I've hit a wall.. Now what?

[Dudess]

Dear H,
I would like to advise you of some decisions I have made. I see no reason to meet at this time. As I see it, we have nothing to discuss in person. Its clear this divorce does need to move forward and as things are now it would be the best thing for me. Here is where I stand.

Are you sure you don't want to see him in person? Sounds like you are looking damn good lately. Might be good for him to see you. Maybe make it brief, (because you have another appointment), have a friend ring your cell while you are with him. "sorry, i have to take this. hi. yes, i'll be there soon. me too. bye."

I know you have some legitimate complaints about my role in the dysfunction of our marriage. I acknowledge that, and as you know, have been dealing with my issues. I believe in time you could see that those changes are for real. I understand that you feel a lack of trust, and I feel I have done many things since you left to demonstrate I am trustworthy.

Why are you going on and on about showing you are trustworthy when he's the one who had the affair?

I would have been willing to put in some effort to see if this marriage can be saved.

Like the past tense.

I think we both will regret someday that we didn’t do everything we could to be sure it’s un-salvageable.

I recommend you speak only for yourself.

I have decided that there is no longer an open invitation for you to come home. I deserve more than this from my husband. I deserve better than a husband who commits adultery; someone who will respect me and our marriage vows.

You don't need to say that with words. Your actions will speak louder.

I cannot respect your decision to cut and run and I damn well cannot respect your decision to involve a third person in our marriage.

Again, no need to say it.

I do not see how you and I could negotiate through our divorce when a third person is involved.

I don't understand this. The divorce needs to happen third party or not. If there were not a third party, you would probably not be getting divorced. Negotiation is usually preferable to litigation.

You need to file for divorce when you are ready.

Why wait for him. He's getting the better end of the deal so would have a reason to drag his feet.

Also, didn't you say that in your group of friends he is blaming you, yada, yada? Taking the initiative to divorce him could be a good move. Would you file with adultery as your grounds?

Look at it this way, he ended the marriage with his behavior. By filing, you are just trying up the loose legal ends.

Once you serve me with the required papers I’ll have my lawyer take a look at things from my end. Since we are divorcing we cannot collaborate.

I don't understand why you can't collaborate.

It’s in my best interests to keep that separate going forward. I need to protect myself.

Does this really need to be said. No need to explain that you will look out for yourself.

The arrangement we have had the last several months has been in your favor. I am willing to continue to work together on bills with you. Until a final divorce decree is singed by the judge all bills that have both of our names on them will continue to be paid out of the joint acct so we both may see what is happening, no matter who contributes more or less.

Could be a risky way to do it. Don't you need to get a written agreement and have the judge sign off on it to make it a court order?

I understand that this is not an ideal financial situation, but it never is in Divorce. I currently work two jobs to pay for my lifestyle and I am willing to continue to work hard to take care of myself. You may need to make those sacrifices as well.

He can figure it out himself what he may or may not need to do.

I anticipate a VERY nasty return email and who knows what he will do from there. The last time I told him I was reducing how much I paid on our bills and told him he needed to increase his amounts; I got a scathing, nasty, petty email from him. I'm a little afraid of what he is going to do - but hey - his choice I guess!

yeah, like he could go wipe out the joint account. check with your lawyer before telling him this. could be another good reason to file.

Are you sure you want to go pro se?

[pearlharbr]

Dudess makes excellent points! Read them again.

[talia]

HI PEARL,
I love your perspective - you really make me think.

If he stops paying I will file for personal bankruptcy. I don't want to do that but since I can't really hurt my credit any more; I'm not too proud to protect myself financially. L says that I can still keep the house if I do that... so I'm OK with it. So yes - I'm prepared for that.

H desperately dosen't want a bankruptcy so he might just do everything he can not to have one. We DON'T have to file bankruptcy together, but Since MN is a "Joint Tennants" state the credit card companies will go after him for the full amounts of each bill AND he would lose the very beneficial payment arrangements I have already negotiated. Some of these are fixed at 0% until the account is paid in full - as long as we don't miss a single payment (I'm good at what I do ).

So far with H - he thinks I HAVE been waiting for him to change his mind. I've told him several times since he left that if he changed his mind he could just come home and if that changed for me I would let him know. Maybe I'm not saying it well, but that 2nd/3rd paragraph is my end to that. I'm trying to say "this was my position before.. this is my position now" kind of thing.

Also I don't say that I WON'T file - I just say I'm not filing jointly and then assume he will file and serve me. I don't care if he doesn't file just to piss me off... part of me thinks he doesn't actually have the balls to do it. If he did - he would have done it by now. I'm calling his bluff - if he doesn't file I'm no worse off, the finances are now going to be on my terms anyway. Of course eventually I will HAVE to file if he doesn't - can't live in limbo forever - but we'll cross that bridge when we get there. He could be so mad about all this that he files immediately asking for me to pay more toward the bills... WHO KNOWS!!

This letter is going to open a can of worms... My big question now is am I ready to deal with NASTY H... This isn't going to go over well....

Embrace the Suck!!


T

[Dudess]

Are you definitely done with him talia or would you consider reconciling if he dumped the OW?

