So I apologized, or tried to poorly. It began an argument - she began telling me how her parenting decision is right because she's a mother. I began to say that she's from her country when she cut me off. I was trying to say that her POV might be correct, but it is different than mine.
It led to more arguing, because she doesn't want to let it go ("when you don't have a [male part] you can tell me how to parent" was her reply).
I tried to explain that if she had said that she loved the idea of walking with me, but she needed time with just one kid, I would've been fine. Instead I was hurt, so I used harsh words.
I don't know if you should ever say "she's from her country." It sounds vaguely insulting. Just my two cents. How about, "I respect your opinion, but we don't have to agree on everything either." and leave her country out of it? It might sound like you're judging her and her country otherwise. Just a thought.
To her reply about a male part: "I'm sorry you feel that way. Maybe we can discuss it at another time and leave both of our private parts out of it. I value your opinions, and hopefully you can value mine. I know you're a great mom, and I appreciate all you do."
Tomorrow: "Sorry we got in an argument the other day. I like that you want to spend quality time with our child. Can you and I spend some quality time together sometime too?"
After a comfortable morning 'sleep' which happened unexpectedly, I asked W if she could live happy with me and all the fighting that we have. She said yes. But, she said she couldn't live with doubt that I love her and with being treated in ways that she feels are judgemental of her personality.
I'm not there yet, not sure if I will ever be. I think after Retrouvaille, if I am still not able to see her and love who she is, I will start pulling away. For now, we are trying to connect while knowing that D is to be expected if we can't by May, but we aren't filing any papers yet (thank God...hope).
OTMT, I am sorry, but I think you have it wrong here. Things in a marriage do not get better over a weekend. It takes time, lots of time with lots of backslides. DO NOT let the backslides get you down. It is NOT a linear journey. As I said to you in one of my first posts- just b/c a marriage is crummy now does not mean that it will be so in the future. I had posted earlier about bonding activities and ways to learn to love her- review them if you wish.
As for her lack of hygiene and not caring for her self. This speaks volumes. Neglecting oneself is DEPRESSION. That or severe exhaustion with all the kids. So please really understand she has been truly suffering- either with fatigue or depression. Glad to hear that she will be getting IC- hopefully that will help. She also may have suffered from postpartum depression after each child. I believe it can last up to a year after childbirth. You are especially susceptible if you feel isolated like I believe she feels.
OTMT, I see you as a person that is feeling desperate and not knowing what to do. Totally understandable. I hope the Retroville will help greatly. I also...
M38, H37 S3, S7 Together 15 yrs Married 8 yrs Bomb July 2008 Inhouse separation "I hate you" "We are over" (too many times to count) Reconciled Sept 2009 (still worth it)
Thanks, June. I know a weekend won't do it. I'm hoping the next few weeks will be part of that. I really want to just move out and then I won't have to be here, be reading tons of books, and more. I'm just very hopeful that some semi will hit me, I'll wake up a new man, and be very happy with everything that is her, faults and all. Maybe that semi will happen in Retrou. Maybe while I read. I just don't want to give up looking for some way to find love where it has never been.
Backsliding I expect, but I'm not very good at handling the consequences of the b'slide from her. Today, she was beginning to get into a major R talk, so I had to cut it short. I told her that we need to be acting better, not discussing more and that I committed to stay away from the R talks for now. She seemed to respect that decision (accept mabye not respect).
I thought it was depression for a long time, too. BUT if she won't get help, depression or self-esteem, I will not live in that environement that brings out the worst in me. I used to think that the environment was toxic, now I think it is my behaviour in that environment that is killing me softly. I think she was like this from before we married, but having not known her, I can't be sure. Some days are worse than others. I'm sure I had a hand to play in her worst days - makes me feel really cr**y about myself.
Desperate? Yes. I feel like both choices (D or M) are both wrong. I almost can taste the consequences of both. I still need to make a decision and accept those consequences. (or get hit by a semi...)
Wanted to mention the article posted on in the When Therapy Hurts Section. The "Good article about marital therapy" thread has link to an amazing article about some marriage education programs working better than traditional MC. I looked up the programs and one was in my area for $200 for a weekend of 12 hour education. Something I am considering in the future. I also saw that the website has online classes too. Not sure how much they cost.
Just thought maybe you could look into that option also if interested
Anyhow, good luck!
M38, H37 S3, S7 Together 15 yrs Married 8 yrs Bomb July 2008 Inhouse separation "I hate you" "We are over" (too many times to count) Reconciled Sept 2009 (still worth it)
OTMT, don't despair! You wife admits to loving you and is willing to work toward change. Something many people on this site would give an arm and a leg for. Your above post about desiring to walk away reminded me of a book I really want to read in the future.
Why Women Talk and Men Walk: How to Improve Your Relationship without Discussing it by Steven Stosny
I really like this author and an eager to read it.
Anyhow, I will say it again- if you make changes in how you act and react to her then she will unknowingly also change.
It really does work that way.
Anyhow, happy V-day
M38, H37 S3, S7 Together 15 yrs Married 8 yrs Bomb July 2008 Inhouse separation "I hate you" "We are over" (too many times to count) Reconciled Sept 2009 (still worth it)
Considering the ups and downs today, eve was great, I thought. I began talking to her after supper, helped with the dishes. Got close on the sofa and read while she drank tea for 1/2hr. Offered to watch a movie (romance) with her on the b'rm computer. All great. So, she takes a while to come, but she has reasons. We're all cozy watching movie. She sleeps near the end. I'm thinking, kinda nice. I might want this nice feeling for the rest of my life. Except for one part where the guy is deeply kissing making me feel kind of jealous, I was feeling very connected.
So I go on the computer to shut it off, decide to check mail cause she's sleeping when I hear stress sounds (scratching nails, etc.) Knowing full well this could be bad, I ignored it, and began getting ready to shut down. Then, it begins.
"I prayed and I feel it would be best if we separate" "I can't keep living when you don't know" I try to scuttle the boat - not now, we were just so comfortable, etc., no luck. A few minutes in, I tell her look, I was feeling good, you were, we were all close, and you wait until after to movie to tell me you want me out?? I tried laying down to sleep for 20 sec, felt like exploding, so I went to the sofa to cool down.
So then, this person who wants to separate, comes down with the blanket for me to sleep on the sofa, and tried to begin the R talk again! I ran off, and unloaded the dishwasher.
Hurt. Rejected. Frustrated. Guilty. Ashamed. A little of everything~
I follow that if I was showing love and not considering the D, she'd feel better. I know. I worked so hard that eve to make her feel secure. I guess if I pissed her off I'd feel better.
