No, I don't think anyone is stupid, I think some people are lazy and don't listen or read when they shoul be is all.
I think that can apply to all of us at times.....as you state further on in your post. However, I felt you were implying that I was not comprehending the posts and comments ....yet I was. I was just commenting on my surprise at the phrasing.
I don't tend to like such an abrasive style-I find it turns me away, however I do know Harley's work to some extent and like yourself, look for those nuggets of information that strike a chord and make sense. I try to keep an open mind as far as possible. I try to do the same with all the books I read on infidelity by the 'experts'. Some things make sense, others just seem plain strange, whilst once I got so mad at something I was reading I threw the book at the wall!!!!!
However, one can also get to overload point and I think at the stage I am at in my M ,that is where I am. My T has told me to stop reading some of the stuff I was reading and he was right. Time to move on. Time to just ensure my M never gets to the state it did before that made my H feel the need to look elsewhere.
Saffie me 46 H 46 M in 1986 D20,D18,S16,D13 H's A 01/05 to 07/06 H recommitted to M 07/06 renewed vows 09/06 Going from strength to strength
How to Survive Infidelity After having counseled thousands of couples with hundreds of marital conflicts, I am completely convinced that a spouse's unfaithfulness is the most painful experience that can be inflicted in marriage.
My emphasis.. the referene above is to the "hundreds of marital conflicts" he has observed, and yes he is putting infidelity at the top of those.
is infidelity not the worst thing your spouse has done to you? In my case it certainly was
Quote:
Those I've counseled who have had the tragic misfortune of having experienced rape, physical abuse, sexual abuse of their children, and infidelity have consistently reported to me that their spouse's unfaithfulness was their very worst experience. To be convinced of the devastating impact of infidelity, you only need to go through it once.
These are client reports that posters here are attributing to Harley himself.
Originally Posted By: saffie
OK, this was the quote. Now where is he placing infidelity and what weight is he putting on it in regard to the other deeds?
He isn't, he's reporting that his clients have reported this to him. You are putting words in HIS mouth that he isn't saying on his own behalf. And to my knoweledge he hasn't experienced infidelity himself, he may have but I am not aware of that, so to my knoweldge he couldn't make a fair comparison.. he relies on reports from clients.
But more to the point the BIG PICTURE here is that he's driivng infidelity OUT of the ROMANCE novel and into the CRIMINAL context.. THAT is the focus here... Again that is the subtext and my interpretation, so feel free to quibble about this further if you like.
That is the subtext, in my reading anyways, of what he wants to CONVEY in this block of text. Quibbling about if He himself puts infidelity as worse than rape on his personal scale of offenses is missing the point of the exercise.
"Infidelity is a horrible act, its not romantic or beaitiful" is what i am getting from reading this.. you can nitpick all you want, but his message to my mind is crytal clear.. and a message tht MANY PEOPLE aren't aware of, or infidelity would not be as widespread as it is.
I don't tend to like such an abrasive style-I find it turns me away, however I do know Harley's work to some extent and like yourself, look for those nuggets of information that strike a chord and make sense. I try to keep an open mind as far as possible. I try to do the same with all the books I read on infidelity by the 'experts'. Some things make sense, others just seem plain strange, whilst once I got so mad at something I was reading I threw the book at the wall!!!!!
I believe Spring in After the Affair at one point said that the LBS was equially responsible for the affair happening... THAT I found offensive, but I still reccomend her book.
I dont' agree with everyting Harley says, and I have argued with Penny Tuppy via email multiple times as well, BUT I still reccomend their work, its some of the best out there.. and to my mind the most important tools to have when an addictive affair is happening, I found MWD's DR to be far less uselful during the affair.
Nope, it is pointing out that it is NOT the important part of the passage.
Furthermore my patience is growing thin with defending passages that to my mind are quite clearly written but aren't being read caerfully or given the time they are due.
I don't see any indication here that Harley is himself saying that infidelity is worse than gang rape... but this has been a sub thread of this whole thread for sometime.. and it frustrates me that so much valuable time is being wasted on a misreading of a passage and that MORE time is being put into that than what the IMPORTANT part of the passage is...
THAT to my mind is a more important question, and the one in my reading of this passage what Harley is alluding to.
Why is everyone so hung up on ranking infidelity with criminal offenses? The IMPORTANT point is that he IS categorizig it with crimiinal offenses.. THAT is being IGNORED.
THAT to my mind is a more important question, and the one in my reading of this passage what Harley is alluding to.
Why is everyone so hung up on ranking infidelity with criminal offenses? The IMPORTANT point is that he IS categorizig it with crimiinal offenses.. THAT is being IGNORED.
We actually did have a thread about that once, maybe about a year ago. It garnered quite a lot of interesting, spirited debate!
However, I don't take the criminal aspect out of what he wrote. I think he's trying to point out that of all the painful, traumatic things that can happen in a married relationalship, INCLUDING the criminal offenses listed, infidelity is the worst.
Merely listing them together does not imply they are all in one category or another, merely all "tragic misfortunes" as he states.
"Hey, honey, do you want to go to the baseball game, football game, basketball game, or the theatre tonight?" does not imply that the treatre is a sporting event.
Everybody hurts. It's part of life. Don't miss the good stuff.
However, I don't take the criminal aspect out of what he wrote. I think he's trying to point out that of all the painful, traumatic things that can happen in a married relationalship, INCLUDING the criminal offenses listed, infidelity is the worst.
Merely listing them together does not imply they are all in one category or another, merely all "tragic misfortunes" as he states.
I will state yet AGAIN, he is reporting what his CLIENTS have claimed, it is NOT his grouping.. it is a REFERENCE ONLY.
My point again is that we are getting WAY TOO WORKED UP over how a passage of text is written... its text not a bible. I suspect if he had time he woudl likley rewrite this to be clearer to those who choose to get worked up about it.
I try to look PAST this and try to grab the POINT he's trying to convey.. and the point I am getting at least is that he wants us to understand how HORRIBLE it is.. and putting it in the same PARAGRAPH as criminal offenses does just that.
I am happy wiht what he wrote here, I am not gonig to get worked up over specifics. His point is blatantly clear to me.
