In late summer of 2008 we had gone to a picnic and I got totally bombed. In fact, stupid drunk. I dont get like that too often. Anyway when we got home, of course I wanted her and I to make love. Well, she wasnt into it. ( I apologize again that i need to be graphic) sorry.. Instead I had asked for W to perform oral sex on me. Well, she did but now I find out that this is a big problem for her. You see, I was very agressive with her. I complained a that she wasnt doing it right, and that I couldnt get off. She now tells me that she was scared, that she has never seen me like that. The look in my eyes scared her. I know I was very drunk, and repeatedly apologized to her.
We had left home after that and went to a friends home. I told her there "jokingly so I thought" that she was a terrible c*&ksucker... Terrible, I know. I am ashamed and have told her that too. I embarrassed her and degraded her. I cannot express how aweful I feel that I did that to her.
Nice guys don't do things like that.
You WANT to ALWAYS be nice. Always.
Being nice means that if your wife wants a divorce or wants you to leave her alone, that you DO leave her alone and that you DO have the self esteem to allow her to have her own feelings and thoughts on what she wants...without trying to do all sorts of acts to show her how "wrong" she is and doing all sorts of things to suddenly pressure her to come back to you now that you have had an awakening. Nice guys don't do those things......
Being nice does NOT mean that you pursue a woman who acts and says that she no longer wants to be with you. Being nice does NOT mean that you send her flowers and tell her you will rub her feet, and do the dishes and do all the housework and allow her to come and go as she pleases, while she says and acts like she wants out of the relationship. That is NOT being nice, but being stupid.
I consider myself and my wife would consider me an extremely nice guy. She wouldn't have married me if I wasn't a nice guy. (some women on HERE would disagree with that.) Doesn't MATTER to me. What matters is what my WIFE thinks of me and what I think of myself.
However. She knows that I am SOOOO nice that if she had an affair that I would be nice enough to not only let her go, but that I would WANT her to go. I am so nice that I don't even share my wife with another man. I am so nice that I would NOT even fight for her to win her back. I am so nice that I would immediately start going out and having the time of my life and enjoying many many things that I don't do because I am married and because I am SUCH a nice guy.
Why? Why should I? I AM already a nice guy.
Lose the terms..... Call it anything you want... Nice guy, jerk, A-hole, moron, idiot.. etc....
Whatever we call it, chasing and pursuing someone who does NOT want you does NOT work to win them back very often. RARELY...
I consider Puppy a very nice guy... I bet his wife considers him a nice guy. In my view. The nice guy DOES have a good chance to reconcile with his wife. And his best chance for that is to be nice enough to let her go when she moves away from him emotionally. Nice enough to know that he WILL be perfectly fine if she so chooses to leave him or start a relationship with another man.
ALWAYS be nice......
More important.... BE WISE.... Wisdom is what you need here. The wisdom to really really figure out the difference between what works to win a woman back and what doesn't.
Don't get caught up in terms or definitions.... Ok.. Call yourself a nice guy. Ok. Let women tell you they want a nice guy. Be wise and figure out what traits that guys have that are successful with women demonstrate. Then do those things. Then call yourself a nice guy. Makes no difference who puts what term on you. Do WHAT works...
In YOUR situation.... You SHOULD continue to show her your remorse with what you did to her and how you treated her those times you were drinking...
"You are right honey, I don't blame you for wanting out and for not being able to forget what I did to you. I was WRONG. I was totally wrong. I understand how you can feel that way about me now."
That is your mantra when SHE brings up a relationship talk. DEFAULT to that position EVERY TIME.
"You are right honey, I don't blame you for wanting out and for not being able to forget what I did to you. I was WRONG. I was totally wrong. I understand how you can feel that way about me now."
Do NOT add things like.."If you would give me another chance,or I was drunk, or why can't you forget it."
Always default to... "You are right honey, I don't blame you for wanting out and for not being able to forget what I did to you. I was WRONG. I was totally wrong. I understand how you can feel that way about me now."
