She is dealing with a lot of inner turmoil. However, she keeps repeating and maintains that she wants out of this marriage.
Notice how she has to keep repeating that to herself, I don't think she's trying to do that to convince you, I think she's trying to convince herself - you have changed the momentum of everything that's been going on.
The idea is to stop pursuing her altogether, you actually have to move in the opposite direction, she's used to you pursuing, she's used to you wanting to fix this marriage, she's used to you wanting her, now you have to do the opposite.
She wants out of the marriage - you agree. She tells you that you guys could never work things out - you agree.
YOU (as in you tridoc) don't want to be with anyone that isn't with you by choice (quoting Gucci on this one as it's so important to understand).
She doesn't want to be with you, you get it, you understand, you were foolish for trying to hold on to someone who doesn't want to be with you. You get it now, you don't want to be in this marriage anymore either, why would you want to be with someone who doesn't want to be with you?
It's tough not to pitch in and help her. I did the dishes this morning before I left for work. She had to get the kids ready and go to work herself. It's a tough life being a single mom.
Bro give yourself some credit, it's going to be a tough live being a single dad, when you have joint custody of your kids, you will be alone doing whatever is required when you have them - please don't feel sorry for her, there are consequences for her actions, let her deal with them without your pity - she didn't have any remorse (yet, it may come soon enough) when she started seeing the OM considering she is married to you.
She said last night that she is embarrased about what others think of her and wants to move out of state with my kids. ...Never in a million years!
The embarrassment is her guilt coming through, that part is tough, she realizes that she has made mistakes.
Mistakes don't define people (not usually anyways), you can be a good person and make mistakes and bad judgements, we all go through that.
You can validate her when she talks like that, don't offer to fix problems, don't offer relationship talk at all, just tell her "yeah I can see why you feel like that, I'm sure it's tough"
As for wanting to move out of state, think about what that says, "I'm so embarrassed about this current situation, I'm afraid of what people think of me, I need to move away where no one knows me so that I won't be judged for my actions".... that's alot of guilt.
As for taking the kids out of state with her, you can be upfront and honest instead of keeping quiet on that issue, "... look if you feel so embarrassed about this situation that you feel the need the need to move out of state so that you're in a place where no one knows you and can't judge you, I can understand that, I'm sure it doesn't feel good to have those feelings but just know that I wouldn't allow you to take my kids out of state and no judge or lawyer will ever allow you to take my kids away from me. If you need to move away out of state, just remember it would be you moving away, our kids would be staying here, this is there home"
Be cool, calm, confident, you're doing awesome, keep it up.
After that, I had an appointment with my therapist for an hour, told him the good news about my moving back to the MB. Funny thing.....I didn’t get as much from him as I am getting from all of you in this forum. He seems to be just a “yes” man then I hand him the check. Thanks to all of you who have piped in on my thread and given me the courage to do this.
She is dealing with a lot of inner turmoil. However, she keeps repeating and maintains that she wants out of this marriage.
Notice how she has to keep repeating that to herself, I don't think she's trying to do that to convince you, I think she's trying to convince herself - you have changed the momentum of everything that's been going on.
The idea is to stop pursuing her altogether, you actually have to move in the opposite direction, she's used to you pursuing, she's used to you wanting to fix this marriage, she's used to you wanting her, now you have to do the opposite.
She wants out of the marriage - you agree. She tells you that you guys could never work things out - you agree.
YOU (as in you tridoc) don't want to be with anyone that isn't with you by choice (quoting Gucci on this one as it's so important to understand).
She doesn't want to be with you, you get it, you understand, you were foolish for trying to hold on to someone who doesn't want to be with you. You get it now, you don't want to be in this marriage anymore either, why would you want to be with someone who doesn't want to be with you?
You've done good, keep up this momentum.
Robx,,, what would your response be to the W if the W then states, "well H, since you agree, then lets go and get this D done ASAP, over and done with right now!" I'm asking because that is something along the lines my W would probably say..
DD
H50 W44 M17 yrs S15 D11 D10 Bomb 4/09 Trial separation/moved out 9/09 Moved back in 12/29/09
Robx,,, what would your response be to the W if the W then states, "well H, since you agree, then lets go and get this D done ASAP, over and done with right now!" I'm asking because that is something along the lines my W would probably say..
I'd just walk away. That is just an argument waiting to happen. Thus, the nice exterior door knob you just picked up from the hardware store. (and maybe an ipod from best buy so you can tune out the banging on the door)
If thats what she wants, you cant stop her. But you dont need to make it easy on her either.
