See hope, want to get there

[Lotus]

Lotus butt out. All you do on this board is spout your boiler-plate template one paragraph of advice... i.e. GO TO RETROUVILLE. If you have nothing better to say other than attack me then get lost.

Butt out? Where do you think you are? At your private office? Where is your shingle?

This is a bulletin board and everyone's opinion is of the same value. It's free. If you were a professional marriage counselor you would have credentials and charge a fee. Your advice should come with a warning. "If this doesn't work, you may find yourself divorced."

I have plenty of people on this board and in real life who have thanked me for my advice. Retrouvaille is successful in at least 50% of the marriages that go there. That is an excellent success rate. They don't pit one spouse against the other. They teach people how to get along and understand each other. Not how to manipulate and control others in a master/servant relationship which is doomed to longterm failure.

[TrentC]

This is a bulletin board and everyone's opinion is of the same value. It's free. If you were a professional marriage counselor you would have credentials and charge a fee. Your advice should come with a warning. "If this doesn't work, you may find yourself divorced."

She has a point. Those of us who are posting here are offering their advice based on their experiences and opinions, and our advice is worth exactly what you are paying for it.

At the very least, look at the backgrounds of the people you are listening to. There are people here who have rebuilt their marriages, and are spending their time trying to help others. There are others who are healing from their own divorces and are willing to share their experience. And there are plenty of us who are still struggling to save our own relationships, making plenty of mistakes along the way, and are here to offer and ask for support.

None of us are official representatives of Michele Weiner-Davis or this site; if you want their help you need to sign up for the phone coaching, and it's not free. Neither is any other marriage counselor that you are going to talk to.

CGU, you need to decide for yourself how best to handle your situation because you are going to live with the consequences. Do you want to look back on your situation and realize how listening to some pseudo-anonymous person on some website may have cost you your marriage?

[jasper67]

I think G is giving good advice- at least in this particular sitch. He has not guided me wrong in my own, sadly I did not take some of his advice.

I think the NC and not pursuing has def helped, as did the listening and validating. I would not so easily jump back into anything once she says the word go. I have a feeling that's where this is going.

[mindfull]

Dale:

Do you want to come back to my thread? It's less cluttered there!

I apologize for those that have come in and muddied up your thread by throwing zingers at another poster. We may not all agree or disagree, but that's just vindictive, and not at ALL helpful to you. So, please disregard.

OK, so let's get back to YOU. I have to go back find YOUR posts. BBIAB.

[motherof3]

And now back to our regular scheduled program....

[Cadet]

My own 2 cents is that Gno hasn't even given you his ideas yet, so how is it possible that they are wrong. MC is great but both parties must be in it to win it. If not it is a waste of time.
DB'ing is patience, lets all get some.
Make changes and monitor results. - Haven't done that yet.

Nothing is going to happen quickly - right Mindful.

I agree it is best to have a plan. It is not a war game but it is a plan.

[Can't give up]

To all
Thanks for caring enough to take time here.

I'm sure we all know there will always be gray areas that have to be thought about. I myself, or anyone else can not get everything out in the open in a few words. Even when we try, we will look back later and see something we left out that may, or may not change how someone else sees the picture. Thats why good counsellors are high paid. Their ability to read between the lines, consider what was left out.

G made some very good points, with a strong 'ring of truth', that can't be overlooked.

Lotus has a good point of getting along and understanding.

Somewhere in between there has to come in 'mutual respct' to have something to build from.

Nothing is resolved without looking at the good along with the bad. Somewhere there has to be a balance, or it will all fall apart, sooner or later.

Very busy next few days, gov docs to fill out for Homeland Security. Pain in the A$$. Try to get back in eve.

[Can't give up]

Hi G.

Just stopped by the office to pick up some prints.

Had 'forgot' my personal cell. [and will on the way out now]

See there are 5 missed calls from W between 9:30 am -1:37 pm.
Must not have been important. No message.

Trying to follow advice I undestand, working on rest. Looking forward to what you throw next. Gotta run.
Dale

[flowmom]

CGU, good luck with your sitch. I'm a newbie here, but sandi posted this in my thread, and I'll post it here in case it might be useful to you:

I often give this list to newcomers as a guide or work plan b/c it is a summery of DB's 180's. Hope it will help.

