Hope and heartache

[motherof3]

This is where there's a disconnect between the DB forum advice, LBS rules and DB counselor advice.

Many will say I'm allowing her to cake-eat, vent like I'm at home without being at home. Dottie told me to look for opportunities like this, where I can show her I'm listening and not trying to fix things, that I'm genuinely interested in her. That's a 180. Toward the end, I used to kind of shut these conversations down because W wouldn't take my advice. I was too stupid to realize she didn't want my advice, she just wanted to vent.

I am no expert, but IMO, do what works. But take it very slowwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww.

I am comfortable with my decision and will continue to work on me.

You are right. Every sitch is different. What works in one sitch may or may not work in another. You need to make the best decision for you and your kids. It sounds like you have done that.

Mo3

[C-Bart]

Hope I have to ask you a question. How do you feel 1 hour before you talk to your W? Directly after? 1 hour after? How about when she doesn't speak to you for a couple of days?

[ClingingToHope]

I still struggle with the emotional attachment. It depends. I've gone a couple of days of not hearing from her and was fine. Sometimes these boards actually hurt me because the guys on it focus sooooooooo much on busting the affair, busting the affair, it has to be an affair. Then I start to jump to the LBS worst conclusions -- she didn't call because she doesn't care ... she doesn't think about me at all. That stuff. I have to remember I don't know what she's thinking. Maybe her brain is working overtime too.

I digress. Today, I have the kids so I didn't know if she'd call. A couple of months ago I'd feel angry every conversation with her ... bitterness and anger that I couldn't suppress.

Lately, I've felt much more natural on the phone. I hope it's because I'm feeling better and focusing more on myself and less on her. Tonight, after I felt really good after we got off the phone. She talked to me a little bit about something other than the kids. That's the first in a while.

It's been a strange day. I've had three long conversations about my sitch and where I'm at. I can't wait to get through tomorrow and this weekend and get back to focusing on paying off some bills.

[C-Bart]

Just curious. I realized some time ago that my W was my emotional center. If she was happy so was I. Reverse was the same. Also noticed the emotional high that would come after we talked. This has probably delayed my recovery significantly. My mind starts running in NG mode. Well if I'm nice to her she should want to come back. Hasn't worked for me. Nothing has changed and she gets to cake eat at my expense.

[ClingingToHope]

I'm the same in a lot of ways. I tried so hard to make her happy and when I couldn't -- because I now know I can't, only she can make her happy -- I'd crash emotionally as well.

I still get a high when we have a good conversation. That's why Christmas was so hard.

I'm past thinking that being nice to her will make her come back. I'm nice to her because I'm a nice person and I now understand unconditional love.

A couple of people have smacked with 2x4s saying the nice guy approach never works. Well, what's the opposite? Being an ass.

I don't understand that. If she starts to realize the grass isn't greener on the other side and turns back to me ... only to see someone who is bitter, angry and more interested in scoring points than in rebuilding the relationship, why would she come back?

[C-Bart]

No. The opposite of a Nice Guy is a strong man. A man who respects himself and is willing to be direct, honest and present. Someone who she can count on to tell her when she acting like a complete b. Someone she can look to for strength, leadership and security.

Bitter angry - no. Strong, Confident yes. This is not about keeping score its about respecting yourself.

Hopefully some the ladies on here can comment.

[givingitmyall]

C-Bart is dead on about the opposite of a Nice Guy. I, too, am a recovering Nice Guy.

CTH, have you read "No More Mr. Nice Guy"? One of the best reads I have come across through all this mess.

[motherof3]

Bitter angry - no. Strong, Confident yes. This is not about keeping score its about respecting yourself.

Hopefully some the ladies on here can comment.

IMO there is such a thing as being too nice of a guy, always trying to please, basically being a doormat.

I would be much more attracted to someone who is strong, confident, and able to stand up for themselves; someone with a backbone.

I am not interested in a man who is constantly walking on egg shells to make me happy or in fear they would make me unhappy. I would much rather be with someone who would put me in my place if the need be.

That kind of guy is not being an a$$, but rather a guy who demands respect.

I am not sure if I articulated this well, but I tried.

[soleil]

A couple of people have smacked with 2x4s saying the nice guy approach never works. Well, what's the opposite? Being an ass.

No. It's being assertive. You aren't going to be a d-ck to her, cause trust me, that won't get you any points, but it's being confident but NOT condescending. You are just doing you, getting through life, etc.

[sandi2]

I'm the same in a lot of ways. I tried so hard to make her happy and when I couldn't -- because I now know I can't, only she can make her happy -- I'd crash emotionally as well.

Did you know that before or after you were told that on the board?

I still get a high when we have a good conversation. That's why Christmas was so hard.

I started to point that out....but think I resisted.....anyway, I'm glad that you can see how it affects your lows & highs. She also knows that you were feeling the warm fuzzes b/c of the family being thrown together at Christmastime. So.....she'll probably do a major pull back now.

I'm past thinking that being nice to her will make her come back. I'm nice to her because I'm a nice person and I now understand unconditional love.

There have been so many H's to say something similar to what you've just said....and it would usually be "after" they couldn't draw their W's back and "after" the board kept telling them to stop being the nice guy with the WAW. It sounds like an excuse. It sounds as if you are saying that you are too soft...too weak...and therefore you have chosen to just be a nice guy and call it unconditional love. Well, I've heard that one used as an excuse sooooo much. It is BS and you know it. I am so frustrated with men who won't get tough with a woman who walks all over them....and decides to label it "unconditional love". Please!

Well, what's the opposite? Being an ass.

Is that the answer to your own question? If so, then you have not learned. You don't get it. Do you think a man has to be an a$$ to set the role model of being a strong, decivise, confident leader? Can't he lay down boundaries and be firm about them being respected without being an a$$?

You have asked for my response in the past....and it may have been b/c I had been a WAW in an A, so I am going to speak as one who had a nice guy H. She will see the nice guy/uncondition BS as you being a marshmellow of a man. It will be unattractive and a sexual turn-off. Now is that what you want? If so.....and if you have no intentions of changing, then go on and file for the D, b/c she'll not be drawn back to you.

I don't understand that. If she starts to realize the grass isn't greener on the other side and turns back to me ... only to see someone who is bitter, angry and more interested in scoring points than in rebuilding the relationship, why would she come back?

Why can't you understand that she doesn't want to see bitter, angry, etc., but she doesn't want a soft sister of a man, either. WAW's have to have strong-willed, strong-hearted, strong-leaders, strong-decivisive, strong.....everything type-husbands. B/c she has to respect him and she won't respect any man she can use as a doormat.

When she sees the grass is not greener where she's looking right now.....she will go to another place to seek out the grass. So, if you want her to check you out....you need to change your way of thinking.

Once the WAW and the LBH reconcile...."then" there will be the time & place for him to show his "velvet" side, but he must continue to also display his "steel" side, or he'll lose her respect again.