Looking for Advice

[sandi2]

You know, the DR book does not support snooping to get information about an A, OM, etc. The book teaches to "outshine" the OM and not become obsessed with what "may" be happening or not. After seeing how quickly you nearly went over the edge when you found your W's call to OM, I'm wondering if that isn't the best route for you. If you can't handle knowing what is said between them or how often they may contact each other.....then you may do better not trying to find solid proof. I am not telling you one way or the other. I'm just offering suggestions b/c you have to do what you can handle. I could see your change come about very rapidly and how your thought process was not clear at all.

I hope you will take all the time you need to think things through very carefully in what you need to do and how to proceed. It is hard for me to see some things go a certain way but that is my way of thinking and doing.....it may not be everyone's. A lot of the men here on the board really push exposure and getting proof of the A, etc. I don't want you to feel pressured from us b/c you need to feel supportfrom us. Okay?

Do things to uplift your spirits and feed your self-esteem while she is gone. Even if you have to take a few days away from the board in order to get your thoughts collected and rest. But....do come back. We would miss you.

[rockedworld]

Well said, Sandi! Ditto from me.

[gutwrenching]

Sandi - wow, great insight. I think you may be right. I have thought some today about why I continue to get that sinking feeling/anxiety and a lot of it is about knowing too much that right now my emotions can't seem to handle. I have never quit snooping, but have at times throttled way back and every time I throttle back, I start to feel better. The only reason I haven't quit completely is because of what I said earlier where I want the EA to end and yes I know I shouldn't worry about things I can't control. I am going to work on that tonight when I can get some peace and utter silence (gosh I hope the kids go to sleep for me tonight). And there is still fear I have to get over, I have to get past the fear of the unknown.

It is criminal how bad I have let this bother me, people at work would be shocked. Let's just say at work I've been considered "on the fast track" and the no-nonsense, better not get in my way kind of person. Some have described me as intimidating, no one would EVER say emotional. And in my personal life, well you see it and you see it accurately. I need to find a way to take my traits on the job and apply to this situation and get past fear and anxiety. I have often wondered if I could and should go cold turkey on snooping. But when I see what I perceive to be "sneaking" my emotions take over again and I'm back to snooping.

Right now, I don't think I could take time away from the board. It is my sanity, it is my private world, W has hers, this is mine. You all have become my best friends at a time when I need them. You are who I talk to about me. I had to be very careful today in fact. I talked to W's female friend and co-worker to both of us, who knows a little about our M issues (thought I'm sure W has not shared anything about EA)...we talked for about 45 minutes. I made sure to steer us way wide and clear of any M or R or even "us" talks and a couple of times things seemed to start to migrate there. I can't see any good of me talking to my W's only confidant (other than OM) on this.

I need to think through the exposure versus outshining and I need to re-read DB (I don't own DR). Thanks for planting some seeds of things to think about. Good point on making sure I don't feel a need of support from you all.

W did text me twice from layover at first stop. Baby steps for me - I looked up her flight time and waited till I knew she was back on a plane before replying back. I don't want to be cold, I think I can achieve the same objective by making her wonder why it took so long to reply versus not replying at all. She told me what airport she was at and asked me if I was having a good day. I replied I was sleepy (she knows that) but still having a very good day. Kept it very simple.

[gutwrenching]

Since your schedule is so busy each day with work and the activities for the children why not try and take a lunch break a few days a week (not sure if that is possible with your job) and do like you did today... something just for you!

You know I think I can do that. I've managed to get myself home about 45 minutes to an hour earlier every night and stop bringing much work home. I've survived without any setbacks at work, so next I can work on a couple of days a week for me, I like the idea. Thanks!

[gutwrenching]

New type of question, mulling over in my mind. D8 starts crying tonight because she misses mommy. W only been gone 12 hours, and hasn't been home at this time of night anyways, so it hit me as odd. We talk and get to the fact that she misses her mother because she works so much and because she is out of town. I do NOT want to bring this up over the phone and I don't know if I should bring up at all. Don't want to seem like I'm using the kids to reach her emotions, however, its like I told her when I exposed the EA, this fog/state she is in is detrimental to our entire family. Right now, I don't know if it is pure EA fog or a combo of EA and suicide situation.
So the question...do I tell the W when she gets back how D8 is reacting?

W has promised girls she will call them tonight...she'd better follow-thru. Running out of time before its their bedtime. Kids are expecting the phone call. Pretty soon I might have to TM her to remind her what time it is...for the kids' sake. I don't want to do that. I made all day w/o any pursuit and I have no desire to pursue now, I just relish some quiet time here shortly.