[talia]

Dudess.. Good Points....

I don't want to see him - he KNOWS how good I look because people keep telling him. I have met with him, on his terms, EVERY time he's asked, so denying him the meeting is a 180. But more importantly - not seeing him helps me deal. Every time I see him I revert back to the me who missed him horribly when he left - I still love him, I'm still attracted to him and I can't handle the torture.. especially after 6 months of celibacy Plus I already feel bad about how this financial situation is breaking down - I don't want to cry or back down.

I was just trying to make the point that I've shown I'M trustworthy and He ISN'T and can't be considered that at all. I might take that out......

The past tense is strategic....

The "deserve" words will hurt his feelings and since he's made the point several times that I deserve better I want to voice that I agree... I haven't agreed every time he has said it...

The negotiate thing..
He wants us to sit down - just the two of us and negotiate the D terms and then file jointly. That's HIS point of this meeting. L told me NO WAY - stupid on my part. I need to keep this legal process separate and I need to make it clear to him that there is not way I'm filing jointly. PLUS why would I sit down and talk to him nicely when he's having an affair - I don't owe him any time at all since he's giving all his time to his whore.

He can clean out the joint acct if he wants - as of March 1st the majority of the $ in that account will be his...

I'm calling his bluff on filing - I don't think he has the balls.

Collaborate may not be the best way to word that...

I'll revise and post... You guys are really helping me think this through.


T

[talia]

I don't know how I feel about him. Part of me would give ANYTHING to have him home. Most of me is just DONE. I have a HUGE list of things he would have to do before I would even CONSIDER reconciling and I just don't see how in the world he would ever man up and do them.

I think more than anything I'm living in the dream that I want to go back to the good times - when we first got married and it was us against the world - we were SO in love. I also recognize that it won't ever be THAT again.

I'm sick of being attached to such an immoral person - I deserve so much better than this. Its been 6 months... best I can tell he's getting worse, not better. He's done nothing to improve himself, and apparently he doesn't think he needs to. He's perfect.

I suppose if he asked I would give it a go, but halfheartedly at this point. I don't know if I could ever trust him, I don't know if I could ever feel safe in this relationship. I'm starting to see the great possibilities to starting new now - the potential of finding a new partner and developing a new relationship. I'M such a better partner now than I ever could have been before.

The hill to reconciliation is starting to look like Everest and I'm not a sherpa.... I'm sitting at base camp wondering "what was I thinking, I just don't know if I'm up for this"

T

[Dudess]

I don't want to see him - he KNOWS how good I look because people keep telling him. . . . - not seeing him helps me deal. Every time I see him I revert back to the me who missed him horribly when he left - I still love him, I'm still attracted to him


I do understand why it might be best for your peace of mind not to see him. That's why I asked if you are done.

Being told how good you look does not carry the same impact as him experiencing your beauty and intoxicating fragrance. An email doesn't pack the wallop of watching you being self-assured and moving on, as you hurry off to meet who knows who, for God knows what? (You've studied gucci haven't you?)The feelings you get when you see him may be the feelings he gets when he sees the 'new' you. Consider picturing that vignette in your mind. You might find you can do it, (or that it makes you feel good even if you don't do it).


You are totally right about you being in the morally superior position here. I just don't think it will make you particularly attractive to point it out right now. (if you would like him to be attracted to you)


need to make it clear to him that there is not way I'm filing jointly. PLUS why would I sit down and talk to him nicely when he's having an affair - I don't owe him any time at all since he's giving all his time to his whore.

We don't have a joint option where i live so i don't understand that but obviously good counsel says not the way to go. Here, people routinely negotiate/mediate divorces even though it is Mrs. vs Mr. I guess people do that for the same reason any two parties in a lawsuit negotiate a settlement - to get a better deal overall. Doesn't mean you don't hate the other side's guts.

[Wholeagain]

(((talia)))

I felt that way, don't want anything to do with him. And made sure he got it.

I think it would be wise to not bring up any R and feelings when sorting business. Keep it short.

[Wholeagain]

When they say proceed collaboratively they mean a meeting of you and your lawyers.

[trytryagain]

I'm starting to see the great possibilities to starting new now - the potential of finding a new partner and developing a new relationship. I'M such a better partner now than I ever could have been before.

T

talia-

i'm dealing with a lot of the same feelings you are...wanting your H back, wanting to be in love like you used to be. my situation seems to be different from yours in a few aspects, but for both of us, NO MATTER WHAT, we'll come out of this better, stronger, and - like you said - a better partner than you could have ever been before. and if we're left with NOTHING else than that, i take comfort in knowing that at least i'll have my H to thank for that. as much as it hurts and as much as i hate all of this, i'd never be on the path to realizing my full SELF and seeking the happiness that i know god has in store for me.

i told my H before he moved out that as much as this all hurt, i had to thank him for calling me out on some behaviors that i didn't even see within myself. i was so busy calling the kettle black, i'd never noticed what color I was! so. if i had to love and lose in order to REALLY learn how to love, i know i'll be ok in the end. and i know you will be, too.

(((talia)))