Doing hard time on the MLC chain gang.

[MHL]

DW,
Yes, lots of baby steps but I had a backslide of sorts on Friday and then again last night. As I had said about a week ago I did not feel like I was Dbing and was “off the page” in the DB playbook. I was hesitant to post details previously b/c I did not want everyone to think that I was getting results with something other than good DB efforts.

After getting off the phone with my wife last night (I pushed a bit) I started second guessing myself and went back to DR reread some chapters, and found that Michele says to try something different if what your trying is not working. I was going with the limited contact and no initiating contact for quite sometime and wasn’t seeing much difference after several weeks. I changed things about 3 to 4 weeks ago and started being very friendly with my W, accommodating and supportive. So I felt better after rereading those chapters b/c that is what I have done, I changed what I was doing and have seen some reactions.

Basically I have been her husband in that I am providing for her needs, yes it has been cake eating but she started to open up to me and we started having discussions about the past w/o anyone getting upset. We have been seeing each other with my son present more and more, and she is coming out to the house more.

The negative in these things is that is upsetting to my D13, she does not want Mom in the house nor to see her or anything, in fact D13 told me “It makes me mad when you are nice to Mom”. This has been a difficult choice for me b/c I know that ultimately the best thing for my D13 would be for me and Mom to reconcile. Not interacting with my W b/c it upsets my D13 is a not an option right now and I hate to put my D13’s feelings on the sidelines but the benefits to the my S9 and the possibility of reconciliation outweigh what my D13 wants right now. Some of my D13’s behavior I attribute to her being 13 also.

[dwinter82]

MSH, your sitch is always perplexing to me. I do agree reconciling/w your W is the best thing for everyone (obviously) but I still worry how all of this is going to effect D13 in the long run. Remember, you are all D13 has right now and you do not want to damage that. I think open communication/w her is the best policy. Maybe tell D13 you do not condone the W's actions but that you still love and care for her, and that family is the most important thing any of us can have. As such, trying to keep a family together is worth the battle and requires lots of forgiveness.

As far as your relatively new approach goes, it is high risk. If it helps remove the fog, great, if not, then you are setting yourself up for a let down. I think the best advice I can give you is to continue what you are doing and hope for more baby steps but do your best to keep expectations in serious check.

[MHL]

MSH, your sitch is always perplexing to me. I do agree reconciling/w your W is the best thing for everyone (obviously) but I still worry how all of this is going to effect D13 in the long run. Remember, you are all D13 has right now and you do not want to damage that.

Perplexing is an understatement for sure. I actually just got off the phone with my D13's therapist. D13 got very mad last night at me and was still mad this morning, specifically for being "nice" to Mom. If I did not know better I would say my daughter has been reading posts from puppy, allenA, gucci and others. Everything is black and white, right and wrong and there is no grey areas. (Not discounting anything these wise DBer say, their advice is very clearcut is my correlation here)

Funny thing is I am to do the same thing with my D13 as I am doing with my W, listen, validate, let her express her feelings. Her therapist actually suggested using the words "I am sorry you feel that way.....". I actually had time to tell my D13's therapist more about MLC and what I am doing and my attitude towards trying to save my M. Therapist said it was good that she has better understanding of where I am at so that she can more effectively work with my D13.

I am taking her therapist, heartsblessing's stages and some other things from the MLC resources. I wanted to recomend some books on MLC so that she may read up to get a better understanding of what my W is going through. Any suggestions out there???

[Cadet]

In the resources there is a link with books in it. Have you looked at that?

[MHL]

No I haven't, thanks I will check it out.

I am going to throw something out here and I have put on the helmet so bring on the wood if neccessary......

Has anyone ever felt like their MLCer either wasn't MLC or has come out of the tunnel w/o moving through all the stages?

I have had some fairly coherent R conversations with my W over the last 5 days. No real movement towards reconciliation but we have talked about it. Will see her in about 2 hours, may be eating dinner with her and S9 depending on how my D13 feels when I get home. More later

[Cadet]

This does not mean that she is done with her crisis yet! She may just be finishing a stage, or you could scare her back into a crisis. You need to study more and proceed with caution.

[MHL]

Unexpected lunch with my W today and had pretty much an hour long R talk, again very civil and calm. I was planning on laying low and backing off but had to ask her about some legal dates comming up. I let her know that if we can get all this done the court dates could be avoided if her lawyer will get a proposal to my lawyer so we can work this out and get it out of the legal system. It was too much to discuss over the phone and so I offered to buy lunch she accepted. Bring on the 2x4's, I iniated the lunch.

I am trying to get the separation agreement done without having to respond to her complaint. If my lawyer and I file an answer and counterclaim, she will not like it and it could be a big step backwards. I will have to detail for public record her history of affairs and marital misconduct, I do not want to do that. I would rather hammer out an agreement and be done with it.

[MHL]

At the lunch we talked more about the possibility of reconciliation and what it might look like. She volunteered that she often thinks of coming back and how easy it would be but that she would be living a lie. I told her that I don't think she should move back for that reason. I told her that if she decided she wanted to work on us that I would rather her stay where she is and that we start to do things together for a while, like dates. I also said we could "work on it" with no expectations, I told her that I could come to the end of a period of time and decide that I do not want the M anymore.

For the first time she did most of the talking and I just mirrored back what she was saying. Amazingly she talked about what she is working on with her IC. My W said she is still very much a little girl who needs to put her "big girl panties on" and start acting like a 42 year old woman. I did not mirror back on this comment b/c I really didn't know what she might say next. I said I have been a child too and feel like I have grown up a lot in the last 3-4 months. I also told her that I thought b/c of our past childhoods we never really knew how to "relate" to each other in the past. She agreed.

[Cadet]

No 2x4's from me however I stand by what I said earlier. She is not done yet! Proceed with caution. You don't want to scare her back into replay. Maybe you can call off the L???? That would save some money.

[MHL]

More from lunch, this is not in order I just want to get it out while it is fresh, I came away feeling really good but I am keeping my expectations in check, this is hard but I have learned the lessons of not having enough patience. I know I need to let her digest what we talked about today.

I asked her if she thought that I was a better listener and she responded "no". I asked her if she would give me example so I could do better. She said that I had asked if we could "work on it" on Friday and she said she was not ready, my W said I asked again 2 days later on Sunday. I agreed with her instead of defending what I said.

I considered this a big step forward for me b/c I initially wanted to defend myself but held my tongue and validated her. Amazingly, I felt better afterwards, b/c she now knows that I understand how she is "feeling" which is way more important than me defending myself or proving my point which does absolutely nothing for the R.

I am rambling here, sorry. I stated that once we settle the separation agreement that we have as much time as we need. I told her about our friends "Fred" and "Lisa" (not real names) who are leagally separated for 3 years now but not divorced. My W was surprised, I told her that "IF" we were to work on it that it would take a while, maybe over a year.

My W did not throw up the roadblock she normally throws up which is "I have to fix myself first, before I work on it with us". She said this on Sunday and I pushed back on her and said, "you won't work on us but yet you seek relationships with other men" she had no response, that was as hard as I have pushed in months.