[gutwrenching]

I had to TM wife to ask if she was going to be able to call; she said yes, so I kept the kids up an extra 1/2 hr. W says she called as soon as she got into hotel room, I believe her. Total time on the phone with me and two daughters was about 5 minutes. Before I pat myself on the back, I didn't even get a chance to cut off the phone call before she did. Almost immediately she told me she had a splitting headache, it had been a long day, and she just wanted some time without people around and then go to sleep. And before I could get in a word, she said in a very friendly tone, I'm sorry, we can talk more tomorrow I'm just too tired tonight. That was going to be my excuse! Oh well, I quickly interjected, nothing to be sorry for, if there is anyone who just wants quiet and then sleep its me! She chuckled at that and said yes I can see why that would be. Then the awkward pregnant pause, from both sides, as I suspected on how to end a conversation in this new state of affairs, and we both just said ok, bye, talk to you tomorrow.

Now its my time. Finally. I'm eating a HUGE slice of my pie, the quiet is so nice right now, words can't describe it. I'm so cold after working in a building without heat today that I might just take a long hot shower or bath. I don't think I'm going to think about much tonight, I think I need to give my brain and emotions a break. Just going to look to build up personal self esteem and relax and sleep.

Thanks for your help today to all.

[gutwrenching]

Quick one here - Sandi, Lost, Rocked, whomever. W just sends me TM "Sorry just saw this...was up doing work packages"

There were just the coule of TMs going back/forth last night mainly to figure out if she was going to call to talk to the kids before they went to bed and this TM she refers too simply said "goodnight, hope you have a good day tomorrow."

Now why would she feel compelled to say sorry. And I don't believe she just saw it because D8 got TMs from her a couple of hours after I sent her that one. Guess there is a chance she didn't notice it but not likely.

So - I can completely ignore it. I can TM back and state "ok". I can TM back and say D8 doing much better this morning, we talked again and she got your e-mails and TMs which helped too. Lastly I can TM back and say I wasn't looking for a reply, just have a good day.
Thoughts?

I slept 8 hours last night, OMG, almost forgot what that was like. I did take a sleeping pill cause I wanted to ensure my brain would shut down.

[rockedworld]

Hi GW,
I don't think there is any need to respond.

You are doing too much mind reading... trying to figure out why she would say "sorry" etc. You can't know for sure why, so stop trying. You will drive yourself crazy, and most often we come to conclusions that are not correct or exagerated anyway. So leave it. She informed you why she didn't respond to that particular text. Fine. Now you know. There is no reason to respond. If she wants to know if D8 is doing better, let her ask.

Go back now to your plan of contact only once a day. Focus your mind on other things.

Good job, btw, of taking time for you last night and getting a good night's sleep! You needed it and desrve it!

[gutwrenching]

Thanks, that was what my gut was telling me, thus why my first option.
I love your words on the daughter - you are right, let her ask. I want her to care, but can't make her care. D and I had another talk this morning, a couple long hugs, and I did a lot of esteem building with her and she promised me that "i will not have a good day, I will have a great day"...W doesn't need to know that!

I did spend some time this morning in the nice quiet house trying to figure out why I am worrying so much and the anxiety that comes and goes. I think it boils down to insecurity and being mad about the kids. I am mad that she is alienating our daughters and confused by it becaue they used to be the center of her universe. The other half is insecurity on my part that I have to do better at. I have made great progress on the insecurity, but obviously not enough. I was a center of attention and focus from my W for a long time and now I am not. And the insecurity kicks in along with some fear and then the anxiety and trying to decipher every move kicks in. Got to continue to work on that. That is today's focus.

And walking thru the kitchen this monrning...things need re-arranging like someone had suggested. Heck, I do 75% of the cooking these days anyways and about 90% of the kitchen cleaning, there are a couple of very little things that have bugged me for a while...going to fix those little things and make it more functional for me!

[Lost Rabbit]

GW obviously I dont know anymore than you do mate, but I suspect that the anxiety comes from the unknown! We all like to have a plan and bearing in mind your secret squirrel job sounds pretty high powered you will be used to planning ahead and it does give you a great deal of security. Getting used to the fact that you no longer have any control over your darling but wayward spouse really does cut home hard and is very painful. You are also psuedo feeling the kids pain that they cant cope with their wayward mum either.. Best plan just accept that its going to hurt and it will be a painful, but if you go read all our threads we all had some type of panic/anxiety attacks and we all have got through it to some middle ground eventually, mostly but airing our panic on here and dear friends talking us through it. It is mad isnt it that in the most scary situation in your life so far you are friends with a few lass's you dont even know from adam lol!

You are getting good advice here, some of the lads on here do prefer the more macho attack version but Im with Sandi a bit of subtley some times works just as well. I certainly went for the grass is much greener over here hun tactic ok its an enormous work in progress but if you try at all you will still end up with nothing.

On the W front dont give her too much kid detail its her job and her responsibilty and also dont make excuses or tip her off the kids are getting sad/missing her, she has got to learn from her mistakes. Just keep telling the kids that mum loves them very much she just has some things to sort out and needs some time. It will only show them that the adult way to handle discourse is to negotiate and let people have time and space, excellant demonstration.

Definitely think you should make good use of a few lunch hours for me time is a good thing! Good to have you as a friend too GW (())