Kalni and SmileysPerson among others had a debate over this book several months ago. But I read much of it after my H bought it and then left it on a shelf. I agree with a lot of it. I want my man to be A man, strong, in control of himself, assertive. Call me old fashioned but I am attracted to a man who acts as the leader of the family. Not a dictator, but a strong, confident leader...
Naej, Your words seem to ring true. I was hoping the Hustle Formation team would move us forward, and it probably is a step in the right direction, yet it still isn't enough to break her pattern. The paradox is that her behavior creates more distance, not bring me in closer.
The odd thing here is that love involves being willing to risk ending the M. Love involves wanting something better for myself and my W. Love involves finding the courage to break her destructive pattern. Love involves realizing that possibly the most helpful thing I can do for both of us is to end the M.
The title of my thread, "Tough Grace" implies that I still need to suffer some more in order to grow in love. Each episode of suffering I've had has been a catalyst for change--starting Salsa classes with my W, taking dance lessons on my own, venturing out into the ballroom community on my own, joining a church and taking a look at my childhood religion thru adult eyes. I believe this episode of suffering will prompt me to do the same.
I don't think it's about her. It boils down to how much am I willing to learn (per Phillip Gulley) to love someone who deserves it the least but needs it the most?
CL
CL 53 W 54 M 20 yrs. 03'-09' Separation + Old Patterns + GAL 10-14' Piecing
"The Master allows things to happen. She shapes events as they come."
Matilda, not sure why CL would even want to contemplate being intimate with his wife at this stage,did you read what happened a few posts ago?
Yes, I did read the posts and have been reading from way back. I just think the lack of intimacy has a big impact on CL's marriage and also, CL, doesn't it worry YOU? You helped me "face my fear"....so that is why I brought it up. I agree that it is hard to be intimate with a spouse who acts like CL's wife....but which came first the chicken or the egg?!?
Matilda, Of course it worries me--the lack of intimacy. Her behavior has served to distance me, not bring me closer. My emotional reactions to her have moved me into a more comfortable friendship and roommate mode. This is how I've coped. I've been able to move forward on my own in some ways, but haven't worked at moving US forward for various reasons--hopelessness, confusion, fear, frustration, doubt.
It's uncomfortable now because I've been putting more effort into connection, so my expectations were raised, and hopes rekindled. I had hoped the increased connection and commitment to the dance performance team would move us forward (and it probably has).
I have to insist that she act like a W, while maintaining connection. That is my work for now. I have to maintain the friendship/companion mindset. This isn't a time to retreat into GAL. That work has been done. I'm now prepared to move into a social life if I need to.
I'm planning on how to respond to sleeping elsewhere behavior or having male companionship in the home. She will now be held accountable for those decisions. She will also be given an opportunity to make a commitment to the M.
I will work on expanding my definition of love.
Her leash has been shortened.
CL
CL 53 W 54 M 20 yrs. 03'-09' Separation + Old Patterns + GAL 10-14' Piecing
"The Master allows things to happen. She shapes events as they come."
Lanzo, I did look into the book, but did not read it. I'll take another look at it, and see if it fits for me.
On my bookshelf are When Things Fall Apart by Pema Chodron (I return to this book in times of crisis), Divorce Busting by Michelle Weiner Davis (I read this book when I'm out of ideas in my M), The Third Jesus by Deepak Chopra (an interspiritual way of looking at the Gospels), and A Monk in the World by Wayne Teasdale (on cultivating an interspiritual life).
CL
CL 53 W 54 M 20 yrs. 03'-09' Separation + Old Patterns + GAL 10-14' Piecing
"The Master allows things to happen. She shapes events as they come."
I did look into the book, but did not read it. I'll take another look at it, and see if it fits for me.
That was almost an "I will endeavour to persevere" answer.
Anyway if not this book I think you could use something to help with your self assertiveness, self confidence, something to take you out of your comfort zone and to help you do things differently.
Doc, Naej, Matilda, Jak, and DB Friends, My W sent me a long email reply today. In it she shared her concerns and complaints. She said that we have the potential for a good life together. She wants a companion and partner who is present and affectionate. Other things on the list included helping out with chores, taking more intitiative in planning our outings together, having a positive attitude, taking responsibility in finding the dog a sitter, since I don't want her dance partner to do it (I told you she listens to me), take swimming lessons, and other points I will have to review the email for. She also said we have to reduce negativity.
In today's paper in a political column, the writer Leonard Pitts is talking about change at a society level and Civil Rights Activist Dorothy Height who died recently. He writes that "when people would tell her the time was not ripe for a given thing, she would challenge them to "ripen the time."
In another political column by David Broder he speaks on the topic of patience, in reference to the president. He writes that "patience is not sufficient in itself to solve problems. It can only contribute to making policy a success by fitting it to the right timing." This applies to marital problems too.
I think I have a new thread title. I'm trying on different titles until I find the right fit.
CL
CL 53 W 54 M 20 yrs. 03'-09' Separation + Old Patterns + GAL 10-14' Piecing
"The Master allows things to happen. She shapes events as they come."
Lanzo, I pulled off my bookshelf, Men are From Mars, Women are From Venus. I haven't read this book before. We'll see if it helps.
I need a mixture of topics right now. One of them is changing the patterns in my M. It's time to move US forward. I've been working at moving ME forward.
CL
CL 53 W 54 M 20 yrs. 03'-09' Separation + Old Patterns + GAL 10-14' Piecing
"The Master allows things to happen. She shapes events as they come."
Matilda, not sure why CL would even want to contemplate being intimate with his wife at this stage,did you read what happened a few posts ago?
Yes, I did read the posts and have been reading from way back. I just think the lack of intimacy has a big impact on CL's marriage and also, CL, doesn't it worry YOU? You helped me "face my fear"....so that is why I brought it up. I agree that it is hard to be intimate with a spouse who acts like CL's wife....but which came first the chicken or the egg?!?
Intimacy with your spouse is a surefire way to tighten up or create a lost emotional connection.
