First Piecing Thread

[Puppy Dog Tails]

Puppy, you seem angry.

***Not angry at all, although if you thought THAT reply to you made me seem that way, just wait 'til you read the longer one. DOH!!! "Frustrated" is probably a better word than "angry."

These are the types of things that, IMHO, make piecing different from when you're posting on the Infidelity or Newcomers board.

***I'm sure it's a very different dynamic. The other more experienced "Piecers" are free to disagree with me, and I've already said, I may be all wet here, and may be the only one to see what I've been seeing.

Things that you would never do there, like "fix" your spouse, etc become different because you're truly communicating with your spouse.

***I don't believe there's ever a good time to feel it your place to "fix" your woman. It's a classic DAM mistake, and we make it at our peril.

Lets say in the course of your daily life, your spouse has an arguement with their mother. W tells you the story and in your mind you can see where W wasn't understanding her mom or there was a misunderstanding that caused the disagreement. Would you not say to your W, Honey, did you consider xx? And if she said "oh crap, I didn't think about that, maybe I owe her an apology", would you not say "you might be right"?

I'm not saying an A is anything like an arguement between a mother and child, but isn't it the same theory?

***I don't see the analogy at all. I am talking about an obviously VERY potentially "hot-button" issue with your wife . . . THE hot-button issue, most likely, in your marriage, forever, from this point forward: her affair. I'm just suggesting that you should treat it with kid gloves, and limit the number of times you try to pick it up and "treat" it at all.

[Puppy Dog Tails]

P.S.

You may want to go back and re-read what Jack, Saffie, WDID, etc. said to you the last time you brought it up. Some pretty strong, unanimous responses, from some pretty veteran folks.

I just think you've got this masochistic streak on this subject, H4U, and it's bubbling just under the surface, and it's a beast you need to slay. The "Rubbing-Her-Nose-In-It" beast.

Puppy

[kat727]

When your wife responded the other night, she was offering up someone else and their apology not her own. She may very well get there some day and feel the need to apologize for herself. Personally if I ever see the OW she will not have a hair left on her head.

What good does it do? "I am sorry I had an affair and broke up your family" doesn't do anything for the person that harm was done to. Sure we are all taught to apologize when we do something wrong when we are growing up but I tell you it would take a whole lot bigger person than I to accept that apology. Drop it.

kat

[Hope4us]

Whoa! Now that's what I was expecting Pup.

You and Kat both know I think the world of you guys. You've been with me from the beginning and I'll never forget it. There were many days that if I hadn't had the support of you and the others who were with me (you know who you are!), I don't think I'd have made it.

First. Ok, I'll drop it. I talked with my brother last night. He is my best friend. I trust his judgement more than anyone else in the world. And he told me to drop it, so when his advise matched yours, I saw the light

Second. W and I rarely discuss her A. RARELY. Maybe 4 times in the last year. But there are times when A's in general come up in conversation, sometimes by me, sometimes by her, (e.g. Tiger, her friend at work, etc) where because we're not discussing HER A, W is more open to discuss them. Trust me. I do not beat her up over the A. If anything, I'm not getting what I need to heal from this for that very reason. Everyone's opinions on DB, like yours, that I shouldn't bring up certain things because she'll feel like she's being attacked have led me to dealing with a whole bunch of pain when the only person who can help me heal from that pain is the one person I'm being told not to discuss it with. More on this later.

Third. I love a good debate. Arguement isn't the right word. I'm not arguing with you guys, just debating. So even though I'm going to drop it, I'm going to debate cause I love it when people challenge what I think and I love to discuss the merits of both sides. In fact, it's one thing I've learned my W HATED about me. I come from a family that loves a good debate, but W comes from a family of passive people that never speak up when they disagree with someone. So when I would challenge W on something, she felt I was attacking her when all I really wanted was a good debate. NOW I know that she felt like I wasn't hearing her when all I really was doing was wanting to discuss it. I have changed in how I communicate with W in that regard. You guys on the other hand, I don't have to sleep with you so I'm going to debate all the way until one of us is bloody and screams uncle!

