It's not like there are only two approaches - "Bo Peep" or "Take Charge".
There are many grades and combinations in between.
And if "Bo Peep" as mentioned here means always let them back in, let them have whatever they want, put a smile on your face even while you're being used...well, I'm not familiar with that DB'ing strategy.
On the other hand, it is more than possible to maintain a calm and friendly demeanor with a WAS while still not allowing them to do or have anything they want. I believe some refer to it as "boundaries."
The problem is that far too many people seem to think the choices are either no boundaries or boundary their ass out of town and your life. Again, the truth often rests somewhere in between.
I tend to believe that the most effective strategy with a WAS is to live your life to the fullest while remaining true to how you actually feel about the potential future status of your marital relationship.
I do not believe in dating as a strategy. I do not believe is presenting a false front of any kind as a strategy. Honesty and integrity are of the utmost importance I think, especially during a time when the WAS is often dealing in half-truths and in some cases outright lies.
Read the DB and DR books. They are not full of either-or strategies. They are full of techniques that MAY have benefit to the situation you find yourself in. And as Virginia noted earlier, try a technique and if it is not working, try another. Just remember that techniques are not designed to be "tricks."
JMHO.
Bill
"Don't tell me the sky is the limit when there are footprints on the moon."
It's not like there are only two approaches - "Bo Peep" or "Take Charge".
There are many grades and combinations in between.
I agree!
Throughout all of my "tough stances" in my sitch, I maintained a "loving detachment" towards my wayward wife. Oh, we had our moments -- three or four real blow-ups -- but for the most part, we managed to keep things civil. I laid out some boundaries (no family finances used to enable your affair, no TMing or phoning OM from inside our home, no TMing or phoning OM in front of our sons, from ANYWHERE, if you're going to come home after 1am, don't bother coming home, etc.), and I must say, she respected them almost completely.
The "loving" part of "loving detachment" comes easier for you, trust me, when you maintain full intel ("snooping") and you hear and see the things that I heard and saw. But I did try to "shine a light back towards the marriage, even as I never wavered from my Main Boundary ("I will not live in an open marriage") and my sub-boundaries mentioned above. I would do occasional loving Acts of Service for my wife, such as pulling her car in the garage late at nite, or covering her with a blanket when she fell asleep on the couch, kissing her on the forehead, etc.
I believe that this "hybrid" approach -- aggressive confrontation & exposure, firm boundaries, cut off all financial enabling, strong legal stance; coupled with DBing principles such as GAL, "be the better option," 180s, etc. -- is what works best when there is active infidelity involved.
Reasonable people may disagree, but this is what worked for me, and this is also what I have seen work in my time on these boards, as well as my study of literally thousands of affairs.
On the other hand, it is more than possible to maintain a calm and friendly demeanor with a WAS while still not allowing them to do or have anything they want. I believe some refer to it as "boundaries."
The problem is that far too many people seem to think the choices are either no boundaries or boundary their ass out of town and your life. Again, the truth often rests somewhere in between.
I tend to believe that the most effective strategy with a WAS is to live your life to the fullest while remaining true to how you actually feel about the potential future status of your marital relationship.
I agree with this. I just posted the same question in my thread on MLC. I think if you go dark then you appear weak. You essentially are saying you can't handle the situation with courage and integrity. I am not saying you allow cake-eating and you should have boundaries. If you go dark or hardline I think it communicating "you kicked me in the nuts and now I'm not going to talk to you"
There is an opportunity to be the stronger person and manage the situation.
I am not sure I agree with snooping it leads only to heartache and doesn't help the detaching process. But that's just what works for me.
My goal is to some day be the person my dog thinks I am
Ironically, "snooping" (intel gathering) actually HELPED me detach. By hearing -- and seeing -- what my wife was doing, it enabled me to not follow my usual pattern of going all "melty man" whenever she would throw me a bone. As I look back now and re-read my journal that I kept during that time, I am astounded by the number of times I might have otherwise done something DRASTICALLY wrong, tactically or strategically, if I didn't have intel backing me up.
It depends on the individual, though -- they have to be able to handle it (and some of it is pretty damned hard to stomach).
I would only add if you know there's an A, why do you need the gory details? What can you use that for? WAS is not behaving rationally so you actually want to know how crazy? How much more evidence do you need?
Puppy I can see your point that when you know how f#cked up the A is then it kind of sets your resolve. If you already have that evidence- then snooping is pointless, it only makes it harder to detach and definitely harder to forgive.
The basic premise to this is that your spouse is really temporarily insane. I am speaking from an MLC perpective here. You already have all the evidence or should have that you need to know that this is the state of affairs. Snooping is just asking for a 2X4 to the cowboys. IMHO.
How can you detach if you are obsessed with snooping? That has just been my expereince.
My goal is to some day be the person my dog thinks I am
I would only add if you know there's an A, why do you need the gory details? What can you use that for?
1. to verify initially whether or not there is infidelity involved in your sitch, so that you can attack it appropriately.
2. to establish evidence/grounds for a possible divorce action if yours is a "fault" state.
3. to gather evidence for a possible custody battle, and to help you make a determination as to whether or not you SHOULD go for custody (is the cheating spouse engaging in risky behavior that would make them a poor parent in their current state).
4. to determine what it is that OM/OW is providing your spouse, so that you may begin to better provide it. To determine what OM/OW is doing that ticks your spouse off, so that you can avoid those behaviors.
5. as an early warning system for any possible financial or legal threats to you or your family.
6. to monitor what outside pressures are having an affect on your spouse (her parents, her friends, your adult children, etc.).
7. to determine if the affair has gotten physical (medical risk).
8. to verify no-contact once no-contact and transparency have been agreed to as part of reconciliation.
9. to determine the extent to which you believe OM/OW may be a risk to your spouse and/or your family (ex.: abuse, unstable behavior, etc.).
10. to expose deceitful tactics of the cheating spouse which, if unverified, may lead you to make false assumptions and tactical errors (ex.: cheating spouse says they want to go to MC to try to work on reconciling the marriage, but they confide to a BF that they are only doing it to buy time while they squirrel away marital assets to be used on a divorce).
Those are some "pro's" just off the top of my head.
On the "con" side, all I can come up with is:
1. If you don't control your emotions, you may not be able to handle it.
I'm sorry, this whole "snooping is BAD!" thing, to me, is just one of those mantras that gets mindlessly repeated, until it becomes part of the official catechism, without stopping to consider the real merits of it.
I'm not sure if I can use any of this in my sitch or not. We are two months away from D being final. W is living in her own apartment with her own assets from upcoming D and OM is "visiting" right now and I don't know if it is EA or PA. I'm assuming PA but I don't have any proof. How can I combat this? I would love to know what W sees in OM over me. Kids are all adults.
Sorry to hijack but I just had to ask.
Me48 WAW46 M24 yrs S24 D21 D19 EA disc 6/09 2nd EA Fall 09 I move out 11/12/09 W and I switch 1/14/10 D Filed 3/17/10 W moves in with OM 6/8/10 D Final 6/21/10
