How do I expose the affair

[Allen A]

Also... there woudl be positive things going on like taking walks and such... that would be in the list as well... all those positive things you two like to do together..

You put these in the list... you try the EASIEST ones FIRST and gradualy work up to the harder ones...

SEX is often NOT done again right away, it may take several months before that's discussed again.

This is SBT, its focussed on diong ACTIONS that build trust and cooperation... NO psychoanalysis or academic gibberish.. concreete ideas and work to be done that are drafted by yourselves and polished up as therapy by the FT.

It does work in practice, MWD does this stuff all the time...

[Allen A]

But that stuff can't happen if your spouse won't even admit to doing the damage in the first place.

I SUSPECT that woudl be on the list mb28 AND 4luv, you would likely want BOTH of your husbands to OWN the affair and ADMIT there WAS one... full disclosure SHOULD be on the list.

If they won't even own that, there's no point in doing the other stuff yet... they need to take the step of saying

OK, I did damage here, I need to fix that up.

[Allen A]

It's a pretty simple approach really

1. STOP doing damage
2. Do the things on the list to heal the past hurts

And keep that work up for the rest of your lives and you will be fine.

[4luv]

It's a pretty simple approach really

1. STOP doing damage
2. Do the things on the list to heal the past hurts

And keep that work up for the rest of your lives and you will be fine.

:-) makes it seem sooo simple but gives hope that it really is that simple. I think that STEP 1 is the hardest for any person to admit to WILLINGLY doing damage to their family.

[Allen A]

Back to the question about him being on the fence and offering recommitment.

The FT would eventually ask him :

Are you willing to do the work needed to explore reconciliation?

The thing is, the FT is NOT going to tell him to divorce or to recommit, a GOOD FT will say

I believe you two can rebuild your marriage if you do the work. Doing the work is how we learn if rebuilding your marriage is possible.

Its like asking someone if they can build a house if they never have before.

The answer really isnt "NO", its just "I havent' done it before, so I don't know"

The only way to KNOW if you can build a house is to TRY to BUILD it...

THIS is what the FT shoudl be telling your H's.. both of you...

Your guys want to KNOW but they DON'T want to have to do any WORK to find OUT

Well, reconcilliation is a process, and work, the end result of that process and work is the answer they are both seeking.

MB28, your husband right now has already DECIDED what the answer IS... wtihout doing any work or even an ounce of research, he's jumping to conclusions...

BUT people in affairs and even who are just wayward and sad will ASSUME the WORST and JUMP to conclusions...

waywards are

Impulsive
Negative
Cynical
Moody
Presumptuous
Angry
Miserable
Flighty
Erratic

Etc... these behaviours in my opinion and people showing them are NOT in a place to make ANY decisions about their marriage, I think the BEST thing for them is to EXPLORE their marriage again under the safe guidance of a GOOD FT.

Far too often they DON'T go to counselling when feeling like this, they find a female "friend" who has a shoulder to cry on...

You know the rest...

But ya, they need to be willing to do the work... a FT can help them get there...

Recommitment happens at the END of this process... when they are HAPPY again.. THEN you ask them if they are willing to commit again... you NEVER ask them on their first day in...

[Allen A]

:-) makes it seem sooo simple but gives hope that it really is that simple. I think that STEP 1 is the hardest for any person to admit to WILLINGLY doing damage to their family.

Well, mb28's H was halfway there in the latest phone call

He ALMOST admitted his affair...

He IS admitting he's hurting her, but he NEEDS to be specific... he cannot be a husband OR a father if he can't be HONEST with his wife about what he's doing...

He's afraid to admit to her specifically HOW he is hurting her and he's afraid to say it even to himself I think...

I think he really hates himself right now...

he also needs to admit he violated someone else's home.

MB28, does OW have children?

Did your H actaully attack a full family and try to break them apart or was it just OW and her husband?

Not that attacking a couple's relationship in secret is in any way OK, but its less hurtful than say attacking a family of five or six young infants...

[Allen A]

:-) makes it seem sooo simple but gives hope that it really is that simple. I think that STEP 1 is the hardest for any person to admit to WILLINGLY doing damage to their family.

You will also see something similar to this in the 12 step program that addicts use...

I don't know what number it is, I don't even drink a drop of alcohol myself.. my parents were both alcoholics... But, I know there is a step where you have to apologize to the people you have hurt and explain in detail the harm you have done.. It may be step 4, not sure.

[Allen A]

We ALSO teach children this.

If a child hurts soemone, you usually tell them to go back to the hurt child and

1. Apologize for the damage
2. Admit the wrong you have done
3. Do any work to repair the damage

This IS what we teach children to do right? Should we expect less of adults???

[newmama]

I would give him NC/Silent treatment until he addresses the infidelity with a FT... he wants to pretend it didn't HAPPEN.

This is soooooo important that he own up to it because you don't want a false reconciliation.

[4luv]

"The thing is, the FT is NOT going to tell him to divorce or to recommit, a GOOD FT will say

I believe you two can rebuild your marriage if you do the work. Doing the work is how we learn if rebuilding your marriage is possible."

^^^This is SOOO important mb28 and what newmama quoted above. When my husband and I first attempted counseling, my husband wasn't even mentioning an affair and denying the impact of earlier text messages that I found. It is NO USE in trying to do anything until he admits the cheating with the FT. That is ONE THING I will not stand for this time in FT. If my husband skirts over the issue I already have planned to end the session and say "I don't think these sessions will be useful with the two of us if both parties are not being honest. I will continue sessions alone for the time being."

Our FT was actually good from the three times I met with him and his exact words to husband and I were "I believe that you marriage can blossom if you both are committed to doing the work. Even if one of you are 100% committed and the other one is only 1 or 2% committed we can work from there. All I need is more 1 or more percent of hope and willingness from the both of you." OF course husband didn't commit because at that point he still hadn't admitted to being in an affair.

So mb28, one of the most important factors from my experience is that the WS (the one committing adultery) has to AT LEAST admit to the damage (the affair) that they have participated in.