Here's where I am coming from. Part of what I see on a lot of posts here is once the waywards spouse signals a willingness to return to the marriage, the LBS is so excited, that they're willing to overlook a lot of stuff. Been there, done that.

But I don't think that's good for the long term health of the marriage. I hear you guys telling me that something that I feel VERY strongly about should be supressed. I've read a cubic butt ton (that's my son's favorite way to describe a lot of anything, LOL) of literature on A's since this began, just like virtually everyone here. And ALL of that literature says that for the marriage to work and be healthy and what both parties want, there has to be open, honest communication. So if I feel this strongly about something and W has signaled to me that she has the same thoughts, whether for her or someone else, isn't that something that could/should be discussed?

Everyone seems to think that if I discuss it with her that I'm forcing her to apologize (see Pup's red font.. ) when in my first post (this time) on the subject, I said that I was planning on bringing it up by talking about our conversation the other night and then saying "have you ever thought about that?" and then let her drive the conversation. I know I'm rehashing what I said and I'm not going to bring it up anyway, so it probably doesn't matter, but that's what I was planning on doing.

Ok, I've rambled enough. I'll wait for replies and it'll spur more thoughts in our debate..

Thanks guys, you know I love ya!

[Puppy Dog Tails]

First of all, I only used red font to distinguish your post from my replies. I don't know how to do the fancy-schmancy multiple-quotes-and-responses that Gnosis and Sandi and others know how to do.

Secondly, if you're not going to sleep with me, then I'm wasting my time here.

Glad to hear you're dropping it.

Puppy

[Hope4us]

Secondly, if you're not going to sleep with me, then I'm wasting my time here.
Puppy

Not that there's anything wrong with that! Ok, I know your time is more well spent on others in more dire straights than argue the point with me, but I'm disappointed. It's snowing like crazy here and I'm cooped up in my office all day and was looking forward to spending the day debating with ya!

Hope things are going well with you and the fetching Mrs. Puppy!

[Puppy Dog Tails]

Hey, I got noobs' skulls to bash. More lunacy, foot-rubbing and cake-eating/enabling over there than even usual. And with Coach gone, Gucci scarce, and Rob just telling everyone to "START DATING!", what's a poor Puppy to do??

[kat727]

Scream??!! You give such good advice. I know sometimes I do have to just step away because it is so overwhelmingly sad on the newer people threads. I am still working on not taking other people's emotions, situations as my own.

Hope, I just got my street plowed once again and because I am a good neighbor and don't park in the street(since I have a driveway), I got about 1.5 feet of snow and mostly ice pushed into my drive. There is no where else to put this stuff. I know I am not in Iowa and don't have much to complain about when you talk to them but windchills are brutal today and the last thing I need is more of that stuff shoved in my drive. I can't wait until next week when tempatures will finally break freezing and we will have melting and ice cycle beginning!

kat

[whatdidido]

Hope,

Just caught up. I agree with everyone, and feel the same way as I did before when you first brought it up. Puppy's right. It looks as if you need to maker her seeee and verbalize everything the way you want her to. You can't control her that way...let her come to things on her own....by putting it out there asking if she ever thought about apologizng, she will definitely feel like YOU feel like she should. You need to trust that she can take care of herself. As for doing what's right....I really don't think apologizing to the wife of her lover is the right thing. The wife knows because you told her...do you really think she wants to know that your wife feels bad now? That won't make that wife feel any better...not at all. This isn't a question about you feeling like she isn't thinking about your feelings or that she is in a "fog"...this is about you thinking she should do something to feel better...Let HER decide if she needs to feel better. It hasn't sounded like she is feeling bad to me at all. You guys sound great...no need to fix something that isn't broken.


That's it...my 2 cents.

[Hope4us]

Who is this new person posting on my thread?

Thanks WDID. Things are going very well. Like I told Pup, I'm not going to say anything. And even though I don't think Pup believes me, it is enough for me that W said that she thinks that girl owes Tiger's W an apology.

How things going with you?