tta needs to attack complacency and passive aggressive tendencies to break the cycle. And this cycle happens very quickly between them. Which I agree with her Mother on.
CB, what do you mean by that? how do you suggest that i attack complacency and passive aggressive tendencies?
and when you say you agree with my mother, do you mean you think it would happen again no matter what?
I agree with your mother on the recycling of your relationship. She is speaking with wisdom and love here.
As for attacking. You need to really analyze the patterns and write it out. And then come up with some alternate solutions. And perhaps one day will be given the opportunity to have a very open and candid conversation with your H about this and how he needs to get help on this issue.
If not you will at least have learned some new skills for the future.
tta needs to attack complacency and passive aggressive tendencies to break the cycle. And this cycle happens very quickly between them. Which I agree with her Mother on.
Hi TTA - I hope you aren't reading this yet, so you can really benefit from being at your other home in the south...but if you are, hope everything is going well~
I'm copying from my thread a couple ideas I got from Retrouville I thought might be something to consider. Before that, I want to say 100% if your husband is afraid to go, I can offer my email address to you if he has questions. Having seen 2 couples that remind me of your story (except the ADHD), I am sure now more than ever you can make it work IF you and he want to.
Anyhow: "It wasn't an opposite approach that DB, but it works very well with my POV here on the blog. I believe that the emotional state of myself and my W was a critical component that needs mending.
Lots of the advice here is about GAL or to detatch. RV is not about that at all. In fact, it is against it in one way.
The idea of GAL/detatching is that you work on you, ignoring the other. RV tells us that we GAL to attach, not to detach emotionally to the spouse.
I'm now seeing the idea of GAL as written in DB, I think, more as the author intended it. When a S leaves, you need to not attach ONE sided to a spouse (cling, pursue), but rather find ways to attach together. In many situations here, the other spouse is out of the picture, so this might not be possible.
Detatchment might be to allow healing and growth from the experience.
At some point though, I think both spouses might get into piecing, and that is where RV has it's impact. It also might make some couples ready to patch up their marriage and deal with the hurt and trust issues.
Instead of saying, you hurt me and now you need to make ME trust you, RV seems to be (so far) saying that I need to find reasons to trust YOU by communicating together in safe, controlled emotional ways.
There are things we have to do at home, though, and with patience and prayer, I hope I can do it and more at home at a slower pace for her.
I'm still in a 'shell-shocked' mode, having a real emotional rollercoaster. I also felt a few moments of love, something I am now sure I have NEVER felt for my W until now.
So it was worth it. Anyone reading - consider going. It will hurt much, much more if a D happens. But it will be worth it because I really feel I have truly tried every approach.
DB: Work on me Book reading: Communication, understanding her POV and history RV: The emotional connection."
I hope this gives you more hope.
I know the majority of the advice is to GAL, and I'm not saying don't because your H is still away. I'm saying that GAL makes you "married singles", and I now believe that there are limits that are important to a marriage one can't pass when they are trying to break connections.
Your H knows he needs and loves you. For you, the RV weekend might be best for you both to share your emotions each day while you are separated, and eventually together.
OTM, I have never been to RV and I don't really understand what you are trying to Communicate in your post above specifically to TTA. I do however appreciate your feedback of RV - it is a really great program.
I think there might be a core issue missing here. RV concepts are centered around two spouses WILLING to work on the M. That is totally different than what DR addresses - when ONE spouse is willing and the other is not.
RV advice is great - when applied at the right time. In most of the situations in the newcomers forum it is not the right time. RV concepts may do more harm than good if not applied with the right timing.
Remember - right now most of the folks on here have a partner that is NOT willing to work on the relationship - that means that the concepts of an "emotional connection" you are describing from RV is not applicable.
I think your advice to TTA to go to RV is wonderful - I am a big fan of their program! It just might be too early yet - her H isn't there... he needs to be willing to work on the M - by HIS declaration. Otherwise any request to go to RV or any other type of couples counseling is considered pursuing.
This thing works in stages - and timing is everything!!!
T
ME28,WAH30, M 5YRS, T 7YRS ,OW/ILYBNILY/SEP 9/09 Served with D papers 6/6/10 Current
Not so much willing to work, but willing to come. Quite a few of the couples had one spouse that went but had been or were unwilling to work. By the end of the w/end, they don't having things all solved, but many of them have the desire to continue the RV program.
If a partner doesn't want to go, of course nothing will get them there. If they go wanting it to fail and refuse to do any of the activities, of course they will get nowhere that day.
it was a long, exhausting, frustrating, rewarding, wonderful, fulfilling, amazing, sad weekend. so hard to see the devastation that still haunts the lower 9th ward in new orleans, especially the incredible number of houses that are boarded up and still stand empty as they were left when the levees broke back in 2005. i pushed myself outside of my comfort level on so many occassions and only felt rewarded in return. i cut, laid and grouted an entire tile floor! i designed, laid and grouted tile around a fireplace! i met new people, i flirted (!!!!) with someone in my group, i recharged my batteries and i am so SO glad that i went. it was an amazing experience and i loved every minute. i'm only shocked that it went by so quickly.
