago I would probably still be with my W. We'll see what the future holds...

[Glimmerman]

mza8

That is great about enrolling to finish your degree.

I agree with your C that you should continue to be patient...of course I also agree there's not much else you can do right now anyway.

In the last couple of weeks, my W told me to take care of myself, and that she was paying some attention to what I am doing...so maybe that can be some encouragement to you.

My W and I have started MC together. We agreed that it is hard, but we think the C seems pretty good so far.

One other thing that I think may be helpful for you to know is that right now my W still wants her space, even while we are C. My gut feeling is that she wants to feel comfortable that the changes she wants to see in me (and us) are real. But that's just my opinion.

[mza8]

Glimmerman, good to hear from you.

I'm excited to finish my degree. It's been a while since I went to college but I can't wait for my classes to begin this summer.

Thank you for sharing your current status with your W. It is helpful for me to know that your W still wants her space eventhough you are both in MC. Reaffirms with me to continue to be patient with my sitch. I also have the feelling that my W is keeping tabs to see if my changes are real and lasting. We continue to get along just fine when we do communicate.

I'm glad that you and your W hve begun MC together. That's a great start to a hopeful reconciliation for you both. I hope for your continued success. Sounds about right that your W would still want space while your are both in C. I believe I read in the DB book, Michele talks about a slower process of reconciliation being the best way to go...usually lasts rather than couples getting back together too fast that don't last.

I hope my W and I get to where you and your W are with beginning MC.

[james217]

Congrats on the college mza. Congrats on the m.c glimmer. Seems like u two dudes are doing much better

[mza8]

Update on my sitch. Nothing new with W. Still have not heard from her for over a week and a half. No big deal, I'm leaving her alone.

Her birthday was last Friday and I did send her flowers. I just wrote on the card that I was thinking of her and wished her a happy birthday. I haven't heard from her about the flowers but I don't care. I didn't send them for a reaction from her. I sent them to let her know that I was thinking of her on her birthday. I figure she didn't contact me for the past week because she knew I would do something for her birthday. I don't want to pursue. My IC said it wouldn't hurt to send some flowers just so she knows that I still care. That's all I did. Nothing mushy. I also asked a friend of mine who is around my W's age and is also currently separated if she thought it was appropriate to send the flowers. She said that she would still want her H to send her flowers on her birthday even though they are separated. It was a tough decision.

Found out some interesting news today. Today I finally told many of my close friends that my W and I were separated. One of my friends tells me that my W called him in February. He said my W wanted to know if I had told anyone that we were separated. She told him the situation. My friend didn't want to tell me because he didn't want to let me know he knew. He said that it is none of his business and he figured I would let him know about my W and I when I was ready.

He said he was very uncomfortable with the whole conversation. He told my W that it was none of his business and he made it a short phone conversation and got off of the phone. He bascially said my W asked if I had told anyone. She told him that we weren't getting along very well lately. What? Not getting along very well? We had just gone on a vacation together 3 weeks before she left me. I don't get that at all. She went on to say that she needed to move on and she was happier now. My friend told her that he was shocked and didn't know what to say. He said if that is her decision then that's her decision but he thought she should take some time first. He's a good friend and has been through a divorce himself.

My friend and I talked for about an hour today. He gave me a lot of insight to his divorce. He told me that he gave his W time and space and she did come back and ask to work things out. Unfortunately they did not work things out in the end for their own reasons.

So I'm looking for some advice and insight. Why would my W call my friend and ask him if I had told anyone? Why would she feel the need to tell my friend that she needed to move on, it was time for a change and is happier. Why would she tell him that she felt that we didn't get along lately? Is this just normal WAW stuff for them to lessen their guilt and justify their actions of separating?

I'm sure my W would not be happy if I called her friends about our sitch. Why did she feel the need to call mine? Why would she care if I told anyone? This is all very confusing. What my W told my friend back in February is different that what another person told me she said recently...withing the past month. This other person said that very recently my W said that we were "coming along" and "we are in a better place now". This person said that my W was saying good things about me for all of the hard work I was doing to fix up the house. This person said that she felt I should hang in there and try to be patient. She thought that my W would come around.

I'm so confused at times lately. I hear one person tell me one thing and another person tell me something else. I guess it makes sense that my W said those things to my friend back in February. I hadn't done a lot of my changes yet. At the end of March my W finally admitted that she saw some changes in me. I guess that after hearing this news today from my friend it brought me back to where things were a couple of months ago. I still tend to believe that there are some very small signs of improvement but if she still has the same mindset today that she had back in February then perhaps we haven't made any progress yet. She hasn't given me any indications one way or another recently. She did cry when we signed the papers to list the house for sale so I believe their is still some emotion there. Am I wrong?

