What Now?

[WhatNow]

i can not advise anyone! only share what I have been advised to do. Nor do I believe many attorneys are pro-marriage. I live in a community property, no-fault state which, entitles me to half of the marital assets. The infidelity on H's part adds to my argument for spousal maintenance, as does a marriage longer than 20 years, and my sahm status. So, I have been advised to keep doing what I have always done and to expect the same from H. If he were to stop supporting me, our kids, and home, it would be considered abandonment and he would get screwed.
I am taking a chance in waiting, but my marriage is more important to me than my financial security. Of course my kids are older, youngest is in 7th grade.

I will suggest that you get copies of your tax forms, bank statements, etc. Many attorneys offer a free 1 hour consult. Go see 2 or 3. Write your questions down ahead of time and take notes, it can be quite mind-boggling! They will probably advise you to file asap, but ask them what ifs, too.

[newmama]

Whatnow, could you please remind us of the strategies you are putting into place? Is it no contact/ stay dark? I saw from your first post that if it is totally dark you are worried he will think you are done with him. Remember you can always give the letter explaining that you only want contact if it is to discuss reconciliation or to end the marriage. But there is better phrasing out there.

Also, (IMO) if you go dark, the best way is when you feel strong and capable of accepting that he might file for D. If you can face that fear (I go back and forth) then you will do a great job of staying NC. If you are not ready, then 180 behavior is better. Keeping in contact with "polite" emotion but keeping that poker face, being mysterious but not obvious that you are doing it, picking up old hobbies/ finding new ones...

[WhatNow]

here is my letter to him the day after he left 4 weeks ago.

"It is hard for me to accept that you do not share my feelings of wanting a future together.

I apologize for my part in creating an environment that makes your affair with her possible.
I foolishly went on with my life, enjoying my role as mother and house frau, resentfully ignoring your needs.
I was not there for you when you needed me, and we are now both suffering for my mistakes. I wanted to avoid those mistakes, and create a new life for us both that would meet your needs. I was able to once, I was sure I could do it again. Obviously, I could not while another is meeting those needs. I wanted us to be able to rebuild our marriage, meeting each others needs, having fun and earning a living together, a new lifestyle in which everything we did would make us both happy, while avoiding doing anything to hurt each other. We were able to pull together to deal with the kids successfully, (our biggest hurdle/issue), and I hoped we could continue pulling together to tackle our other issues one by one. Maybe someday you will want to give me/us the opportunity.

I must take my focus off of you while I build a new life for myself, so I can't start into the whole lawyer thing right now. At first, I thought it better to get it over with before I do that, but I have rethought it. If you are in a hurry to marry her, go ahead and file, or I will when I'm ready to tackle it. Until then, I will avoid seeing you or communicating with you. I know from experience that it will be too painful. You must know the suffering I've endured because of your relationship with her and watching you build a new life with her kills me. I still love you completely, but I cannot have any type of relationship with you under these conditions. As soon as you are willing to permanently separate from her, I may be willing to discuss our future. I loved you when we married, and I continue to love you to this day, but I can't bear to see you or help you as long as you are with her."

Not perfect but he has pretty much left me alone. The last time, when I impulsively threw him out, he checked temperature every couple of days. This is by far more peaceful for me.

This was his response:

"You have been a saint.

I know it doesn't make sense that when I say I love you that I leave. I just need to finally figure this all out, and I saw no other way. There was just too much pain everywhere.

I may just be an old fool. Don't know. But like I told you. if I am going to be with you I guess it does need to be 100 percent.

This is all hard. I never imagined we would be in this situation. And I am so sorry for the hurt I have done. I wish you knew me even better, and you would understand how all of this also makes me feel.

"As soon as you are willing to permanently separate from her, I may be willing to discuss our future. " I am going to hold you to that. I know it says "may", but I need to hear that.

I do love you very much.

He had said he was not in a hurry to D, and that he would probably be back. (That pissed me off!) I do not believe anything he says however. Lying to me seems a way of life for him now. I keep thinking of him lying about packing to leave (said he was cleaning up his den)....Why lie about that?

Now I believe it comes down to a waiting game between me and OW. How long will she tolerate him not filing (I think she already got D), living w/him in a studio motel room in a scuzzy hood, him still wearing ring and fully supporting me. (I live on a nice 5 acre estate). She had put on a big show of how low maintainence she was, and how she didn't need $ and nice things to be happy, not knowing I was uber frugal and that's half of what got us in this big house with the nice cars in the garage. H is the spender!

I do not want the man he has become. She can have him. The lying, selfish narcissist is NOT the man I've been married to for 24 years! They can have a relationship built on lies, deception, selfishness, and pain caused to others. Sounds like a great foundation! That said, I do hope he is still in there somewhere and will find his way out.

Soryy for going on and on but ya got me thinking! In answer to the question about my intentions.... staying dark is good for ME, that's my concern for today!! And taking the kiddos to see Tooth Fairy!

[newmama]

Wow, good letter to him!

Yes, the waiting game between you and OW. Well I relate to that for sure!

So did he come with OW last night to your house? Did I understand that?

Glad to hear going dark has brought you peace. So are you working on areas of self improvement? And when do you see him-when he exchanges the kids?

[WhatNow]

Thanks, I paraphrased the letter from a book, Harley's I think.

