W still wants separation, need to DB more

[gucci loafer]

Of course not. What kills me on this site is how some people think there is a one method cures all. It's a combination of things based on your own sitch. That's why DB stresses that you should do what works. If you try something and it's not getting a good response, then do something else.

This is one of the reasons I would bet your wife doesn't open up to you anymore. You seem to want to tell people how they feel and what they think. You call people "closed minded" and yet it is YOU that has only tried to save your marriage YOUR way. You haven't done what I would have recommended. I have allowed you and observed your situation for two years. So it is YOU that is closed minded.

You try and tell me (and I bet you have done this with your wife) that some people think there is one method cures all.
This is again trying to tell people what they think. I don't know anybody on this board that thinks that "one method cures all.". So you again are trying to tell
people what they think and what they feel.


You told me what I knew about depression and abuse. Again telling me what I know. These are things your wife has also learned about you over the years. THESE are reasons your wife is closed off to you. It is obvious she doesn't reveal her deepest darkest secrets and her hurts and fears. After your response to me earlier it all becomes clear. It is YOU who don't like disagreement and gets defensive. All because I tell you what you are doing isn't working and hasn't worked. Do you need a fan club or cheeleaders?

And you want ME to tell you my personal life? To help me or to attack if I tell you again in six months that what you are doing doesn't seem to be working?


Now you are acting like a brat and want to know how my SIL was doing. You want to know my own situation.. Yep. Just as you pushed your wife away and she doesn't open up, I now understand.. You need to find something so that you can unleash that deep anger you have. You were more than likely hoping my SIL would still be trying to DB.


I am going to the bottom line again here. What you have been doing hasn't worked. So your one size fits all isn't working. Your closed mind won't allow you to do the "Gucci" method. And yet you are preaching to others about the one size fits all. You haved the closed mind in this. It is closed to the "Gucci method" I can certaoinly understand why your wife says nothing and is closed off in her feelings. She probably learned a long time ago that you are capable of unleashing an bombardment of anger and hurtful things.



Maybe you should be using your ownd advice on "open mind" and be willing to cut the anger because I point out that what you have done hasn't worked. If you are so "open minded to do what works, then maybe the "Gucci" method "(whateve that means) is just what you need. Or is your mind closed?

[OfficerInNeed]

Well...I did not expect this thread about my sitch to turn into this BUT I am open minded, my ultimate goal is to save our marriage and myself in the process and I would like some advice. I have typed journal of sorts in every post with my daily interactions with my W in hopes to get some feedback and direction.

[MrBond]

yep. same old gucci. no signature line still.

[robx]

what's impressive is the number of WAW's that spout depression but seem perfectly fine when they're out clubbing with their lady friends and they seem perfectly fine having affairs with OM and chasing OM with the intent to have affairs so maybe it isn't because they're depressed maybe it's that they are depressed with YOU because you've become someone different to them or you've changed into something which is no longer attractive or appealing - you can't hide behind marriage vows and degenerate into some lazy bum thinking "hey the vow's said for better or for worse so just deal with it!"

robx,

Maybe they have changed. It is common in the state of mind that a cheating wife that in their mind "in my mind, I am not married". Thats what they do. Many of them are running with single friends and any thoughts of responsibility or accountability to their marriage has them depressed.

No one is attacking anyone on these forums, the direct approach is used because we're adults and we don't need to sugar coat things for you.

Read the following quote from your best friend gucci, it really says alot about the state of mind some of your wives are in and what you need to do in your situations. In the end, how long do you stay in your current situation, continuing to do the same things hoping for something to change and your wives to "snap" out of their funk? Doing the same thing over and over again is the definition of insanity, when you've been at it for months or years and have produced no visible changes in your situations when do you finally realize in your "logical" brains that what you are doing isn't working?

I haven't broken my maritial vows and the wife gets off on cheating on me, feeling "free" and "independant", what did I do wrong. Watch sex and the city my friend, they are cheating much more than before - and many of them have no accountability to their actions. The husband doesn't have to do anything wrong. You keep thinking that wives who are cheating are virtuas and loyal women, when their acts prove other wise.

I am strong, I am confident, I also like to get my way. So I am struggling with fighting for my marriage and letting her make the biggest mistake of my familys life.

Do a little research. Strong confident men are attractive to women. So, when a strong, confident man is fighting for his marriage, the woman views it (and her view is what counts) as WEAKNESS (which is NOT attractive)

Have you ever noticed that strong, confident men usually always have a woman that is considered "hot"? Usually the woman does a lot of the chasing? Ever noticed that reality with those types of men/women relationships?

You see, one of the things that many men "miss" on this site is that when a woman is feeling those "romantic and in love feelings" is when she is dating "up" or involved with a man who allows HER to do much of the pursuing and chasing. Now women will tell you they would prefer to be chased, but have you noticed that really isn't the true reality? That when they are chased by a man that they usually back off? (and YOU are another case in point right now)


The key is to know how to pursue and yet allow her to pursue.
You HAVE to let her "feel" (women go by feelngs) that you KNOW that you deserve and will not accept anything less than a woman who WANTS to be with you and will be exclusive with you.
She needs to "feel" that you will accept nothing less.

