Looking for help with WAW

[mza8]

Update...

Talked to my W yesterday when we were both at the house. We started off by talking about selling the house, and what realtor to use. We didn't agree on who to use and then my W started to get upset and we began to argue. I tried to keep it calm. She then tried to argue about other things (car, other things) and was trying to push my buttons. I did get a bit upset with her because I thought she was being unreasonable. Then she got even more angry and said the conversation was over and if i wanted to talk to her then I should contact her attorney. She got in her car in the garage and was going to leave. I went out and tried to calm her down and we talked for an hour.

She finally began to open up to me about the M. She told me that she had questioned her staying in the M for the past 3-4 years. In the past she has told me it was less than one year and another time she told me two years so who knows which of these three is true. She told me again how she wasn't sure even before we were married if I was a motivated person...speaking about job again. She told me that she wants to challenge herself and wants to be with someone who challenges her. I asked her why she didn't tell me some of this earlier in the M and she said that if she did the M might have been over years ago. Asked her if she had any feelings for me anymore and she said that we had some great memories together but she didn't answer the question. I know I shouldn't have even asked that question because I doubt she would give me an honest answer.

She kept telling me that she didn't want to give me any hope and that I needed to let her go. She said this is very painful and emotional for her right now especially dealing with the house, car, division of things. She told me again how I have talked her into things in the past and she didn't want me to talk her into anything now. We talked about our meeting two weeks ago and some of our recent conversations since then. I told her that I don't think we are comminicating well at all and that's a big reason that we are where we are today and she nodded her head in agreement. I said that we are pushing each others buttons and she laughed and again nodded her head in agreement. A couple of times during the conversation she said again how it's too late. I told her that I don't believe it's too late but I know this is where she is today but not necessarily will be in the future. At first she told me that she doesn't know what will happen in the future but for now I had to let her go. Later in the conversation she would be more firm about her position and say that she doesn't want to reconcile. So she sort of said two different things.

We talked about some of our issues. I listened and validated, remained calm. She slowly began to open up. She said a couple of interesting things. All of this time I had questioned how she would be able to see any of my changes since we are separated but it seems that she is looking for changes. For example, I mentoned that I would like for us to go to counseling together and she said that I wanted everything but I wasn't willing to give her anything. She said that I want it my way with the house, car, etc. and now I am wanting for us to go to counseling but I that I am unwilling to do anything for her by agreeing on the house, car, etc. She said that I hadn't changed. Wow, she is paying attention. I thought for a minute and validated and said she was right. I told her that I'll work with her better on these issues. I asked her again to think about going to counseling together and she agreed to think about it. She told me again that she did't want to go for reconciliation. I told her that I didn't want either of us to go with any agenda. I didn't want to go for the purpose of reconciliation and I didn't want her to go for the purpose of closure. I told her I would like us to go just to be able to learn how to communicate better because I beleive that is one of the main reasons we are where we are today (she nodded in agreement). She didn't say no to this and again said she will think about it.

We agreed to tslk again tomorrow about the house. I will be prepared to make a decision so we can put it for sale and get this behind us.

So now I'm questioning if this was a good conversation or not? Did it improve the situation or not? In talking to my DB coach she said it is normal for the WAW not to want to give any hope, my W is doing this. DB coach said things can change if the dynamic changes. Said to try to regain trust with my W. Said to become friendly again with my W. Said that it will take time for W's feelings to change.

I don't know if I should have gotten into the R talk or not with W yesterday but I felt like it was time. I also feel like it's time to try to get us into counseling together. I was probably controlling when I told her how we should approach counseling but I wanted to see if I could get her to not focus so much on going for closure and instead be more open to go to discuss better communication. I also mentioned Retrouville again to her and said that perhaps it would be something we could consider in the future. She didn't say anything. After reading TBL's thread and experience with Retrouville it seems like it was a good experience for him and his W. I asked my W if she was in counseling and she said that she is seeing a counselor. My W asked me why I wanted to go to a different counselor other than hers or mine. I told her that I think it would be best to go to a counselor who is neutral. The new counselor I have in mind for us to see is highly recommended and is very pro M.

So what do I do now? It's obvious that the house, car, etc. is a huge stress for my W and I need to get those things behind us asap. I have wanted to but my W has been slow to contact me about them. I was ok with the conversation except I was hurt by her one comment that she wants to be with someone who challenges her. I don't get that one? I think my W has this fantasy about life. This seems like a typical thought for someone in MLC. I told her not to think that the man I was for the last couple of years is the true me. I talked about my depression again and that I didn't want to be that person either. I talked about love and how it changes over time in a M. Told her that I believe everyone deserves a second chance at least once. I probably shouldn't have mentioned some of these things but I wanted to make sure I put these thoughts into her hesd.

I think I am at a point where the next steps I take are very important. I think my W and I are at a transition now where we are finally starting to talk. Yes, she still says she wants a D but I know from reading other sitch's that this can change. The good thing for my sitch is neither of us are involved with anyone else. I think some of the DB solutions apply in my sitch and some do not. I'm not so sure that tough love applies here. I think trying to take away some of the stress and emotion is key right now. I think it's time for counseling. I need professional help with my W right now. I'm not always sure how to respond to some of the things she says and I don't want to make matters worse, I want to improve things. I feel like meeting with a counselor will help us stay focused on talking about certain things without drifting off into an arguement. I'm hoping the counselor keeps both of us focused in the discussion.

I would be happy to hear any and all suggestions on what to do next. W and I wer able to laugh and I got her to smile at certain times during the oncversation. It was nice to see her smile.

Sandi, what now?