Looking for Advice

[gutwrenching]

Sandi - need a sanity check for today. I know today is going to be rough on her, she was dreading todays events dealing with the suicide. I was thinking today might be a day to check in a couple of times

[gutwrenching]

Disregard - had to make my own decision. I weighed it all in my mind and decided that for me the best thing to do is to continue to pull back, for her the best thing to show support, so I took the less selfish route. Worked hard at not going overboard. Just sent a couple of notes to make sure she was eating, taking medication, and not stressing about this evening, told her to take some quiet time for herself by shutting her office door and let others wait (and she responded immediately that she was shutting her door for a few minutes, so she listened) because I know that is important to her right now. I read it on another post recently too that pushed me over to what I did - we aren't machines, we are human, sometimes you have to do what you think is best. That's what I did.

[gutwrenching]

Just my luck...the tough day for the W, ended up not so tough because the big stressful event was cancelled...so I didn't pull away. W came home, missed the kids again, and promptly went into the basement. That is her quiet, get away place. Doesn't bother me as much as it used too now that I understand things better, but it always makes me wonder about her contacting the OM. Guess I need to let that one go too.
Will see how things go when she comes back up for bed...

[sandi2]

so I took the less selfish route.

GW, you are looking at "detaching" as a selfish act. You "used" that concept to contact your W several times throughout the day. Detaching is not selfish in these circumstances, it is a technique used to save your M. She needed the space from you or she would have made some effort to TM you and say, "I'm really having a bad day and need you".

Perhaps you have always told her specific instrustions, like shut the door to have quiet time (or something similar)plus all the other stuff you were telling her. She is a grown woman! You were talking to her as if she was a little girl. If the woman is in a business that apparently is pretty important.......don't you think you come across as almost being "motherly" to her? Don't you give her credit for knowing what to do for herself? Maybe you didn't know how to show your concern and this is your style. If so, then we need to work on that, okay?

GW, you made a decision to pursue your W b/c you thought she was going to have a tough day. Basically you wanted to "rescue" her. This is one of those things that a LBH must stop doing for his WAW. It is just as hard (probably more so) for you than it is for her. But since she is a WAW, then I bet she resents you interupting her day with these TM's giving her these little "instruction" that she has enough sense to know to do.

If it was turned the other way around and you had a W at home who was interrupting your workday to remind you to eat lunch......would you not see that as her acting more like your mother, rather than a self-confident woman? I dare say that men get tired of it and think, "For gosh sakes, I'm a grown man and can make decisions for myslef. She's not my mother and I'm not a kid". A WAW thinks alone those type of lines and even when she "doesn't"......it is for her own good that the H does not rescue her.

The first day after the suicide.......well, that could slide, but you are still trying to use it.....and making excuses for it. You saw for yourself GW! You saw her put the wall up to keep you out and you went back and repeated the same thing again. She comes home and has that wall around her b/c you pressured her throughout the day with your TM's. You used the excuse of checking in on her. It was an excuse to make contact with her, and you might as well admit it. I can guarantee you that she resented you checking to see if she was making it through the tough day. Don't fall back on co-depenent traits b/c it is so unattractive for a male.

New day......new slate. Today you will do better. You will give her space and privacy to give time for the wall to come down a few bricks. You will wait for her to make any contacts necessary. Everything that you need to "contact" her about can wait until she gets home tonight. Right? It can wait. Don't find excuses to contact her. Unless one of the kids gets real sick or hurt......you can take care of whatever happens.

You've seen how this works. You pull back......and she'll come in closer to you, but if you push her......she'll back away. Everytime you push, you loose ground.

[sandi2]

Oh, I wanted to mention this also:

she responded immediately that she was shutting her door for a few minutes, so she listened) because I know that is important to her right now.

Remember when you had not seen your own TM & actions that day before....like I saw them and pointed it out to you? I think you might be seeing what you "want" to see with hers.

I read it on another post recently too that pushed me over to what I did - we aren't machines, we are human, sometimes you have to do what you think is best. That's what I did.

Oh you are so right. We don't need to act like robots and there is certainly a time to show our soft side and our tender acts of concerns for other. In a troubled MR, you are too close to the problem to see how you may or may not react to something with a DB principle. Also, the LBS is desparately trying to connect and give that life line to his/her S. It is absolutely natural to respond when you see her hurting. As long as she makes a move toward you, that is exactly what you should do......respond with compassion. Some men can't seem to find balance and they go too far the other direction and act cold, mad, and some other unattractive ways in inappropriate time. It is hard for them to "get" the concept of detaching.

