Well, for the first time, I stood up to her and didn't back down. She again asked that if she couldn't get comfortable in the other room, if she could come sleep in our bed. But this time, I flat out said no. She pouted and complained that the other bed wasn't very comfortable. I just repeated my stance that it wasn't going to happen. So, she tried texting me a couple times, asking me if I was still awake and goodnight. I replied to neither. So, since then, we've only exchanged one email, just asking a basic question.
I know that I've played into her hands so many times during all of this, and that sucks. I've been thinking a lot today that just about one of the only things left for me to consider is us talking to a counselor. I don't know if her hearing someone impartial to the situation say that she needs to stop her EA if she's going to make any attempt to work on us will carry any weight with her. But, she's not hearing it from me and the only people she's talked to about it are always going to take her side.
Well, for the first time, I stood up to her and didn't back down. She again asked that if she couldn't get comfortable in the other room, if she could come sleep in our bed. But this time, I flat out said no. She pouted and complained that the other bed wasn't very comfortable. I just repeated my stance that it wasn't going to happen. So, she tried texting me a couple times, asking me if I was still awake and goodnight. I replied to neither. So, since then, we've only exchanged one email, just asking a basic question.
I know that I've played into her hands so many times during all of this, and that sucks. I've been thinking a lot today that just about one of the only things left for me to consider is us talking to a counselor. I don't know if her hearing someone impartial to the situation say that she needs to stop her EA if she's going to make any attempt to work on us will carry any weight with her. But, she's not hearing it from me and the only people she's talked to about it are always going to take her side.
IMO, it could only help you. even if the therapist can't get her to see the light, at least you'll have someone to help you out in your sitch and get your thoughts straightened out.
I'm happy that you stuck to your guns and didn't allow her into your bed.
I know what it feels like to be so torn between mind and heart. Your mind is telling you to not put up with this crap, while all your heart wants is to be loved and wanted.
I'm proud of you!
M: 32 H: 34 S:5 D: 3 D: 1 Together 11 years Married 7 Bomb: PA/EA 8/13/09 (for 1 year on and off) ILYBINILWY: 08/09
"The end of suffering happens with the end of wanting." -Laura Munson
Thanks! It wasn't easy, that's for sure. I just tried reminding myself that why am I letting her get everything she wants and I'm getting nothing and it did make it a little easier.
I'm trying to figure out the best way to bring up the MC with her. I think if I tell her that I want us to go, so that we have a place where we feel comforable talking, where the person listening isn't going to take sides or judge, that would be really healthy for us. I know she won't want to go, because I don't think she wants to be confronted with the reality of her actions. I guess all I can do is state my case, and if she declines, go for myself.
I'm proud of you for sticking to your guns and not letting her worm her way into bed. But I want to share this with you, okay. I used to be the woman you are describing in your W's behavior. Only, I didn't play up to my H the way she is doing you. I had the Internet EA. I am here to tell you that until something hits her that she has to suffer .....it is not going to work. MC is not going to work, and do you know why? B/c you want for the two of you to go so the C can "fix" your W. You said yourself that maybe she would listen to somebody not partcial. She doesn't want to work at the M so she is not going to cooperate in a MC session. The only reason she would even go would be to have the C to tell her she should get a D.
Do you know what the first thing was that got my attention? When my H told me he would throw this computer out the back door if he discovered I had contacted OM again. I did not want that to happen. Know what I did? Went deeper underground. Then the next thing that happen was when I discovered that my D knew about my activity. I was so embarrassed and ashamed that I wanted to die. Everything I ever stood for went down the toilet in that moment. But....that was the moment in time that I made my decision (and I haven't even told Puppy that!).
I fought Puppy for the stand he took in exposing the A to parents & children b/c of how devastated I thought my own children & parent had been. I'm sure my entire family knew in time,but those were the ones I would have done anything to keep from finding out. But if I had not been exposed and if my D had not confronted me with her knowledge.....there's no telling how long I would have continued the EA....and in fact,was giving serious consideration to a PA before she confronted me.
So,what am I telling you here? That you must stop with all of this "soft" action and forget about C. You have to use tough love.....and I mean be tough and don't back down for a second. Lay boundaries for her and if she won't respect the boundaries, then she doesn't deserve to be M to you and you need to move on. She has to suffer some type of loss for her actions. Yes,I suffered a lot more than you could imagine b/c I had been a role model for my children and I ruined it. They will never look at me the way they once did. What is your W having to suffer for her actions?
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
I really appreciate your open and honest response. It really makes me think about how much control I've let her have. The thing that is so screwed up with all of this is that if I do show "tough love" and made some kind of a threat like I'll throw her laptop outside, she would just tell me to grow up. And it's not like we have kids or anything for her to worry about finding out. Like I've said before, I just don't know what will reach her and actually have an effect on her to where she might actually stop and think about what she's doing. I think you've read earlier about what happens when I've laid down boundaries. Her level of respect towards me has sunk so low that she doesn't even think twice about blowing me off. And I know part of that has gotten worse because of the couple times when I did blow up and threatened divorce on the spot only to back down. I guess I'm not very good at understanding what good boundaries and consequences are for us. And that's not helping.
