NOBODY HAS EVER SAID 'THE KIDS WILL BE FINE'. NOBODY!
What we *did* express is the idea of faking a happy family (EX: Kevin's W coming to his apartment before the children woke up on Christmas so the appearance of a "normal and intact" family could exist) is dangerous with young children.
Right now Kevin and his W do not have a "normal and intact" family and faking it on holidays is not helpful to anybody. Of course divorced parents have to spend time as a family unit when children are involved. Nobody said otherwise. What is unnecessary, confusing and doles out huge amounts of false hope to you children are some of the things Kevin and his W did in the past (see Christmas example above).
You can post all the links you want. Some of them are informative but in ALL situations not ALL are applicable.
If you feel okay about your W sleeping with other men for what is going on two years and you validate her actions with friendship then GREAT! If you feel that doing work on you is enough to offer a WAS who has been invested heavily in sexually liaisons for quite some time is YOUR best course of action, well, great! If you choose to financially support your W while she is sleeping with other men, well, great!
If you are going to quote me then do so correctly. I never said "the kids will be okay" and I certainly have never quoted or referred to any sort of "divorce counseling" philosophies.
MWD is not the end all be all of marriage. One person cannot have *all* the answers to EVERY marriage situation which is why this forum is valuable. We take what may (or may not) work from her basic principles and expand the discussion with people from ALL walks of life.
Trent posts (almost daily) little snippets of advice from MWD and they are fine pearls of wisdom. However, many of her suggestions are not viable to a "couple" when they don't live together, one person is deeply invested in an affair, one party is causing financial ruin and so on. Much of her advice is far more suited to the "troubled couple" and frankly, if all "troubled couples" found her information years ago most of us would not be here at all!
This is not the first time you have done this... stated that certain posters have said something they did not. You are welcome to have a differing opinion (and even it call it B.S. like you did above) but do not misquote people.
Like K's W, your W was very interested in talking to you when the auto insurance issue came up and how she could save money (that is what you posted in the other section "surviving divorce" when she called you while you were at the hockey game a few months ago). If you feel that is being a good friend to your W (doesn't she live in another city?) and you are comfortable doing that in the name of something much larger, well, great. It's a fair question to ask you why your W would need to change? She has a H that is willing to live apart, help her get the best auto insurance rates and she can enjoy the perks of marriage when it is best for her.
Consequences don't equal being an ass. It simply means that if one spouses chooses not to be in the marriage then ALL things about the marriage cannot stay the same. It is not to "show her a hard ass stance". It is simple logic... when life circumstances change then the particulars must change.
Kevin posted two pages back that he learned his W was talking to her friend and said she was as single mom. This happened right around Christmas. Christmas was also the time where K and his W orchestrated an entire day around pretending things were "normal".
K's daughter got upset. How could she not be? Just a few days ago she woke up to a pile of presents and mommy and daddy there waiting. Now she is hearing that her mom is a single mom? But wait? NO MOMMY, YOU HAVE DADDY! She went from experiencing what used to be "normal family time" to hearing her mom was a single mom. It's confusing to me and I am 35. To a young girl that is carted back and forth between 2 homes, knows of some of her mom's transgressions since she went bowling with one of them and experiences one thing (happy family time) and hears another (single mom) what good can come of that?
and if the Church says "no" to an annulment, then what? (Just asking.) j-
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
Consequences don't equal being an ass. It simply means that if one spouses chooses not to be in the marriage then ALL things about the marriage cannot stay the same. It is not to "show her a hard ass stance". It is simple logic... when life circumstances change then the particulars must change.
and if the Church says "no" to an annulment, then what? (Just asking.) j-
How many church's are saying NO to annulment these days? You submit a required donation to the church, follow the processes they require and you can get your annulment - it's 2010, even church's are becoming more realistic about these things nowadays.
The fact that you actually noticed that she was "unphased" by the pastor's speech and some of the other little details in your post shows how you are still "expecting" her to change.
But that's a moot point if you're thinking of filing now.
"I said I can find a better mom than her. He said well, currently they don't have a real mom. "
I think I mentioned wayyyy back about you needing to let go of resentment for your W or at least finding some way to take care of it. You can't say that you'll find a "better mom" than her because quite frankly she stood by your side when you were going through your issues. The way she treats you D's is fine. She may not be the best example in terms of showing them how a relationship should go, but she does her job of mother fine.
If you don't get rid of this resentment, it's going to start showing up in conversations with your Ds. Already you're talking about how bad of a mom she is to your dad. She's a bad W, not mom. There's a difference.
