I may not should make this post, but I felt led to do so this morning. I have not really turned my life back over to God but I very strongly feel he has been leading me lately. First on Tuesday evening, then Wednesday morning, neither of those incidents are a normal action for me to have taken, but I felt led to do so.
I do not want to upset anyone with this post, it is simply how I feel and felt the need to express it. I hope I do not lose any friendships that I have developed here over this post. You all have helped me find and define the person I have become and I hope you can look over the past and continue to accept my caring and friendship for all of you on the bb.
I am not defending David's actions here as you all know they are not what I would choose for him to be doing. But David's right and need to make his own choices for his life, whatever they may be.
I have been where David is at now. It is a miserable position to be in and I know David has a very strong conscience and is hurting from the pain in he and I's R and from the pain he is feeling now for the R with OW. I am basing this statement on the fact that David and I had an affair while I was still married to my ex-husband. I saw what the guilt did to both he and I. I actually have no idea if he has forgiven himself for that to this day. I have forgiven myself, just a few short months ago. David saw first hand what carrying the guilt of an affair and broken marriage into another R can do to you, he saw me spiral down and down and he wasn't able to help pull me out. It was something I had to do for myself, but that doesn't mean that support wasn't needed. All of you here on the bb and my reading and David's past assistance have brought me through that episode of my life.
I believe David was here on the bb for help. He has a close friend who lives out of state, he has me who he isn't comfortable talking with right now and he has OW. Those are the people he has let into his life. He does not share feelings and emotions, or let people into his inner sanctuary. That is one of the reasons I believe he does not have more close friendships, is he holds himself too close and others too far away.
I feel from the posts that I read that he made to others here on the bb that you have come to mean something to him in his life. Right now he is struggling, trying to figure out what he wants in his life and he wants the pain to end. But because of the way he is, he can't post his feelings and emotions here. Maybe just a small bit of them and if you aren't careful you would miss it. That is what happened to me with him. I missed him telling me a lot of things because they are very, very subtle. He doesn't let things out much. But I asked him to come to the bb and to give me time. He has done both, and yes he may have had more than one reason for being here, but he tried to help people here and I feel he was also looking for help in his own way.
If he were sure of where he was headed or what he wanted he would have done it by now. He is still trying to figure this out and he knew coming here he was a WAS and that isn't what this bb is about. But still he came, I give him lots of credit for making that move.
I don't mean he doesn't need hard posts; that is the way to help you see things. The posts that shook me up the most and made me think were not the nice ones, but the thinking ones. But to get as many posts as his thread did on two different occasions has to be overwhelming.
I received two emails from him last night. I will not post them, but I see pain and anger and hurt in them. I believe because he looked on you all as people he cares about and tried to help some of you and looked to you for help for himself. He does not really have anyone else to turn to for help, other than OW.
I am not sure why I wrote all of this or if it makes sense. I am just trying to let you know I believe David in his own way was looking for help. He just can't let his emotions and feelings out clearly, because of the way he is with that aspect of his life.
I am not trying to say anyone is wrong, as each one of us is entitled to our own opinions and must make our own choices for our life. I just know David has a very difficult time letting people in and was trying to let you know that I think in his way he did let you into a part of himself.
David may feel I am wrong in what I have written here and he is welcome to correct me if he feels the desire, but this is where I see him at right now.
Pam
"We must be willing to let go of the life we had planned so as to have the life that is waiting for us"
I was nice to David, I mentioned on thread that I started dating my ex-b while separated from my ex-H. I would never do it again (ever date someone while still legally married, even separated), but I understand how he feels.
I don't believe that we should be hard on those who come here from the flip side of the coin. I consider his being here in many ways to be a courtesy to you. You came looking for help here, and thus the 2x4's to help you keep on track (just like I get them). If Tony's W came here at his asking, would we pummel her? I wouldn't. Not even if she was struggling with the whole OM thing.
I am sure I've been too hard on a few people, but in this situation, I think it is best to tread carefully.
David did help others here as well. I just don't think there is anything gained by beating up on him. He KNOWS what he is doing. He knows in his head it isn't right. We don't have to accept it and say "oh, did you have a nice night with OW?" but we should treat him respectfully. If nothing else, do it for Pam. If we drive him away, it may hurt any chance she has with him.
Honey, your favorite driver wishes the best for you as always. I read your latest post and encourage everybody to treat David with respect and kindness so that he stays with the BB. Folks, we are trying to fix a marriage here with a lot of delicate and complex issues.
Pam, I encourage you to walk along side God on your journey. For me He has made the difference in the past 7 months. He has filled my hurting and lonely soul with His love and is showing me a path of signs to my future.
Pam and David both: I do feel like David got more than a few spitwads between the eyes. It sounds to me as if the interpretation of that was: "We are 'bashing' him because we feel loyal to you and are on your side". I believe that is not the case.
First of all, he did receive some richocet anger that is triggered in many of us who have been through betrayal--that anger doesn't belong to David and he shouldn't take that personally. It wasn't fair, though, that's true.
As you have had the experience many times here--you know that sometimes the kindest thing you can get is some people telling you to wake up and smell the coffee. You yourself have had quite a few posts of this nature. So have most of us. When someone calls me on my bs, and it is definately intended to help--it is actually one of the bests gifts they could give me.
I am not on "your side" or "David's side". What I see is two people who married and are having some problems. I'm on the side of trying 100% to not throw away a marraige until every effort is made to save it, including counseling.
This is the deal Wolfie and I made: We agreed to a specific amount of time to try 100%. That included individual and marraige counseling and working with a beginner's mind. Neither one of us was sure our R would survive and neither of us were sure we would want to continue our R if we did try everything but one or both of us wanted out. Out of respect to ourselves, each other, our family, and for the life we had built together over the years, we agreed that we would try and see. To end it in the wake of the bomb would have been ugly. If we tried and it wasn't going to work, then we deserved to split up in a respectful way.
I sincerely hope that you two come to the point of both trying in an open-minded way. Too me, however, continuing to be involved with an OP sabotages any chance to get unconfused and see if there is a chance for your M.
Personally, I like David and I think he has a place in all of our hearts. But if anyone showed up on the boards here full of confusion about an A, full of confusion about whether or not to stay in their M, I'd say the same to anyone...if you want to see if there is a possibility to save your M and make it a much better one, the first step would have to be to stop seeing the OP.
Because I think most of the people here like David and care about the two of you, it IS especially frustrating.
Wolfie was also very confused, and he is similar to David about having a very hard time showing his feelings, much less talking about them. I am so grateful that he found a Counselor to help him with those issues, and she really did confront him on a lot of the rationalizing he was doing. Believe me, she wasn't pulling any punches! I think that was the best thing he could have ever done for himself. Even if we had split up, I would have been glad that he has become much healthier and happier from what he has learned in Counseling!
Please let David know that I think he got some tough-love but none of us are all that great at being Dr. Phil!
And I feel the same way, too. And the whole OP topic REALLY is salt in the wound for me... if it comes across as bitter, I apologize, unfortunately for me, it is good, old-fashioned pain and hurt.
Relax. Appreciate. Be calm. Laugh. Enjoy. Be secure. Be loving. Be loved. Don't personalize. Don't ASSume. Accept. Be grateful.
Gosh it is nice of you to drop by. I don't KNOW what was said, all I do know is I was told it got rather heated on CHL's thread and I know his e-mail was not happy.
I felt it important to state where I am and where I think he is at and as far as OP interferring with working on the R. I don't believe that is where he is at right now.
I believe he is trying to decide if he wants to work on an R with me.
Pam
"We must be willing to let go of the life we had planned so as to have the life that is waiting for us"