Well, I doubt it's anything game changing but, I really put my foot down tonight. I told her that I know things aren't easy with our situation because of our one car situation, but while we're in the same house together, there are going to be some ground rules. I told her that while she is in this house, she will not be talking, chatting, webcamming, anything with this OM, or any other guy. That I'm tired of her taking advantage of my good nature and getting everything her way. I'm not going to let her spend as much private time talking to him as she wants, then feel that she can just come to bed with me and cuddle like it's no big deal. I said that I'm just not going to be taken advantage of anymore and if she can't do that, then I deserve better than her and I'll make sure I find it. So, from now on, I'm not doing anything for her other than being the one that drives to and from work. If she wants something, she can get it herself, no more "since you're out" or anything like that.
So, then I left, mostly just to cool down since that was big for me. After about 10 minutes, i get a text from her, "so when are you coming home?" I didn't reply, then the next message from her, "what made you be an ass all of a sudden?" So, I figured that I had to respond to that and simply said, "I'm not going to apologize for anything that I asked for or said. I in no way was trying to be an ass." and that's it.
This isn't about throwing out her computer or telling her she can't contact the other man in your house or any number of a thousand things while you are in the house together..or having a temper tantrum about how you aren't going to be walked on. (while she walks on you in your own house despite your tough words) That is like telling your child they can't do drugs in front of you, so go in your room and do them. Just don't do it in front of me.. That is silly.IF you are going to do drugs it isn't going to be in THIS house. Find somewhere else to live.
If you want to show REAL tough love and show her how serious you are THEN you tell her that YOU HAVE DECIDED that you are no longer going to live this way and you have decided you want HER to find another place. ASAP. Since she wants to have OM in her life then YOU have decided you will NOT live that way. So, tell her that she has one week to find a place of her own and she can then be FREE to do whatever she wants with whomever she wants..
THAT is what tough love is. If in doubt then read the original author of tough love. James Dobson. APPEASEMENT does not work. Telling her she can't contact the OM in front of you or anything like that is still WEAK. Get tough. NO MORE. If you choose to contact him, then you WILL do it from a place you live in without me...
The thing that is so screwed up with all of this is that if I do show "tough love" and made some kind of a threat like I'll throw her laptop outside, she would just tell me to grow up.
I'm not talking about "threats", (and my H wasn't threatening, he meant it). There has to be lines (boundaries) in a R so that there is respect. Did you read the tread on boundaries?
I get back in a few.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
No, I've seen it referenced several times but I haven't been able to find it. I've been very interested in reading it.
Well, I finally started sticking up for myself and making things a little more clear, One of the first things that I said was that I am in no way sharing my wife with anyone else and until that changes, she's on her own. No helping her with anything, no more responding to her chit-chat texts because she's bored, she's taking care of herself. So, I did what you suggested and left all of her bathroom stuff and some clothes for her and told her that she was not welcome in the master bedroom last night. So, she stayed in her other room, then this morning, threw the door open at around 8:30. She woke me up asking why I wasn't up yet. I told her that since my boss was out of town, I was sleeping in a little. she came and sat on the bed and as soon as she did, she tried touching my arm. I pulled my arm away and said that I had to get ready for work. Right before I left, she asked if I could get her coffee first, I said no and bye. She's definitely in more of a bad/depressed mood today, skipping work, again. So, I guess I should read that post on boundaries and see what I am doing wrong.
Don't misunderstand by what I am saying by using the expression "tough love". This is the same kind of love we have to use with teenagers out of control, family who are have addictions, etc. It doesn't mean that you go around screaming at them, but you do not enable their bad behavior. For a WAW, I believe a soft, controlled, low tone of voice, shows her you mean what you say and it is not empty threats.
As you make your plans and gather information about W & OM, you need to decide what the deal breakers are for you. If it is her having an A, then tell her that you cannot live in an open M and share her with OM. (This is why you need to read the thread about boundaries.) You lay down the boundaries, be firm (not a jerk) and take no b.s. from her. Will she get mad? Sure, but so what? Will she leave you? Perhaps, but she will anyway if you continue on this path.
It is better to keep your dignity and show how a man should respond under these circumstances. Wouldn't you want to feel that you kept your honor & self-respect in tact if the M continue or not? You have norms & standards by which you live and you should not compromise to the point of being emotionally abused by your spouse. Unfortunately, that is what happening by the way you are trying to "love unconditionally".
My H went without work during the time I was having my EA, so I understand how it affects the MR. It is difficult for a man to keep his esteem up when his W is working and he isn't. If she isn't being the kind of woman she "should".....it makes things hard all the way around. But your strength as a man does not totally depend on having a job, as long as you are trying to get work. I believe it is in the heart & soul of a man. It is his God-given character, so to speak. There are opportunities every day for a man to show his W how she can depend upon him to handle difficulties of life with inner strength & honor. If she tests him, he gently but firmly instructs her not to speak to him (or whatever) in a disrespectul manner. If she continues to do it....then he gives her a boundary with a consequence if she breaks it. Believe me, she will not be attracted to a H who she cannot respect. She may have to experience a consequence, but if she wants this man.....she will straighten up her act.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