things have gone well with my H since i left. he continued to send tender messages, some of which i responded to, some of which i didn't. i did not see him before i left and just got back today, so it's been about 2 weeks since i've seen him face to face. i know he had a hard time while i was away and hit some really low emotional points, but all i could do was say i was sorry he was feeling that way and leave him to sort out his own feelings. he must have had a revealing session with his IC while i was away, because he said he'd come to a lot of realizations about his behavior and his patterns, and even asked if i would consider going to see a MC together when i got back.
it actually made me mad when he said that...when i asked him back in january, he was done doing work on us and had no interest. i know i should want to jump for joy that he suggested he may be ready now, but it really upsets me that i've had to wait until he was ready. i let him know that, but told him i would think about seeing someone together. i still haven't really decided. i know this is supposed to be what i want, but now that he's asked i find myself angry that when i suggested it i got shot down. still working through my feelings on that issue.
my mom today told me to just cut my losses and move on, because my H isn't capable of real love. i did spend a lot of time while i was hammering and grouting and painting trim thinking about what i really want...but still don't feel like i have a sense of clarity on that.
i wonder if my H would be open to something like RV now that he's suggested MC. i think his new IC is really helping him open some doors that are helping him really better understand himself. yesterday i got a message from him about how he finally realized he needed to make a lot of changes in order to be in a healthy relationship and he'd never been ok with changing himself before.
so, while i do feel great about the last week at home and the time i spent away, i don't really feel like i have a clear idea of what i want moving forward. but i laughed a lot. my heart broke a hundred times. i did things i never thought i would be able to do. i let strangers get to know me and i got to know strangers. i journaled, i took a ton of photos, i saw old friends and i ate about 10 pounds of crawfish.
i feel good. and that's all that i need right now.
hope you all had a good week while i was away, i need to catch up on some threads!!!
Me30 H29 M2.5 T5 H moved out 1/23/2010 H wants signed agreement 3/30/2010 ...feeling hopeless
may meet up with my H tonight or tomorrow. much to tell him about my trip, and i know he wants to talk about the possibility of us trying MC in the near future. i guess i am ok with giving it a shot, after all, i'm here to DB, right? it doesn't even mean either of us is saying, ok, we want to work this out...i think for both of us it's more like seeing where things could go. but at least he's gotten to a point in his mind where he could even bring up the topic of MC.
it's weird because i miss him...but i don't miss him. this morning when i woke up, i was sure he was next to me in bed, but then when i realised he wasn't, i wasn't overwhelmed with grief the way i have been in the past. not sure if that means i'm moving forward or just moving on.
one thing i know, is this whole R is just not on my mind to the extent that it was a few weeks ago. it gets in the way of my GAL!
Me30 H29 M2.5 T5 H moved out 1/23/2010 H wants signed agreement 3/30/2010 ...feeling hopeless
thanks for the link, OTM. i'm at work now but i'll definitely check it out later when i have some privacy.
met up with my H last night for dinner. it feels like it's been forever since i've seen him. we started off with small talk, asked about each other's families, jobs, that kind of stuff. later on we talked about the phone conversation we'd had last week where he'd asked me about us seeing a counselor together and i sort of told him off. he said i was right about everything i'd said, that no one had ever held him accountable for anything he'd ever done and he'd never had to take any real responsibility for his own actions. he said he didn't like the person he'd become over the last 10 years and he wanted to change but didn't know how or if he even could. he also said he didn't believe he was worth the things he'd put me through and that i'd be crazy to try and work things out with him.
what i wanted to do was soothe and assure him, tell him he was wrong, he was worth the fight, all those things that my gut wanted to say to make him feel better. but i didn't. he said, you deserve to be with someone who will love you unselfishly, not like i have, and i just looked him in the eye and said, i know. he said he is very proud of how i've handled myself and that i've done so much soul-searching and even found it within myself to reach out to others in need during a time when i was in need myself. sadly...no one else has told me they were proud. my family has said they were happy i had been able to do it, but no one else has said they were proud.
on top of all of this, my mom's 60th birthday is on sunday. she drove me to an appointment yesterday and started sobbing in the car about how she was going to be 60, and the one thing she wants most - grandchildren - is the one thing she can't have (my sister broke off an engagement over a year ago and has no real "marriage prospects" at the moment, and well, look where i am). i tell you, i could have crumbled under the weight of that pressure. nothing like your mother making you feel like a failure after coming back from a service trip where you thought you were making a difference.
so, i don't know if we will seek MC together or not. my H seems to be in a really low place, especially if he can say he's not worth it and i deserve better. of course part of me feels like that's just a cop out...but, i don't know. he left me in tears and he did a fair amount of crying last night. i know all i can do at this point is just let him go, but knowing it and doing it are 2 different things.
i did buy my H a book yesterday, called Switch: How to Change When Change is Hard. I started reading the first few chapters and oddly enough, the authors quote MWD and mention her book, DB. funny that. hopefully he'll read it...when i gave it to him, he said he had been on the verge of downloading the audiobook the night before.
sigh. WHERE IS THAT DANG EASY BUTTON WHEN YOU NEED IT??!?!
Me30 H29 M2.5 T5 H moved out 1/23/2010 H wants signed agreement 3/30/2010 ...feeling hopeless
