Something else for you to thunk on... she earns more than you?
Really?
COOL!!!
It's the 21st century right? Women are our equals right? It your state supports it, file for spousal support too. No reason why you should have to work two jobs.
Yep. THIS.
And CTH, in your posts, you seem to focus on dating as a means to bring her back. THAT's not your focus. Your focus is getting you to a place where you have your self respect, confidence and swagger back. If she wises up ans comes back, then you get to decide if you want her back. But, her coming back isn't the point, and should not be the reason why you take a certain action. Out of your control man.
Now, speaking as someone who spent too much time in limboland with a W who is comfortable just being who she is right now - and why wouldn't she like it - she isn't working, has her house paid for each month, has food on the table from my earnings, has someone to play with the kids half the time and, here's the BONUS for her - she is under the impression she can pick and choose when she has a husband. If it serves her purposes, she's M'd. But, she doesn't haven't to provide ANY support, be it emotional or intimacy. Who wouldn't like that gig.
It took me a while (too long) to realize the more I "changed" and worked on me, I felt better about me (and I did/do), but it made NO DIFFERENCE to my W. And once I realized that, I understood I really only have one "choice" if I wanted my life (and teh rest of the happiness to which I AM entitled) - and that was moving on. If she comes back, then I will decide if I want her back (not sure on that right now). If she doesn't come back, I haven't lost anything - I've gained my life back.
I totally get what you are saying about "getting there." And I am not pushing you to be "ready" before you are. I am, however, giving you a warning from my experience that your fear (and it is fear) is what may be keeping you from being "ready." It isn't easy confronting your fears. But, you will conquer them and be MUCH stronger once you do.
Do this for no one but yourself. But when you do it, one of two things is going to happen. Either your W will snap out of her fog and YOU get to decide if you want her (and you will have some very serious doubt you do want her back) or she won't, in which case nothing you were going to do was bringing her bac. In either case, you will be a very strong, confident MAN - a he!! of an example for your kids.
And, I think that's really what everyone is trying to say, in their own way. We all want to see you succeed. And that success has nothing to do with whether your M survives or not.
I will continue to keep you in my thoughts and prayers. Tough developing confidence, but when you get a little taste of it, you WILL want more. Feels good to be a MAN agains, my friend. REAL good.
CTH, Bottom line is you are stuck on center. From the sounds of it your R is going no where in a hurry. Problem is marriages don't stay the same, they get better or worse. If it ain't getting better that leaves one reality.
Your challenge is to break the stalemate somehow. Only you know how to do that and you do it based on your own internal boundaries. If dating doesn't fit you so be it. But you have got to find something. For me that is being completely unavailable to my W. Yours may be related to re-organizing the finances to be more in line with your needs.
I think were the discrepancies you are seeing on the board relate to delivery. Their are many ideas as to how to push forward. Some more direct than others but the goal is the same - move the ball. Unfortunately for you and I there are very few, if any success stories of people being nice guys and making their M work.
One thing for certain is you are going to have get out of your comfort zone and create some conflict. That probably is not in your nature if you are a nice guy but you can't move forward without it. Don't get me wrong, conflict does not mean running off in a rage and telling your W she is a crazy b. It means changing the dynamic in the relationship so you have some control.
_________________________ Me-41 W-39 M-15 yrs T-17 yrs D-12 S-9 S-8 B 5/08 S 1/09
We are on similar paths except that you are at home and I am not. You still haven't laid out your plan. I'm guessing it means filing for D.
A lot of things in life have to do with timing.
I haven't had enough money to pay for the retainer. I will soon and that puts a bit of timeline in my head. Then the choice becomes real.
I am still hoping that some small baby steps -- Christmas and the conversation last night -- will come to fruition. But realistically they most likely won't.
There have been lots of times I've felt better this year because I wasn't living with W, walking around on eggshells, praying she had a "good" day. In 2010, I hope that the amount of time she's on my mind dwindles month-by-month.
I really wonder where I'll be at this time next year.
Me: 47, Ds 17-13, D final 6-11 http://tinyurl.com/yk4e2tz http://tiny.cc/thread2 http://tinyurl.com/ydtphqu http://tinyurl.com/thread4 http://tinyurl.com/3sm78k6 http://tinyurl.com/thread6
C-Bart. I disagree on the few nice guys succeed. What about Coach? There's really few success stories in general. The ones I saw on that forum, all of those people focused on themselves and getting better and let the other person go.
I get frustrated with the boards because so many focus on busting the affair, busting the affair. What if there is no affair? And in any case, that again puts all your focus on W.