Look at how many "moms" on here (the WAS) actually just pack up and leave their families with no contact. Those are the bad ones. Your W is just starting a new life that doesn't include you right now and she's actively pursuing it. Just detach and let her go.
So again I ask if you are going to continue to "stand". You mentioned before that the reason so many M fail is because the partners give up too soon. It's your choice, but just realize that you are going to go back and forth for awhile. It's only natural.
M-43 W-40 2D - 9 and 5
Emotion, yet peace. Ignorance, yet knowledge. Passion, yet serenity. Chaos, yet harmony. Death, yet a new life.
IMO, the MWD techniques work like when in situations like CG posted above...a marriage that is just "troubled" and not already months into separation, infidelity (esp. repeated times), and a general D situation. I think it applies to WS that are still sitting on the fence.
I don't see that with Kevins W. She is gone and living her life as a very single woman without the formal paperwork being done.
If she wants the perks of M (insurance etc) its only because its what benefits her and her alone.
Keep going Kevin on the road you are on.
Me: 46 FWS: 36 Married and Divorced 4/07, Pregnant 7/07,False R 7/07 Baby Girl born 3/08 Kicked him out because OW: 7/08 5/10 He realized what he had and lost. Moved home! REMARRIED 3/14/11!!
and if the Church says "no" to an annulment, then what? (Just asking.)
25, you never just ask a question without a reason for as long as I have known you. And I think I know where you are going with this question. Eventually my guess is that you are stating the point of can I lead a happy fulfilling life without someone else in it to be a complete and full individual and be happy. At least I am thinking that is where you are leading with this.
To answer your question, if the church says no, then they say no. From inquiring enough about my situation though, I think I have enough grounds and a possible snafu in the M that I feel pretty confident the answer won't be no. But if it was, then I have to live with that. And if the answer is no and my W was going to make any attempt to come back, I may have just greatly reduced the chances of that happening. But that is a risk I have to be willing to take if I am to move forward with this. On top of that, honestly, I am not 100% sure I can go through this again if she were to come back and gain my trust and then pull this again. Right now I don't feel that I could ever trust her to not pull this again or pull other stuff again. The trust is completely destroyed at this point. I hate to say that, but it is.
On top of that, I don't want her back the way she is right now. I don't like who she is right now. And if I have to make a choice to be single or have her back like she is, I might opt to live single. There would have to be a miraculous remarkable change in her of real substance for me to consider taking her back. I can't take her back the way she is right now. But all of that is a moot point anyways because she has no interest in coming back right now.
There has been a lot to weigh through this. I realize I am speaking boldly right now. The thoughts of what if what if what if do pop in my mind. But then I also think, what is there to be scared of. I am already living divorced only without the legal piece of paper. I am doing it now. What is one more step?
I would like to be with someone again. I am a better person than what my past was. If my W doesn't want it, then that is her decision. It isn't going to stop me from moving forward with my life and looking at the possibility of being with someone whom I would enjoy and whom my girls would enjoy because we would also be a package deal. If I do get involved with someone else, they have to know that my kids are part of my life and will be part of our life and they not only have to know it, but be as accepting and loving of my kids as they would with me. And the same goes for me if she has kids.
I kind of veered off course here. But if the church says no, then I just move forward with my life as a great dad and do what I want to do. But I can't keep sitting by making decisions based on what might happen with my W. I have to make decisions for me and my girls and put out of my mind any thought to what my W might think. What she thinks at this point, does not matter. It is irrelevant.
Kevin
Me 36, W 37 M: 08/02/97 D13, D9 1st Bomb 02/08 Reconciled 04/08 2nd Bomb: 09/08 W filed for D 02/04/09 Separated 03/09 D dismissed 06/09/09 Still separated...
The fact that you actually noticed that she was "unphased" by the pastor's speech and some of the other little details in your post shows how you are still "expecting" her to change.
Wrong stuck/bond.
The fact that I was wondering if it would have any effect on her and saw that it didn't does not mean I was expecting it to have an effect on her. Why would I expect anything anymore with regard to change from her? She has given me no reason in the world to expect a change anymore.
I am amazed that she can be so unphased. But it is not me expecting a change. It is just utter amazement. The fact of the matter is that I would have been stunned if it would have had an effect on her.
Kevin
Me 36, W 37 M: 08/02/97 D13, D9 1st Bomb 02/08 Reconciled 04/08 2nd Bomb: 09/08 W filed for D 02/04/09 Separated 03/09 D dismissed 06/09/09 Still separated...
