Mixed Signals or is this Limbo Land

[MHL]

MHL,

I'm curious about how much contact verbal or otherwise you have with your W since she moved out. My W is in the process of moving out and we have temporary custody arrangments in place at least for the month of Feb. We have nannies M-F from 8-6 and most of the handoffs will be between nanny and parent.

We have no visitation set up, my wife only rents a room. She does not have an apartment or condo or anything. There is no where for my son to sleep otherthan in the bed with my W, when he spends the night which is rare. Maybe 10 times in almost 5 months and my W is okay with that, total freedom from cleaning an apartment, feeding kids, taking care of them, homework, getting them ready for school, etc. It has been me 24/7 since Aug. 25th. I am not complaining but how can a mother detatch from her children like that?? It is not much different than if she had died, in fact I would say it is harder on my kids.

They recognize the fact that there is no desire what-so-ever on their mother's part to be with them. No conversations about, "Well, when I get a place of my own you will have a room and we will be able to do this or that...." nothing. She has not pursued me about helping her with that or anything, it is like she is back in college and she lives in a dorm room, party, party, party.

I think the separation agreement will be a wake up call. for her.

[Cie la vie]

MHL,

I am not complaining but how can a mother detatch from her children like that??

Unbelievable! I can't answer that question. Although my W has clearly lost her focus on our children she hasn't gone this far off the ranch yet. My W will be in her new apt. this weekend and my intention is to avoid contact with her as much as possible so I won't have a whole lot of additional information on her new life that she is eager to pursue.

I believe you are right when you suggested she will likely increase her pursuit of OM now that she is clear of me. This concerns me only on how it could affect the kids but I will only know if they can express it to me which at their age is unlikely.

I think the separation agreement will be a wake up call. for her.

Maybe. Was your W a responsible mother prior to her WAW/MLC status? I thought when I started to push the D along that my W might be shocked into an awakened state but that didn't happen. I initially thought that her moving out would possibly give her an opportunity to see that keeping the family whole is the right thing to do. I now think that I am kidding myself.

There are too many indicators that she is not looking back. Who really knows however. I just plan on continuing to improve myself and be there for the kids. Where her life takes her is in her hands and I just can't concern myself with it any longer other than how her decisions affect the kids.

I'll continue to follow you sitch. Hang in there.

[BeginningAgain]

I thought when I started to push the D along that my W might be shocked into an awakened state but that didn't happen. I initially thought that her moving out would possibly give her an opportunity to see that keeping the family whole is the right thing to do. I now think that I am kidding myself.

They don't wake up because they're too engrossed in their own self-serving and self-gratification selfishness to acknowledge or recognize what any of this is doing to the kids or their families. Plus if they did, they would have to start dealing with the guilt and consequences of what they've done. The easier road for them is to continue living in the denial and fantasy world that they've created for themselves.

Sorry, don't mean to be so cynical, but in most cases I really think the above is true.

S4H

[Cie la vie]

s4h,

I think you hit the nail on the head. My W is certainly adrift in a fantasy land of some kind and is in denial about how the demolition of our family will negatively affect the children. She comes across as perfectly lucid in conversation with me and I assume with others but it is her decision to destroy the family to pursue the OM and a single life style (even though we have young children, a great home and she is 47)that demonstrate a disconnect from reality.

I identify my W as a combination WAW/MLC victim. However the real victims are the LBS and children in most of these cases. Unfortunatley it appears these kinds of sitches must run there course before the WAS can come to realize the tragic consequences their behavior has wrought.

[dwinter82]

MSH, I was thinking about your weight loss last night. You have lost almost a third of your body weight...be careful and take care of yourself.

How is the tough love thing going?

[MHL]

I think the separation agreement will be a wake up call. for her.

Maybe. Was your W a responsible mother prior to her WAW/MLC status? I thought when I started to push the D along that my W might be shocked into an awakened state but that didn't happen. I initially thought that her moving out would possibly give her an opportunity to see that keeping the family whole is the right thing to do. I now think that I am kidding myself.

IMO, my wife fed the emotional needs of my kids but not so much in the physical needs, truth be told I think we both could have done a better job. I feel like I am being the best father in the world right now, I mean it is like my W died. I have had them 24/7 for over 4 months now.

You are right about them, they do not see the damage they are doing and what the future damage may be. In my sitch, I think my W waited until the point where she thougt the kids would be old enough to handle it. I just hate when everyone says, 'well no matter what your kids still need their mother", I reply now that "If you find her (their mother), let me know"

They don't wake up because they're too engrossed in their own self-serving and self-gratification selfishness to acknowledge or recognize what any of this is doing to the kids or their families. Plus if they did, they would have to start dealing with the guilt and consequences of what they've done. The easier road for them is to continue living in the denial and fantasy world that they've created for themselves.

Sorry, don't mean to be so cynical, but in most cases I really think the above is true.

From what I have read in the MLC Resources thread, our WAS/MLCer our changed forever the old person is gone, even after they recover they are never the same. That is a sobering thought and I have to admit it is helping me emotionally b/c, like everyone else, I want my old W back but I think that person is gone forever. I have thought about it and my old wife is dead and I need to get used to that person being gone.

MSH, I was thinking about your weight loss last night. You have lost almost a third of your body weight...be careful and take care of yourself.

How is the tough love thing going?

