my W doesn't regret her affair

[25yearsmlc]

I think you've done remarkably well future. Did you do all things perfectly? No, so welcome to the club of humanity. This is a LONG post but I'm on a roll and didn't post to you for so long as you were getting great advice/still are. But as to a big issue I struggled with...FORGIVENESS and what it means...and does NOT mean....

As for forgiveness, as I understand it, yes, DO IT. For you. The anger at the injustices you've endured, the things done to you, still have to be let go of or the anger will consume you, not her.. The pain and deep hurt you feel at times are too much to carry, let alone if you truly want detachment and GAL to work. So you let go of it, for you. The WAS does not even need to know you forgave them. I found I had to turn over my pain and anger over to God, b/c I didn't know how to let it go in another way. (Marianne WIlliamson wrote about this in her book "Return to Love" --a tad new age for some folks but her exercises on forgiveness and letting go, are SO good. (OR at least they were good for me. I never saw forgivness growing up in my parent's home. I also felt my h didn't "deserve" forgiveness and at some level, I worried that if I forgave him, he would not "Get" how much pain he had caused and worse still, he might do it again IF I forgave him...little did I know then, that NOT forgiving him
made me look, well, "unforgiving" and plus, it doesn't give the WAS/ straying spouse any room to maneuver in, or anything to do to redeem themselves. I didn't know how to do it but I remembered wasting my junior yr of high school pining for a boy who cheated on me. HE didn't know I was pining, he was not "hurt" by MY PAIN...he was partying having a blast...I was a fool to not let go. So as an adult, I knew I needed some tools for actually doing this forgiving/letting go deal. So I did the exercises in the book, before my h would likely call, to cope with the conversations and to be fully present for our children, & I would CALM down, no obsessing and NO Losing it and turning it ino then, I would detach. Joined groups, GAL, etc....letting go is truly for you. At least primarily...now there's a second part to that comment and it is not mandatory like the first one is, imho...but stilllllll

This "2nd part" is what to do, if you actually would want a recon with your w - but simply think it's too little too late and even if you are ready to move on and end the M totally in your mind....as my DB coach told me, "Keep the Road Home Paved and Smooth..." Some LBSers make it too hard on purpose. They want to punish; they want to show them, they want to be the WAS that never comes back so they are never rejected again. Is it natural? Yes. Is it healthy? Well, No. If you cannot reconcile with your x, WE GET IT...I'm just saying don't drag it out pretending you can, or that your list of requirements is something they even what to hear early on. I think you'fe nere Be on your way and open to changes in you and her and see wh

As someone with 2 family members who div and remarried their exes, (years later- I must add), I can say I have witnessed it. It happens. Two couples divorced and they did indeed remarry. And Both couples were happier the 2nd time around! 13 years now my cousin and his wife have been remarried, (they have a son and daughter) and they both changed after the divorce. Eventually became friends again, over time, since they had a kid together. I know they dated others for awhile, but as I recall, there was anger at the start. Then pain....then some hopelessness then civility at kids' functions, then friendship, then banter, then flirting and then...dating and recommiting. Whole thing took 8 years to get back to the vows (they more or less reconciled earlier but it wasn't official until 8 full years passed...)

In contrast, My uncle and aunt divorced (I think SHE filed.) and he pursued her for awhile. She liked the attention but didn't think things would work out for them down the road, e.g., "too much water under the bridge", he wouldn't change or he'd never let her forget how much she hurt him, too many people know, etc.... But at least she felt safe around him at famiy events. No scenes, etc. One day after 5 years of being div, my uncle simply asked her if she was "happier now"? And she said "not really" and he said "what if we try again, and do things differently this time?" And she agreed....and it worked. And when my uncle died 3 years back, his wife and kids were at his bedside as they should have been but if they'd stayed divorced, their kids would never have seen a love renewed, forgiveness given, hurts let go of, and recommitment. It's a legacy that they carry with them, along with what divorce feels like... Sometimes you choose between being "happy" or being "right"...