You ARE accepting something less. Don't you see that you are pursuing a woman who even tells you she can't be faithful? You should be calling her bluff as if you have a straight flush. As a strong and confident man this is the reason you have lost your mojo. You don't have the "confidence" to tell her NO, this is unacceptable and I don't want a woman like that. End of story.


My answer to you is different than what you will usullay hear on this site, but one I have seen work far better again and again and again...

Your 180 is to show her in no uncertain terms that you really have LOST interest in her. That SHE isn't worth YOUR love and time. This will then be perceived as strong and confident. You are not mean to her or punitive, but just casual and "oh well, this isn't working and not what I want or am looking for"


She THEN either HAS to chase you, which causes her romantic feelings to start COMING back or it is over anyway. (so what have you really lost?) Confident men are WILLING to risk it all for the sake of their self esteem.


Now. The psychology behind this is interesting...

She has low self esteem or she wouldn't need all that attention she seems to cry out for. Since she has low self esteem she subconciously thinks this.. "if I don't really love myself and can't be faithful then there MUST be something wrong with HIM (meaning you) to want me when I don't even love myself.....She looks DOWN on you for wanting her because she doesn't even LOVE herself. So she subconciously looks down on you and can't feel those correct feelings because YOU put up with her. This is why you need for HER to chase you so that she feels she is dating UP.


The guy who ends up winning her will be the one who shows these traits. The others will go by the wayside. She secretly WANTS to be faithful, however she won't be able to do it until she finds a man who won't put up with anything less. She will then want to PROVE to that man how faithful she can be.


Show her the man that you told us you are. STRONG AND CONFIDENT. Stong and confident is willing to risk the whole ball of wax to win the prize because he accepts nothing less.

Also do not discount that you may have a suave lifestyle which is attractive to outside women. You may be a very handsome and charming man. You may not be engaged in the act of physical cheating. There is nothing to say that she may cheat on you or cheat you, because of a rivalry with you. Some times this happens too, there is nothing you can do about it.

Why do you think these cheating wives are virtuous and good women? Why can't at least half of them be completely self centered people who aren't caring about anyone but themself?
[/quote]

DLS, I just read this, what part in any of my posts led you to believe that I was under the impression that cheating wives are virtuous and good women? I didn't say anything like that at all so I'm not sure where you got that from.

[gucci loafer]

yep. same old gucci. no signature line still.

Correct. The marriage is as good as ever. My cup runneth over.... Not one complaint. Life is good. Best wife a man could ask for. Wonderful loving mutually giving and receving, fun, exciting, passionate relationship.


Yep same old Gucci
Looks like the ole Gooch does what works...

How bout you?

[robx]

robx,

When people start mentioning and criticizing my own personal sitch in someone else's post that's an attack.

And besides I've never said that one way was better than another. Everyone is different and if one person chooses to do it one way and not the other, it's their choice. It's not a matter of poor self-esteem or whatever.

It's a choice. Guys have to respect that if you want to be respected in return.

Actually I would encourage you and SM to also check out the survivinginfidelity website. Alot of hurting people in there that could learn a thing or two from you both.

is there more than one way to skin a cat,
maybe.

Alot of people on these forums may not appreciate the direct approach when being given advice, they're hurting, they want compassion, they want relief from their personal pain and they come here looking for the magic pill that will fix all of their problems, asking questions, asking for advice, doing nothing that they're told and continuing to ask the exact same questions over & over again in endless variations.

Is there more ways than one to db?
Maybe.

But after several months of no change in a specific situation, when you do you sit back, evaluate what you've done and admit that what you're doing isn't working so what is the problem with trying something different. If what you've done hasn't worked, is it so wrong to attempt something different from what you've done to see if it may work or do you hold off from doing something different because it doesn't "feel" right and isn't aligned with the kind of person you are - take into account that the kind of person you are is also the same person your spouse is leaving.

[gucci loafer]

I have seen begging work.
I have seen obsessing and stalking type pursuing work.
I have seen waiting for two or more years work...

That doesn't mean it should be recommended.

[gucci loafer]

Tell me Bond..

How does it make you feel that my relationship is great?
Do you want me on here everyday telling you how great it is and how happy we are?

Are you GLAD for me or does it irritate you?

Is it possible that I just MAY know something because of it?

[gucci loafer]

When people start mentioning and criticizing my own personal sitch in someone else's post that's an attack.

You do it because you want to and you don't give a f@ck if she responds nicely or not.

If you keep continuing to give advice like that, while your own house isn't in order, then I AM going to let the poster asking for advice be aware that this advice is coming from someone who is stil in counseling himself and still trying to get his own marriage reconciled. Telling someone to not give a f@ck how the woman you say you love responds is terible advice in my opinion. And you ARE going to get my opinion on it when someone ElSE's marriage is at stake.

[MrBond]

Of course I'm glad for you. Why wouldn't I be? If your R was in the toilet, I'd feel sad. You're the one who basically (not literally) calls people losers for not following a certain "method". Don't know where you keep getting all this animosity from.

I think it helps alot of people on the boards when they see you're a "success". Or maybe you should put it in the "made it" section. I'm sure those in need would be interested in hearing all the details of your journey.