Trying to move on

[C-Bart]

I'm pretty sure that if both names are on the mortgage both parties are responsible regardless of the M. Only way that changes is through a resale or refinance. The deed is a completely separate issue and a party can selectively wave their rights to the property.

What would be a prudent move would be during the course of the D to force a sale or re-finance. You could always give her a specified period of time to sell. Problem is as long as you are on the note you are responsible for the payment.

I'm not in your shoes and my W is being generous by giving me time to refinance. Three years in fact. In return she gets to claim 50% of any profits (loses) if I choose to sell between now and then.

Fun stuff.

[ClingingToHope]

My attorney told me to help W refinance as long as she agrees to the joint physical custody and lower payments. W called and asked if I'd be willing and I said yes as long as we finalized the custody plan and did some kind of limit on the house. She has to buy me out or sell it within three years.

She said that was fine.

Picked up girls. Apparently, D10 and W talked Monday and W told her we were getting a divorce. D10 said that W told her that I always want to be the center of attention and she doesn't feel she can give me that much attention and I need to find someone who can.

W also told D10 she probably will never get married again.

I'm a little torn. I believe I can change and be a husband more attuned to her needs. I believe her when she says she'll probably never get married again. I've thought all along there's no OM. Instead, it's just that W is just so damaged by relationships earlier in her life that she can't open up and fully commit to someone. She'd rather operate in her own little world where she can't be hurt.

I played a big part in this. I felt I could get her out of her shell, but then loose words and thoughtless actions pushed her back into it.

All I can do going forward is get this divorce deal done as quickly as possible and become the person I always should have been. This whole thing has been a huge wakeup call for me.

Will she ever open up to me and give me that chance again. Who knows. I've read and heard stories where something out of the blue changes things. I've also read and heard stories where people care for each other but are just better off apart or alone.

Time will tell.

[ClingingToHope]

Broke down after the business class. Not sure why. After avoiding the D talk for so long, it seems like the snowball is picking up speed.

A lot of what W says is true. She is a reserved type who likes a lot of alone time. She's uncomfortable getting out in public and is very suspicious and doesn't open up easily.

I'm an open book. I like to be around people. Quiet tends to make me uncomfortable.

I understand all of that, but still I can't let go. I look at the beautiful but troubled face and I know deep down that I can help her.

She no longer wants my help. I have to let her go and see what develops, for her, for me, for the girls.

It's just so damn hard.

[awest1217]

I feel for you, but if she doesn't want your help, you can't force it, which is hard. I know things are definitely headed towards D, but you never know. Just stick to being polite and kind to W when you do talk and who knows maybe before she actually files there will be a change of heart. I know more than anyone that it is hard to believe because I right now don't believe my H will ever change, but the papers have not been filed and maybe the more she sees how divorce really is, the more she will realize it is not what she wants.

[ClingingToHope]

Today's D train update is interesting. W can't refinance the house because of the second mortgage -- which somehow is in my name only.

I'm not sure how that happened. Anyway, W proposed having her mom pay off the second mortgage -- about $14,000 -- then W would have enough room to refinance on her own. So I'd be free and clear of the house.

The stipulation is that she'd repay her mom the $14,000 out of the retirement proceeds. So mom would get paid off and I'd have to take less money.

I hesitated on the phone. I just couldn't visualize the numbers and W got frustrated and said if I don't go along, she can't afford the house and she'll have to go for sole custody and try to get as much of a weekly payment as she can.

I got off the phone and ran the numbers and what it looks like for me is that I'll get around $7,500 less than what we were originally talking about.

I can see why W needs to do it. It would lower her monthly payments $400 a month. She'd still have the house, which needs tons of work, and I'd be free of the obligation.

My gain is the joint physical custody and the lower bi-weekly payments. If I come out of the whole thing $100 a check better off than I am now, then that $2,600 a year and $26,000 over the next 10.

So I called back and said that would work. We kept talking about some other stuff and I brought up attorneys and she got frustrated again and said "I know, it's all about the bottom line with you."

I let that go. I was pushing too much.

I then summarized everything in an email and wrote that now that we are at this point it is about the bottom line and I agreed with her, we do need attorneys now because it's getting way too complex.

Awest, I read what you say about there always being a chance of her changing her mind. I met a guy last year who went through a nasty divorce -- depositions -- each side spent $6,500. When it was over and all his W had to do was sign the paper she didn't do it. They reconciled and have been together the past three years.

So yes, there's hope, but I just don't see it.

Last night I started writing a letter that I'm thinking of giving her the day after the divorce is final. It would basically say I never thought we'd get to this point, that we'd overcome so much that I thought we'd make it through this.

But noe that we are at this point it's time to build something different between us. And that my biggest regret is that I never did become her best friend. She doesn't trust easily and at some point I lost that trust. When she closed her heart towards me everything else began to shut down. She's a puzzle that I've always wanted to solve.

It's not done by any means, and I'll probably reword it dozens of times until it's perfect.

To me, a well thought out letter is better than a prepared speech that might not go well.

Perhaps I won't give it to her. There may be cooling off after the D train is done. It felt good to start it though. I'm a better writer than speaker.

[ClingingToHope]

Had girls this morning and took them to breakfast before school. I'm not sure why it came up but D10 said W is "really sure there is someone out there better" for me.

Then D7 chimes in that W said "our personalities are too different."

I told them I'd always love their mom and things can change. Six years ago I never would have thought we'd be getting a divorce. The other thing I told them is that sometimes opposites attract. It's not as if I've changed much in 15 years. But she fell in love with me then.

Deep down, she's always kind of felt like she was a disappointment. I helped her in that way with little comments here and there and jokes about not getting enough, etc. I speak before I think way too much. It's something I'm working on.

That stuff builds up with time. Only time can wash it away -- if she'll allow it. Her whole family carries grudges until the end of time. I don't know if she'll ever learn to let go.

[C-Bart]

So if I hear you correctly your W is speaking WASeeze to your kids now?

[awest1217]

I would just say when things like that come up with the girls, you should change the topic and make sure that those things are between you and W. They do not need to know all of little issues. THey just need to know that you both love them and it just did not work between you two.

The problem is if they know all the issues then they can carry those into their own personal relationships. Even if W is saying this stuff to them, you should just say something to let them know you heard them, but then change the subject. Maybe talk to W about the issues because when it comes to the girls, it is not good for them in the future.

On a side note, can you check out sitch? I need some advice.

[ClingingToHope]

I've been open on little things I did wrong. D10 and I were talking one day and she was giving me advice -- I forget on what -- and I wasn't listening. Then I stopped and told D10 I did that with her mom. I was quick to give advice but were never take it and I was wrong. I apologized and thanked her for her advice.

I'll have to start changing the subject more. I always tell them that I'll always love their mother. Perhaps that gives them too much hope, but it's the truth.

[ClingingToHope]

W called. D7 has a fever, which is not good since she slept with D10 last night.

Anyway, W is picking her up and wondering if I can home an hour earlier to stay with her.

No problem. This is our arrangement now, but I will drive D7 over to the apartment unless she's sleeping. I don't want to spend two hours at the house my parents lived in that may just be in her name in a couple of months -- although the whole deal is going to be tricky.

It's my weekend with the girls so I'm hoping it's not a major illness.