I'll continue to keep things friendly with my W. I will not contact her so she has her space. Sorry for the long post. I've been doing well lately but this news from my friend today sort of got me thinking and probably overanalyzing too much. I keep telling myself to take things one day at a time.

I could really use some opinions on my questions in this post. Thanks for listening.

[Glimmerman]

mza8

I know a little bit about how your mind wanders. Mine has done the same. You hang onto every nugget in every conversation and try to analyze it. Me too.

Allow me to give you some feedback and comparisons to my sitch, and you can see what you think. First, please remember we are separated also, but my W actually filed for divorce.

So, recently when your W told your friend "we are in a better place now", I'm not sure what that means since she said "we" and you are not living together. Hard to tell. The good news is you said it was a "she" that told you this, and "she" told you to hang around. I would follow the advice best you can from another female, especially if she knows your W.

As far as with the close friend of yours, I wouldn't worry too much about that conversation. My guess is your W was "probing", possibly to see what your immediate reaction was to the separation. And, as you can see, the guy was very uncomfortable discussing it, and the two women you talked to gave you their thoughts. Men and women are very different when it comes to relationships, aren't they?

Now, as far as the comment from your W to your friend about you and her not getting along very well, remember this. That comment is 100% accurate from her point of view. She was absolutely happier after you separated. Truth is, just like in my W's case with me, she had no desire to be in your presence. From her point of view, this is all VERY accurate. This is something for you to deal with on your own.

I agree with your other friend about sending the flowers. I think it was good. I believe on the front end of a separation that pursuing is a bad idea. After a while though, I think it becomes more appropriate.

What I really can not help you with is trying to gauge where your W is since you are really not in contact. That is where your sitch and mine are different. My W are in contact a couple of times per week and have been since our separation began. If I remember correctly, divorce has not been filed in your sitch. If I'm wrong, I apologize.

By the way, did your friend tell you why when his W asked to work things out, they still got divorced? If he's willing to share, I'd ask him. That's valuable info on sticky points even when reconciliation may be considered.

I read a post from Sandi quite some time ago. She indicated that in her opinion, this process can definitely take time (seems like she indicated maybe a year or two before things settle back down).

And, finally, if it helps, even though my W and I are in MC, she still doesn't have a big desire to be around me yet. That's where Sandi's post helped me. Sandi indicated the desire to be around her H did come back, but it took time.

[mza8]

Glimmerman, thanks again. You and your sitch are so similar to me and my sitch it's scary. You and I think a lot alike. Your comments are very accurate about me.

You're correct that my W has not yet filed. She has to wait one year before she can file. She hasn't mentioned any talk of that in months. Come to think of it it was probably early February since she mentioned any D or separation talk. I think what she meant about being in a better place is the fact that we have been getting along much better. I think she has become more comfortable towards me since I have given her space. I must have had at least 6 women who have talked to my W tell me to be patient and they thought my W would come around in time. No doubt that men and women are very different in how they see the relationship.

You're right that my W sees us not getting along as accurate from her POV. I absolutely do not agree with her on this but I do see how this is accurate to her. I can see how she would be happier right now because she feels like she's not dealing with the stress. I guess I'm less worried about her feeling this way about the past and would be more focused on doing what is needed to make a better marriage for us.

I know many here would look at the flowers and say it is pursuing. I agree with you that at the beginning it would not be the thing to do. After time I think it's ok to try to reconnect and do some of the little niceties that I used to do. It is tought to figure out exactly what W is thinking right now as we have limited contact.

My friend who got divorced decided he didn't want to save the marriage because his W had an affair. It was something he couldn't get past. His W had other issues too. She was very insecure and very co-dependent. They have a child together and he gets along well with his ex-w. He did say that she still has her insecurity issue and co-dependency issues. I guess she never tried to go to C to make some changes. I think if she would have worked on some of her other issues that my friend might have gotten past the affair and taken her back. He told me that his sitch was so much different and more complicated than mine.

Sandi has given me some great advice and she has been extremely helpful. I know this will take time. Just wonder where I am sometimes in this process.

GM, refresh my memory if you don't mind, how long have you and your W been separated? I think you are a couple of months ahead of me.