Just let the WAS come to you. Don't let them "use" you in order for you to enable their A. Don't allow them to cake eat. But in times of showing affection or when they are in a stitch like your W had with this employee, and she turned to you.....you handled things great at home at night. It seems to be when she's at the office during the day when you have a hard time not contacting.

You'll get better. You can do it. Don't give up.

[gutwrenching]

Sandi nothing for me to say but you are right. In fact, I came to these same conclusions last night, though not with as near as much clarity and examples. So thanks for the re-inforcement and for clearly showing me the why/how on this. Today has to be a detach day. Although I am low on sleep and energy, I have the internal strength for this. I pursued to much yesterday and she pulled back, not a ton, but enough to be noticeable.
Now for the other way around...for a few days!

[gutwrenching]

I forgot to mention I had that self realization last night also. Why is it suddenly easier for me to detach at home and not at work. It used to be the opposite. I still don't know why, but that is obviously where I need to focus. As far as the EA goes, that'll be something I'll be asking you and the others about here soon, probably not today, I got to think thru some things swirling in my mind first.

[gutwrenching]

Bam - it just hit me why I am having so much trouble detaching at work but not at home. It isn't about detaching, its about trust issues stemming from the the EA. The EA thrived while they were at work. They talked every day, usually multiple times and they TM 30-60 times a day, all while at work. On weekends, their communication was cut to sometimes 1 call per weekend and a few text messages. When they started getting braver/cockier is when they started TM more and that's what led to me calling them out on it because it was so disrespectful to do it right in my face with me in the next room and try to hide it.
I think my issue is that I pursue because of a fear or insecurity of the unknown of have they really stopped the EA or just throttled back and gone deeper undercover. It is fear of the deeper undercover because of two e-mail titles I saw right after I cut off the facebook communication: the two titles were "I should have thought of this sooner" and "morning"...now I have no idea who sent them to her, nor what they said, but they were to her account that she tried to keep secret from me and were a couple of days after adding facebook to the list of no communication means no facebook viewing either. So, I've still had this fear that the EA is still alive, though there is no way it is providing the emotional support it once did.

I don't think she has the nerve to try to do much contact when at home except maybe an e-mail or two (ie see what I just wrote). But at work, it is much safer. So I think my pursuit issues are more about fear of the unknown, my wondering if the EA is still alive and they are talking on the phone. I know if it is alive, it isn't thriving, but it could be alive and with all the other emotions going on this week, it would be difficult to impossible for me to recognize signs of contact and the EA still going.

Looking for counseling, words of advice or wisdom or encouragement on how to get myself in the right mental state over this.
Thanks - however I have done well today. No contact at all made since I left the house. No visits, no calls, no e-mails, no TMs (one work related e-mail with other people courtesy copied, so that doesn't count)

[rockedworld]

Makes sense GW.
I had the same issue as H carried on most of the communication with OW at work, when "working late" etc. When he was home, for the most part, I could be reassured there was very little, if any contact. So, my anxiety and pursuing behaviors were usually worse when H was at work. But, all the more reason to work on detaching re: work because YOU need to! If they have gone deeper "undercover", there isn't anything you can do about it anyway. But, the best chance you have to save your M is detaching and backing off. When you do have a chance to interact at work, be calm, confident... "act as if"... maybe be even a little mysterious and unavailable at times.

[gutwrenching]

Thanks Rocked. Nice to have someone that's been in such similar shoes and so recent.
I also just figured out part II of my issues this week, though it doesn't justify similar pursuing behavior previous - and that is EVERYONE is asking me how she doing, is she eating, is she sleeping, how is she today, etc, etc.
There is only one person at our work that knows we are having issues, a female friend of ours, and I don't know how much the friend does/doesn't know.
So it is draining continuing to act like there is nothing wrong and then there is almost a guilt of not feeling like I can answer questions about her during these trying times...questions everyone expects the H to be able to answer and questions I'd like to be able to answer!

So both factors are issues I need to resolve, like you said, for ME.

I already look forward too and dread at the same time the upcoming funeral where we will be apart for a few days. I dread the potential worries on my part--worries of them ramping up the EA again with OM and I look forward to hopefully some significant time to myself. When it happens, not sure exactly how I will react. Computer programs like Skype (where he was loaded last time I looked) make communication so easy and untraceable.

So far so good. Still at zero contact. It is lunch time here, so half a day and no contact, and none initiated by her either. Staying strong, not easy, but I am committed today.