No, he hasn't been near the house. The mailbox is a mile away, so getting his mail is as close as he has been. I have a golf club handy if he does bring her here! Hee-Hee!

I have not seen him at all since he left. DS13 has received 1 VM from him asking about his new school. DD16 asked him to lunch twice and drove herself. DD18 met him to get some gas money for herself last week. We are out-of-sight-out-of-mind, I guess. I know he is telling himself "They don't have much use for me." to justify his neglect of the kids. His thinking is SOOOO distorted, which I believe is why I am so at peace with him gone. (after the initial trauma of course).

Self Improvement! Well..... I am getting projects done that I had been putting off, and rebuilding relationships with friends that I had let slide in the last year. Baby Steps.

[flowmom]

When a parent ignores his kids you know that he's really messed up . But at least you don't have the constant interaction that I'm dealing with. You are making the most of your opportunity to be yourself on your own terms and I'm sure that you will serve you well, no matter what.

[newmama]

Whatnow, sorry about the comment about OW visiting the house...I accidentally got you confused with another poster!

So are there areas you neglected during your marriage that you can improve? And I bet your WH won't continue to ignore the kids. Have they let him know they miss him?

[WhatNow]

So are there areas you neglected during your marriage that you can improve? And I bet your WH won't continue to ignore the kids. Have they let him know they miss him?

Yes, there are areas where I know I went wrong. I should have dragged him to a counselor much sooner. I carried a lot of resentment around with me, and displayed a lot of anger. My calm attempts to communicate w/ H were ignored. I felt he neglected me and the kids, and expected way too much from me and was unwilling to return anything. His excuse has always been "work". Included in "work" was going to workout 3 nights a week for 4-5 hours, Sat and sun lunches with friends, etc. I didn't begrudge this, until it interfered with school plays, recitals, etc. His activities always took priority over everything. Each morning, he would give me a "to-do" list a mile long. Some days I would go nuts trying to get it done, and others I would blow it off...I was really passive aggressive. He was all yell and bully. We just couldn't get on the same page in so many areas.
Granted, he has been very successful and we live a very comfortable life, but I'd give it up for a happy family.

So, identifying and communicating my needs, wants and beliefs, and asserting myself appropriately, are big goals of mine.

The kids are ok, melancholy, but ok i think. I have assured them that Dad's state is temporary. I hope I am right. I used to get after H about his relationships with the kids, The lack of time he spends with them...got nowhere. He wonders why he fells like a cash cow!

He did invite DD16 to lunch yesterday...1 hour in 2 weeks WOW.
I would have trouble not checking in daily! When DD16 was OOT over the Holiday break, I called her every day...had to.

[WhatNow]

DANG! I think I blew it... I reacted to an email exchange today and I don't think I should have.

LMK how badly you think I blew it.

Here it is:
Me to H:
DS's meeting is scheduled for Tues 7:30 at school.
You do not have to be there.

H to Me:
I don't mind going. Do you want me to be there? You seem to not want to see me or hear from me.

Me to H:
Do what you feel is best.

"You seem to not want to see me or hear from me."
You have made it clear our relationship is over, so I don't feel there is much of a point in seeing you or hearing from you.
(AND, I like being off the crazy train! ;-))

But you are still his father so I feel compelled to keep you informed of major issues.
It seems you'd like your relationship with the kids over too.
LMK if info is an imposition.

H to me:
I have not made it clear the relationship is over. It is hard not seeing you. I am not sure how I am supposed to do that.

But I don't know if I am just supposed to leave you alone so you can be "off the crazy train" or let you know I miss you.

Lot's of stuff still running through my mind every day. Still going to counseling.

And no, I don't want my relationship with the kids over.

Stuff sure is f*&ked up.

Actually thought you would want me to go to the dinner. But I imagine white knight Chip was there to save you ....

Me to H:
"I have not made it clear the relationship is over."
You left me for another person.

"It is hard not seeing you."
You left me for another person.

"I am not sure how I am supposed to do that."
By leaving me for another person.

"But I don't know if I am just supposed to leave you alone so you can be "off the crazy train" or let you know I miss you."
Moot. You left me for another person.

"Lot's of stuff still running through my mind every day. Sttill going to counseling."
Good. You are messed up. You left me for another person.

"And no, I don't want my relationship with the kids over."
They feel you left them for another person.

"Stuff sure is f*&ked up."
Cuz you left me for another person.

"Actually thought you would want me to go to the dinner."
Actually thought you'd be there.

"But I imagine white knight Chip was there to save you ...."
I am ok. Really, I am getting to a good place. I do not need saving.
I have read a lot about knights in shining armor but that is your role. I couldn't find the links I was thinking of but this one will do:

http://infidelity-support.ning.com/forum/topics/2889105:Topic:39380

I am sorry if my tone sounds harsh. I don't mean to be. Things just appear very simple to me now. I am sorry you are still not happy. I had hoped setting you free on the path of your choice would make it so. We have all paid a heavy price for your happiness, I hope you find it.

So... if he goes in the morning, should I just be as if, smile and say hi? Or should I mention the email?

[chatterbug]

don't even mention it. Act as if you never exchanged emails. If he brings it up. Stand your ground. Be Calm and change the subject.

P.S. do not say I am sorry to him. He does not diserve those words at this time.