I am trying to put the weight back on at least 10-15 lbs but it somehow comes back off in days, I will pick up 5 lbs and then lose 4 so it is slowly coming back. Definitely getting my appetite back though which feels good.

The tough love thing is going okay, did call her today to discuss some issues with the kids, but handled it like a "business transaction" as one of my friends puts it. She seems to be fine with it, no anger coming from her that I can detect so its business as ususaul for now.

[MHL]

Had a decent day yesterday I was busy at work so I did not get on the boards at all yesterday. I find myself thinking about my W today but not so negatively. The less I know about her the better but I find myself wanting to go back to the past and past memories, the good times with her and I miss those times.

I will see her or at least have the opportunity to see her tonight, tomorrow, and again on Saturday for the exchanging of my son. I felt I was cold earlier in the week on Sunday and Tuesday when I comunicated with her. I did not get out of the car when I dropped my son off with her on Tuesday night, she started to get out and saw that I was not getting out so she stayed in the car. She did not walk son up to the front door while dropping him off later that night and I did not wave to her goodbye, just closed door and turned off flood lights and front door lights before she was even pulling out of the driveway. Need opinions here, too cold or okay, she is being pleasant in her communication with me via email and phone.

Reminder, I told her "I was done" one week ago in joint MC session w/ her IC, my IC, me and her. I also handed her my wedding ring back. My intent here is to "drop the rope". See thread in newcomers with my speech.

http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1915296&page=2

I can't go the NC route b/c of kids, I told her yesterday I am out of the issue between her and our D13 (D13 hates her Mom will not see her or talk to her)no emotion, just that I am done trying to mend the fence between them.

I feel I am walking a fine line here, and I am probably over analyzing this thing. I want to get to the point where I don't care anymore and I can just be myself. I am typically very friendly and talkative but that makes me feel good when I do that with her, and I think it backfired on Jan 2nd (cake eating). Do I stay a little cold and distant or do I act more like normal me the happy me, which I am actually feeling more happy everyday. I know Sandi's tag line says DO what works not what feels right. Being a little cold doesn't feel right so do I do that and give it time, or should I be more friendly? Taking any input.

[Cie la vie]

mhl,

That weight issue might take a little time to settle back in. I lost about 8 lbs. within two to three weeks as a result of my sitch. Lack of sleep, loss of appetite, stress and shutting down alcohol completely were the culprits in my case. I didn't need to lose any weight at all as I have never been overweight. The weight didn't start going back on until about three weeks ago. I'm back to where I want to be now but it took three months to settle out.

Need opinions here, too cold or okay, she is being pleasant in her communication with me via email and phone.

Good question. I will be struggling with similiar circumstances soon. I guess DBing protocol would suggest you might have been a tad chilly with your handling of the handoff. I can certainly see how much easier it is to be a bit testy toward our WAW's under most circumstances. Maybe a more friendly approach is in order. Look at this way you wouldn't be asking this question and likely would have had less to think about after the exchange had you handled it differently. I'm not being critical just trying to be objective about your question.

I had a a slightly testy exchange with my W this morning (first one in sometime). I was suited up and preparing to leave for work at 7:45 when she asked me if I was leaving soon. I said yeah why? She respond that she wanted to take a quick shower and if I would wait for her to do so. I said go ahead not a problem. She proceed to sit on the couch showing no sign of movement. I than said go ahead get going I have a lot to do at work today. I said it with a firm and somewhat bossy voice but it was needed. She popped off that she was and than said just go. I told her I can hang but you need to get moving. Minor stuff but definitely tension between us for a few moments.

I've kept my cool through most of this BS and on a rare occasion I show her that I'm not going to take unneccessary sh1t from her.

I am typically very friendly and talkative but that makes me feel good when I do that with her, and I think it backfired on Jan 2nd (cake eating). Do I stay a little cold and distant or do I act more like normal me the happy me, which I am actually feeling more happy everyday. I know Sandi's tag line says DO what works not what feels right. Being a little cold doesn't feel right so do I do that and give it time, or should I be more friendly? Taking any input.

I struggle with the same issue. I think being yourself if it is happy and talkative is okay but keep it brief, otherwise it can become a cake eating fest for them. Remember act as if.

NC is impossible with kids. Once the W has moved out (Sunday) my plan is to develop a game plan that is designed to limit my contact to her as much as possible. When we do have contact I intend to be upbeat and project happiness but be as brief as possible.

[dwinter82]

Cie la vie, are game plans are exactly the same, except mine has been in place since September 09. I think positve and friendly is good, but keep it as brief as you have suggested. This approach has not really worked for me but what other choice is there, be an ass...not me! Or I could try to be her friend but that would not be fair to me or the kids and it would, as you have said, allow her to cake eat.

In my mind the most imortant thing you guys can do is to be consistant whith your approach, never, ever, argue with your W (I have failed at this a couple times which has not helped my case at all) and be patient. What is going to happen is going to happen. Continue to GAL and monitor the W for behavior changes, even real small ones.

My W is putting me in a very uncomfortable position and could use some input...please watch for my post.

[Cie la vie]

dw,

I know I have read your sitch and like several others here it runs paralel to mine. I actually get mixed up when posting back and forth with guys like you, Kemper and MHL. I'm going back over yours later today and get caught up yo speed and give you my two cents where applicable. I appreciate your input to my sitch. I'll be back at you after my afternoon appointments.