I agree I was a doormat from May through July and maybe into October. I don't think I've been a doormat since.
And W's choices are coming home to roost.
My job is to get to the point where I don't care about her choices except when it comes to the girls.
Me: 47, Ds 17-13, D final 6-11 http://tinyurl.com/yk4e2tz http://tiny.cc/thread2 http://tinyurl.com/ydtphqu http://tinyurl.com/thread4 http://tinyurl.com/3sm78k6 http://tinyurl.com/thread6
I don't know that Coach was a nice guy. My understanding is he did what you said but he also set some very strong boundaries, got proactive and took the lead with the D. Hopefully he or Greek can comment. The message was pretty clear. If you don't want to be with me, fine you're on your own. That is strength and leadership in action.
Last edited by C-Bart; 12/31/0907:49 PM.
_________________________ Me-41 W-39 M-15 yrs T-17 yrs D-12 S-9 S-8 B 5/08 S 1/09
C-Bart. I disagree on the few nice guys succeed. What about Coach? There's really few success stories in general. The ones I saw on that forum, all of those people focused on themselves and getting better and let the other person go.
I get frustrated with the boards because so many focus on busting the affair, busting the affair. What if there is no affair? And in any case, that again puts all your focus on W.
I agree I was a doormat from May through July and maybe into October. I don't think I've been a doormat since.
And W's choices are coming home to roost.
My job is to get to the point where I don't care about her choices except when it comes to the girls.
CTH, I would not put Coach in the "nice guy" category. And I'm referring to the definition of that term from the book "No More Mr. Nice Guy." It isn't what I think you believe it to be. It doesn't always mean a spineless do anything she says kind of guy. I would read that book for startes if I were you (I did.).
My plan does not necessarily start with filing for D, but that is an eventual consequence if W refuses to move out of limboland. I can't make her move, but I don't have to wait for her. And I won't.
I am not criticizing you. I hope you know that. But I have been right where you are right now and felt the same things you are feeling right now. And, yes, I was afraid. No one looks forward to making hard decisions. But you have to step up to the plate b/c like my W, your's isn't gonna do that.
First, I think taking back control of YOUR money needs to happen. Robx and Gnosis laid out the reasons why very well. Sounds to me like you are working your a$$ off (TWO jobs?!) to keep her in as great a lifestyle as possible. She has, for all intents and purposes, left you. Provide for the kids, and that doesn't necessarily mean giving that $ to your W.
Use your money to protect yourself. She isn't interested in that, is she? If there's nothing left of you financially and mentally after whatever happens happens, how can you be a good father to your kids? Think about that for a while. You aren't being selfish by protecting yourself and your ability to provide for your kids. That's just being smart.
And, C-Bart is correct, taking charge WILL likely mean taking action that will NOT be popular with your W, but that doesn't matter. She is either gone and isn't coming back (in which case what she thinks should be your LAST concern) or she will come out of the fog and back to working on the M (in which case the respect she will have for you for taking your action will be what she remembers after her anger is long gone).
It isn't fair that your W (mine and MANY others) dropped a bomb then make us LBS's do their dirty work of moving forward with whatever that means (D most likely). But, no one said life is fair. Deal with that, then get your nuts back and do the right thing for YOURSELF b/c by protecting yourself your are (1) protecting your kids and (2) giving yourself a chance (the only chance in our sitchs) to save your M.
I feel you CTH, on the frustration. The chances for reconciling, based on this board, is very, very small. The point is getting yourself ready for that inevitablity and doing what will help you.
The choices will come home to roost for the wife, and there will be more pain, fear, regret, guilt, etc. I seems that WAS's can't use any logic, as it is a pure EMOTIONAL decision. We all know that emotional decisions are usually bad. You have hit it exactly, on what your job is.
I tried the other nice guy method and it was worse(especially for me). I think C-Bart is correct you have to move out of your comfort zone, for YOU. Praying for you man. I know it hurts, I am there.
I plan to, but this is where the boards differ from the DB and LBS rules. One of the main rules is to not force an R talk, make them come back to you.
To take the step out of Limboland that you attempted and GIMA is getting ready to do you must force an R talk. So it's not only financially I'm preparing myself for it, it's mentally.
The last one was October 6 and I got the "I never really loved you" speech again. As much as I prepare myself to hear the same thing again, deep down I'll be hoping she says she wants to work on the M.
Me: 47, Ds 17-13, D final 6-11 http://tinyurl.com/yk4e2tz http://tiny.cc/thread2 http://tinyurl.com/ydtphqu http://tinyurl.com/thread4 http://tinyurl.com/3sm78k6 http://tinyurl.com/thread6
