I'm just trying to follow you here in regard to OM. I understand about the moving quickly thing, but what's the sale of the house going to do in regard to a possible OM. If there is OM, he's there whether house sells or not isn't he?
One other thing for you. If you haven't already, go to the home page of this website. About halfway down, you will see the articles section. Read the one about Walkaway Wife.
Glimmerman, what I meant about some of those things being insignificant to me was that they are not worth arguing over to me. I wasn't trying to belittle if they are significant to my W. Sorry if it came across like that. I see your point though. My C also puts a high importance that I value my W. I have always thought that I value her and I think I do. However, I can now see how wanting to do things my way could make her feel that I don't value her. Makes perfect sense. I guess I didn't look at it that way with her wanting to bring in the house cleaners. I looked at it as she was being lazy/stubborn and didn't want to help. When I talk to her today I am going to agree with her to bring in the house cleaners.
I have read the WAW article many times. Helps to remind me where my W might be right now. Thanks Glimmerman.
Gucci, I can understand your thinking there might be a possible OM. I respect your opinion but I'm here to tell you that there isn't OM. If I ever found out there is, I would be the first to tell you you're right. The reason though, that my W wants to sell the house so fast is because it is in danger of going into foreclosure. In my first post I think I mentioned that when my business closed, my W and I had to file personal bankruptcy. It's was nearly impossible to afford the house on just her salary for the past two years while I was home depressed and with no job. I've been working with the bank to try to work out a mortgage modification. If you watch the news about trying to work with the banks, I'm sure you can see how difficult it is to get the banks to work with you. Until/if I am able to work something out with the bank, our house is in danger of foreclosure. My W doesn't want the house to be foreclosed on and that's why she is in such a hurry to sell it. Not because of any OM. Her reasons are legitimate.
The reason I am not as panicked about foreclosure as my W is because the bank can't foreclosure on it for a while. I have some time to work something out with them. If something cannot be worked out, the bank will most likely agree to put it for sale for so many months before they would foreclose.
The past is something that is still difficult for me to think about at times. What my W and I went through with my comapny (legal matters, etc.), the tremendous financial troubles, and huge stress, I wouldn't wish on anyone. We have had an extremely tough last couple of years. We probably went through more crap in the last two years than some people go through in a lifetime. Oh, trust me, her reasons are legitimate for selling the house.
M 38 WAW 36 Together 19 years Married 12 years Bomb/Separated Oct. 09 I love my wife Sitch
Man, I totally understand that those things weren't worth arguing about to you. I am learning that's part of where the problem was for my wife and I.
If you are like me, you will shrug off the the insignificant things that don't matter to you. It's possible that for a long period of time, your wife has stored up all these "insignificant" things. Perhaps they were significant to her, but she felt she couldn't reach you, you wouldn't listen, etc.
You and I have some similarities in how our wives feel. I don't think my W is having an affair either, though I couldn't swear that on a stack of Bibles since we are separated. Though divorce has been filed, wife has not completely shut out the thought of our marriage, or at least that's what she has said and I'm going to trust that.
So, here's my wisdom to you. You don't have to follow it. But every day, in the decisions I make while we are separated, I try to think "what would my wife think of this decision?".
Us guys can piss each other off, go have a beer, and it's all good. We let it go for the most part. There may be things that happened long ago in your marriage that your wife didn't let go of, and you keep making decisions without thinking about what it's like in her shoes when you make those decisions.
Again, not harping on you, I'm just hopeful for your marriage and letting you know what I've learned over the past few months.
You have done a great job as far as getting work. Be the breadwinner that your wife is looking for. Be compassionate and listen to her. Protect her. This will get you respect.
I appreciate your advice. You are helping me see some things that I still need to improve on. My W had mentioned that there were other issues for her in addition to my lack of job. She hasn't felt comfortable enough yet to open up to me about what those things might be. Taking a hard look at myself I think I have seen some things on my own that I could have done better.
Looking back I can see that I did view things that were insignificant for me and were probably significant for her. I was kind of a "wanting everything my way" person. This is something I need to continue to work on. I know that at times my W doesn't think I listen. When my W and I do talk lately I still catch myself not listening to her and wanting my way. At least now I am catching myself when I do this and then remind myself to listen to her. I have been trying to see things through her eyes lately. I try to do this whenever I make a decision about something or when interacting with her.
Sometimes when things get emotional or argumentative, I find myself getting caught up in it. Not all of the time, but once in a while. Getting better but still room for improvement.
Last edited by mza8; 04/06/1004:58 PM.
M 38 WAW 36 Together 19 years Married 12 years Bomb/Separated Oct. 09 I love my wife Sitch
The reason though, that my W wants to sell the house so fast is because it is in danger of going into foreclosure. In my first post I think I mentioned that when my business closed, my W and I had to file personal bankruptcy. It's was nearly impossible to afford the house on just her salary for the past two years while I was home depressed and with no job.
Thank you for your post on my thread. I am trying to be a quick learner, and I know that what I am learning I must develop into habits.
I am VERY thankful that for the most part my wife has been willing to see me and talk to me once in a while. After the last couple of weeks, I have learned that in my case she will bring up R talk when she is ready. I'm a guy, I want to talk about it now and fix it. My counselor and my pastor both preach patience to me every time they see me.
It's quite possible that your wife is not ready to have a R talk with you yet because she doesn't trust that you'll listen. In her heart and mind, she believes it will do her no good. I hope you get the opportunity to start swaying that the other way.
This probably falls under the category of pursuing, but I wrote my wife a SHORT note on a nice, blank card a few weeks ago. It was NOT a note where I just said I'm sorry a bunch of times. It was a note that let her know I was beginning to UNDERSTAND where she was coming from. I let her know that if I were in her shoes, I would be feeling the way she is.