1.Do not pursue, reason, chase, beg, plead or implore! This turns the spouse completely off!
2. No frequent phone calls to spouse.......let him/her be the one to call you. Then don't try to hang on to your spouse through conversation.....instead, you say good-bye first.
3. Do not point out good points in marriage or try to get him/her to read marriage books, look at your M pictures, etc. Especially, do not get him/her to read the DB/DR book. That is for you only!
4. Do not follow your spouse around the house like a puppy dog trying to get his/her time and attention.
5. Do not encourage talk about the future. They don't want to think about a future with you at the moment, so stay clear of that subject.
6. Do not ask for help from family members or friends. Don't discuss private matters with them that would upset your spouse.
7. Do not ask for reassurances (That is showing neediness and
being clingy.) Show self-respect and self confidence.
8. Do not buy gifts to make "brownie points". (Can't buy his/her love and affection.)
9. Do not schedule dates together at this point. (That is pursuing.) Save for later when the R is much better.
10.Do not spy on spouse by checking emails, phone bills, etc. (Not good for you and will make matters worse.)
11.Do not say "I Love You" (It is being "pushy" and trying to
make your spouse say it back to you......he/she will despise you for it.)
12.Act "as if" you are moving on with your life with or without them and that you are going to be okay. Keep a good attitude.
13.Be cheerful, strong, outgoing and attractive at all times! In other words, be the best you can be and look the best you can look at all times. Even when wearing jeans and T-shirt, wear good cologne, b/c it does cause the spouse to take notice.
14.Don't sit around waiting on your spouse to see what kind of mood he/she is in or what he/she is going to do or say – get busy, think of things to do. Go to church, go out with friends, etc. in order to get a life for yourself without waiting on your wife/husband.....but it is okay to invite them, just don't act as if it will change your plans if they do or don't go.
15.When at home with your spouse, (if you usually start the conversation---then don't, wait for him/her) then, be rather scarce or with your words, but don't sound rude or too short like you are mad. If your spouse asks what's wrong....just say "nothing" and have a pleasant expression on your face. Keep it short and simple. Don't get into an argument! Stay polite and don’ t act like you are pouting. Use poise and class. This does not mean to act like you aren’t speaking, but don’t be overly talkative.
16.If you are in the habit of asking your spouse his/her
whereabouts, ASK THEM NOTHING!! No matter what time he/she comes home! You are giving them space and asking no questions! You enjoy your time with your kids, friends, etc. Remember, you are getting a life, also.
17.You need to make your partner think that you have had an
awakening and, as far as you are concerned, you are going to
move on with your life, with or without your spouse.
18.Do not be nasty, angry or even cold - just pull back and wait
to see if spouse notices and, more important, realize what he/she will be missing. (But never ask him/her if he/she has noticed any changes!!) This is important! If you do, then you have blown it.
19.No matter what you are feeling TODAY, only show your spouse happiness and contentment. This can confuse some of them b/c it is not what they expected. Show your spouse someone he/she would want to be around all the time, somebody that can be attractive and fun to be with. That somebody is you! Don't overkill in your attempts to outshine another person your spouse may be having an A with (if there is OP in the picture) to the point of looking like your attempts are "fake" b/c your spouse will see through all of that.
20.All questions about marriage should be put on hold, until
your spouse wants to talk about it (which may be a while)so this takes patient on your behalf.
21.Never lose your cool! Don't let your spouse trap you into a fight. Don't take her/his bait.....leave the room or the house for a while, if you have to, in order to avoid a fight.
22.Don't be overly enthusiastic, don't over-kill; in anything you do b/c it will come across as fake.
23.Do not argue about how your spouse feels about something (it only makes his/her feelings more negative.) Only they know how they feel!
24.Be patient......very, very patient. Give your spouse space and time. When you pull back, it will draw them towards you. It feels opposite of what you want to do, but it works!
25.Listen carefully to what your spouse is really saying to you. Look them in the eyes when they talk to you. Do not interrupt them when they are speaking and stop what you may be working on to look at them when they talk. This shows them that you really care about what they are saying.
26.Learn to back off, shut up and walk away when you want to
speak out (or scream and yell).
27.Take care of yourself (exercise, sleep, laugh & focus on all
the other parts of your life that are not in turmoil). This is for your health's sake.
28.Be strong and confident and learn to speak softly. Read self
help books, inspirational books or listen to tapes. They are for you only.
29.Know that if you can do 180's, your smallest CONSISTENT
actions will be noticed much more than any words you can say
or write.
30.Do not be openly show that you are "desperate" or "needy" even when you are hurting more than ever and truly feel desperate and needy. This is a large turn-off for your spouse.
31.Do not focus on yourself when communicating with your spouse, instead, focus on them.
32.Do not believe any of what you hear and less than 50% of what
you see. Your spouse will speak in absolute negatives because
he/she is hurting and scared.
33.Do not give up no matter how dark it is or how bad you feel.
34.Do not ask your spouse if he/she has noticed your changes. Those changes are for you and for the rest of your life...with or without your spouse. If it is just to get your spouse back...they won't last and the same problems will return.
35.Do not send several TM's or emails throughout the day unless absolutely necessary.
36. It is best to stay away from the bar scenes where other problems easily arise.
37. Do not backslide from your hard earned changes.

[mindfull]

Flowmom -

I'm glad you posted that to Dale. I had forgotten about that list. I used it way back when, and I believe those actions/non-actions are what led us to a peaceful existence.


Dale -

How are you today??? You sound busy! That's good!

I work from home, automating research labs in pharmaceutical companies, government labs and universities, and biotech companies, so I can easily pis$ away too much time here.

Just checking in.