And then be quiet. Keep on this mantra... Give her emotional space. Do NOT ask her to forgive you. LIVE your life like you mean it with her when you say you were wrong and when you say you understand. (because you SHOULD understand why she would feel that way. I understand why she would and so should you)
I agree about most of the points made here in the last few pages...I think the important thing to keep in mind is the attributes that Puppy and others have refereneced, confidence, assertiveness, maturity, and civility.
The behaviours exhibited w/in the context of these attributes is the way to go...behaviors on the opposite side (pursuit, begging, supplicating, emotional breakdows, etc) are what need to be avoided.
Ive thouroughly enjoyed reading the last few pages and can say do what you want, if you find it doesn't work, try something else, like they said you have to live in reality as the example of living in an ideal world is very true...we do not live there.
I have done the default position that both you and Rob have recommened . I have admitted fault, I also told her that I was ashamed of my behavior, and told her I was totally wrong. I did say, that she will need to learn how to forgive me before we get past this. I may have been wrong in saying that, but its done. I also told her that if she feels in her heart that she can never can past this, and that she needs to go in a different direction that I understand fully.
I am admitting right now that ( and not proud of it) that I do pursue. Its been my biggest mistake since this all came down. I am really working hard at not pursuing. Trust me when I say that I have made huge improvements recently. In the last 2 weeks, this past Saturday was another episode of pursuing..Its got to stop totally, I know..
I really like the Wise comments.
I know that this takes time, you have all given me some great insights, not even my IC has said things like this. When I think carefully of the thoughts presented here, there are some that I beleive will be a tremendous help.
I know that right now my W is not in a good place right now either. As a caring husband I cannot help but care. I want to be there for her to help her through these emotions. I KNOW THAT I CANNOT... need to back off and she needs to work on her self while I work on me, my self esteem and confidence and move in the opposite direction.
Last night I went to a office function and one of the ladies who sat next to me as hitting on me. What a confidence booster that was. I came home later on and was happy and chirpy with my W. Todl her it was a good time and she continued to read her book.
This morning, just before she left for work, I mentioned to her that as the kids are off for march break next week, I was thinking of taking them to a museum. She was at first taken back because she was working most of next week except Thursday and Friday, and she felt that I am not inviting her. She mentioned she would like to go if I made it on those days. I said sure.
As she was leaving I told her to smile today and that she will be fine. I was at a distance so that I wasnt intimidated or anything. so, is it nice, or the "nice guy syndrom" again..
M 43 W 43 S15 S 12 D 10 ILYBNILWY ( Dec 2009) Sleeping separate rooms April 8 2010. Sep as of 07/14/2010 W moving out 07/31/2010 No OM confirmed ( yet)
maynard don't assume failure, having that type of attitude and mindset actually brings that into your life, how about assuming you will be successful regardless of the current situation and circumstances - it's a good vibe to have, it keeps you in a positive happy state and overall being happy & positive is attractive, being negative & fatalistic is a downer and not attractive at all - you can do it!
I agree Maynard. But as I told her to smile and the "she" will be fine. I am working on my confidence and not worried if she takes it the worng or right way at this point. I was being happy when I said it..
By the way, I know how you feel about the being in denial comment. I got that too. Its the pits, but we apparently doent listen very well either.
Per Rob, go the opposit direction.
M 43 W 43 S15 S 12 D 10 ILYBNILWY ( Dec 2009) Sleeping separate rooms April 8 2010. Sep as of 07/14/2010 W moving out 07/31/2010 No OM confirmed ( yet)
thanks- I am / have been very guilty of feeding the negativity...and it is a self-fulfilling prophecy...
In my sitch when I exude the confidence or positivity- I was accused of being in denial...
Thin line to walk- as long as the focus is on me I guess there can be no denial
maybe because you're thinking the negative thoughts but putting on the happy face but the body language shows that you're faking it, don't discount the body language as it is more powerful than the words you speak and women specifically tend to be more intuitive than men when it comes to reading body language.
Time to start thinking those positive thoughts and allowing those vibes to come out in the body language, you can't control what your wife thinks so you might as well focus on enjoying your life and making it a good one.
(some women on HERE would disagree with that.) Doesn't MATTER to me. What matters is what my WIFE thinks of me and what I think of myself.