I think one huge reason some couples don't get back together even when the WAS wants to, is b/c the WAS assumes the LBSer will make it too hard on them to return, (maybe b/c the LBSer told them never to come back, etc) or maybe b/c they think that they'll never live it down, or the LBSer will make them jump through hoops for so long only to still not find the WAS sufficiently repentant or trustworthy, etc, and the WAS will feel distrusted, still lacking and that creates a cycle...AND let's face it, no one's hands are completely clean in these things. How many of we women KNEW our M's and our H's were getting o still NOT trusting and still lacking. Sure, sometimes this reflects laziness on the part of the WAS who wants it to be easy ("hey I SAID I was sorry...") and that the WASer is NOT worth a retry. Certainly that can be true...still, there's another possibility. What about the WAS who wants back in but either b/c the LBSer is terrified so much that they make a frickin' mountain to climb that no one can climb, b/c really they are simply too afraid to trust again OR the LBser SAYS they want to try and trust again but the damn anger is still there and the desire to punish some more and "Teach a lesson" and prove this and that, and blah blah blah, holding the sword of Damacles over the WAS's head...well I think a lot of m's fail b/c in the end, the LBSer cannot or will not forgive. And so, the M fails and at least part of that is the LBSer's fault. Imagine a WAS who does NOT have an A, but leaves in part for good reasons--Ie. the LBSer was mistreating them, badly. So the WAS leaves and the LBSer takes on the role of victim b/c they say they want it to work...who really is the one ending the m then? The one who caused the spouse to leave, or what?

No hard and fast rules at times. WE try to be honest with ourselves and each other and come here for feedback...I think you've done well. I would not trust your w taking the kids overseas in a million years unless I knew the country she was taking them to had a treaty signed with us enforcing child custody agreements. She'll rationalize what she wants and say "kids are resilient" and "you'll be fine, move on" etc as that is the modern MC mantras....

But I don't know your wife. Did you see that Brazilian man in the news, who lost his son for 5 years after his ex w kidnapped the boy for "a vacation back home" and then she died, leaving their son with her new h...he spent a fortune and was a L himself..and I know my sil's first h took their d3 d's overseas and hid them in a refugee camp for 18 months...nice. She had to petition Congress and go on Larry King to lobby for a change in the law and pressure the family to reveal their whereabouts, to get her girls back. When she got them...they were not the same and now 8 years have passed and they're kind of...okay. It was a big deal...nightmare. So be careful...your w may or may not have been considering a comback to the m. What stopped her? Your stance?

I don't recall the details of your requests but I assume you wanted transparency and some MC, other than her own, and no contact with om? Sounds like The "basics" of an LBSer who's WAS had an A, right?

No excessive snooping or stalking, but she had to meet the basics of re-establishing trust and in return, you'd promise not to throw this in her face the rest of your m whenver you fought, and not to hold it against her or assume you should get your way in other unrelated matters b/c hell, she' "owes you"...?? That's pretty cool.

You nailed it on the head awhile back when you admitted being wrong to do something to punish her. "Teaching her life's lessons" and "punishing" or getting revenge, is SO NOT your job...life will do that, and God. But you know this now. I think standing consistently firmly but keeping the road home paved and smooth, is the path to take. Even to the finish line and beyond...

What does your wife need to know? That m to you in the future, would not be a repeat of the m you had. On your end, you'd do some things differenly if you had them to do over....and on HER end, she'd handle things a hell of a lot better and VERY differently than she did before. I personally think she KNOWS she's the common denominator is a couple R/M's now and that she did not handle the first 2 M's well. SHE KNOWS THIS and as much as she wants to blame you...she also knows you're a good guy. She has some crap to work out on her end. Should you wait? No! GAL!!

But should you assume she's always having great sex with OM's & they always amuse her, laughing hard at her wit and she's laughing hard b/c they are all so darn hilarious and great in bed, all the time, except when she does not want it, and her OM's make a ton of money they like spending on her and they have the same interests...(OR NOT...no, he's foreign and interesting and exotic and NO ONE can compete with that...for awhile. But when "Guido" doesn't get her jokes, or says some anti_American thing, or is smug or moody like those guys get...she'll have to wonder what it is about her that cannot sustain a long term intimate relationship...too bad for her. The depth of her love is limited b/c she can only last so long. If that remains true, you are indeed better off finding a woman who can love and be loved, for life....

But let go of the anger and forgive her for all her omissions and commissions, for her searching externally for that which she should have found inside, and forgive yourself for lashing out now and then, or for the honest mistakes you made in the M, vowing not to repeat them in your next R with whomever....

God Bless, you've handled yourself so well, articulately, honestly and with growth. That's all we can aim for, that we get better, not bitter. You know? Do your best to know His will and to follow it, with love in your heart. God takes care of the rest, so leave those results up to HIM...and GAL, letting the past go.

(Speaking of going, I'm rambling b/c I'm tired and started this post an hour ago... SO, on that note, )...

((( hugs)))

j-