My C has shown me that "I'm sorry" can be pretty void when your wife is holding onto resentments....many of which you may not really be aware of. She thinks and believes that she has told you many times and that you have not listened to her.
There is hope for both of our M my friend! I also don't subscribe to the theory that every WAW has an affair. I'm sure it crosses their mind, but one thing I have personally decided to do is trust my W until I'm given reason otherwise.
Mza8, just getting caught up on your latest posts. I really don't have much advice on what to do about the house that's your decision. What I can offer is my perspective and that is:
You said you were stalling a bit, she is going to view this as you controlling the sitation. No one likes to be controlled. As robx said, if you want to stay in the house then let your W know how you feel.
For me, I am currently in the house but I am not spending any money(my money) on renovations until I know were my R is going.
I started to look at other houses so I could move if things don't work out. I want a fresh start to do things right no matter the outcome.- A fresh start for me be a single dad or a fresh start with my W. Of course if W decides to stay we would discuss moving.
Also my W moved out in November. We filed jointly on our taxes. I could have said I deserve more b/c I paid more for the house. I could have gotten and extra grand or two but decided to split the return 50/50.
A small price to pay.
Keep us posted on the house. gr8
Bomb 8/09. Brief piecing 12/10. D-2/12 Two incredible kids D9,S6 Leading new life! “Success is not to be pursued; it is to be attracted by the person we become."
Steve, I want to keep the house because there is a possibility that I could afford it if I can work something out with the bank. I don't know that answer yet and that is one of the reasons I've been stalling with W. It's hard to let go of the house. Feels like another failure in my life in a way. However, I know that we could always get another house down the road...a better one maybe. A part of me wants to save the M and house. That's my reasoning for wanting to keep the house.
Glimmerman, I'm happy to see your W communicating with you. My C and priest also tell me to keep patient. I think you're absolutely right in that my W probably doesn't trust me enough right now that I will "listen". She probably figures, what's the point? I believe that the opportunity to sway her thinking is right in front of me now. I'm blowing it in some ways though. The way I act with her with this house right now, I believe, is a way for me to regain some of her trust. You've helped me see some ways that I can help to improve this...thank you.
Funny you mention the note. Last night and today I waa thinking of doing something similar with my W. Nothing long and winded, just something to let her know that she was right with a lot of things. Tell her that I know that I didn't listen to her at times and perhaps value her. Tell her that I can understand how that made her feel. That sort of thing. I agree that it is pursuing but I want to let her know that I see a lof of the things that I could have done better. Still thinking about that one.
You're right about W feeling like she told me she told me many times. My W would say how she wasn't going to "nag" me to do things. You know looking back, maybe there were some signs and we just don't look hard enough to see them. At least now I know what I can do to value my W if I ever get another chance. I was very much a fixer too. I wanted to fix things, I didn't think of what she wanted...many times probably just for me to listen.
Gr8, you and others are right. My stalling with the house is controlling, not listening, not valuing,...all of those things. I can definitely see that now. I must learn to do better with the opportunity that lies in front of me.
Couple of positive things. My W wanted me to drop off my tax info to our account for our taxes. When she first separated she told me she was thinking of filing her taxes married filing individually. Now it appears she wants to file jointly. I dropped off my info to the accountant yesterday. I told my W and she said she will drop her info off to the accountant this week.
W and I have been emailing today about what time to call to talk tonight. W has replied to each of my emails within 30 minutes. She told me that she was able to schedule the carpet cleaners and that she got a good price. I think maybe she was proud of what she did and was looking for recognition from me? I took this opportunity to email her back and tell her that I thought she did a great job and she got a good price. I said I'll wait to hear from her later today. I forgot to thank her though for taking care of the carpet cleaner. Stupid me. I will thank her tonight when I talk to her.
When I went to the gym last night she was there with her GF again. I went to the other side of the gym again away from her. I was on a treadmill with my back to her and when I was finished, she was on a treadmill one row behind me. I was surprised she felt comfortable enough to work out that close to me. Then I went to work out on the weights side of of the gym and she came to my side later to workout. We were only a few feet away from each other working out at one point. We never talked to each other. If she wants to come up to me and say hello, that's fine but I don't want to approach her...don't want to make her feel smothered. We always worked out on the same equipment so I'm not saying that she is following me around the gym. What I do take from all of this is that she seems comfortable enough to be at the gym at the same time as me and not leave. That can't be a bad thing. I'll take it.
When my W and I talk later today I am going to thank her for taking care of both the carpet and house cleaners (she scheduled both for the end of this week). I'll thank her for planting the flowers. I will tell her the house work that I will be doing and when I should be finished. I think she will be pleasantly surprised when I give her an exact date. I should be finished this weekend.
M 38 WAW 36 Together 19 years Married 12 years Bomb/Separated Oct. 09 I love my wife Sitch
Your getting it, bud! If some of this stuff can get through my thick skull, there's hope.
Just a couple of things for you. If you choose to write her a short note, I'd recommend you not use vague words like "perhaps" or "possibly". They send a message in writing that you are not totally owning up.
As it says it the WAW column, thank her for "nagging". She's communicating with you when she does that! If the timing is right, you can make it into something humorous, but let her know you are not brushing it off.
Whether you sell it or keep it, do not, I repeat do not, put this house above your wife...
I know you are a real estate dude, but what does your wife think? What if she said something to you like "I'd rather just rent than have these headaches that comes with owning a house right now". She may not say that, but you NEED TO WANT her input. She knows you are a real estate dude and in her mind that may be why she has given up on discussing it.
I also want to thank you again for your kind post to me. It's amazing how reading other people's situations can reveal things about my own situation. Much of my advice is to the guy in the mirror as much as it is to you. Thanks again.