A lawyer would tell you just wait till you are served papers then come see me.
Today I did I took the advice from those on this board and did the 180. I got off work fairly early and went to the optometrist and got contact lenses. I haven’t worn them for 18 years. Technology sure has changed, they are so much more comfortable now. I bought some Grecian formula to comb out the salt and pepper in the temple area of my hair, and then to Banana Republic to get some new updated clothing.
......I went home and showed up as the new me. My W was quiet at first then said, “Why did you get contacts and why did you get new clothes?” “Where have you been all day?” “Why didn’t you check in and tell me where you were?” I answered all of her questions with polite short and succinct responses, then I got the kids together and we had dinner at the table and just talked about everyones day. My son said "don't get a tattoo." My W was silent.....I could tell she was getting so pissed. She refused to talk about her day.
After dinner she asked to have a word with me. I went over to the table and then she proceeded to raise her voice and tell me why I didn’t have the right to be running around town doing all these things for myself when I was needed at home. I said “ I didn’t know you felt that way. I thought you liked it when I wasn’t around” She spoke about the OM and the kids were right there. Her voice was still loud and high pitched. I told her that If I was going to continue with this conversation she would have to speak normally. I would not tolerate her yelling at me. I thought that it was disrespectful and that the kids were right there and could hear everything and I walked off.
She said “ I’m not done with you yet” I said “If you want to talk to me anymore you will do it in a civil manner and we will continue in private.” ......Well, we took it up in the garage apartment, which she has remodeled quite nicely. I commented “ you have done a great job with this place.” ....The conversation went on and on, then around and around. The same old thing over and over. It is all my fault... blah blah blah.... I can’t stand you..I want the kids full time and the 50/50 arrangement won’t work. “Well, I said “life isn’t fair and when you get divorced you have to learn to live with what cards that you are dealt,”
Awesome news on defining your new image - it's important, thinking different, looking different, acting different - they all go hand in hand and they're all required for maintaining this new person mindset you have going.
Going to the gym and maintaining your fitness isn't just about being healthy and what not, testosterone production tends to slow down for men in their late 20s/early 30s while it actually increases withi women in their early 30s (a cruel trick by nature, a survival mechanism no doubt, take into account ancient man didn't have the lifespans we enjoy now, as such to insure the survival of the species and produce offspring with prominent genes, the female was required to test her male mating partner, make sure he had the "right stuff" to produce suitable offspring, also if her partner was killed off, she had to mate with another strong masculine partner, the testosterone increase women experience in their early 30s makes them more aggressive, assertive, increases the "testing" they perform on men by a huge factor, increases their sex drive by quite a bit as well so if the partner they are with hasn't shown dominant masculine traits or those traits have tapered off, her instincts make her search for a new partner, crazy stuff but it's true) so working out is also to increase your testosterone production, resistance training with heavier weights will do that, forces the body to produce more testosterone to assist with muscle building, fat burning and maintaining aggressive, assertive, and masculine traits.
Did you notice all the questions about your appearance and where you were all this time? Interesting considering she's attempting to check out of the marriage and pursue another man.
Although she is pursuing the OM she wants to control you and keep you as a 2nd option, you should already know this (if you don't, you know it now, I just told you). How does that feel? Do you like being considered a 2nd option by your wife? How do you stop this? You remove yourself from the options list, you remove yourself from the backup plan, you tell her that you hope she will be happy with the OM because you will be happy without her and enjoy pursuing other women just to see what she is going through. You're not being mean or spiteful, you're just letting her know that you're not waiting around for her, you're moving on, you're OK with her decision because it's a good a decision for you, you don't want to be with anyone that wouldn't be with you by choice.
Changing your image got alot of response from her, did you notice that? Continue doing it.
Did you notice she said "why didn't you check in with me?", notice where something like that comes from, she is used to having the control in your relationship, you deviated from the existing course and she noticed. I would have asked her "why do I need to check in with you?", does your wife check in with you? Seriously did she check in with you when she was out with the OM?
After dinner, her wanting to talk to you but then raising her voice and barking commands and telling you that you should basically "know your role", talking down to you, she is still trying to re-establish control, you need to see this for what it is, it's easier for you to deal with when you know all of this is coming from a place of insecurity on her part. Losing control makes a person feel very insecure.
I wouldn't pursue any conversation with her during or after dinner. Don't ask her what her day was like, she's not going to want to talk and at this point, you're NOT interested anyways.
When she said "I'm not done with you yet", more on the controlling side, trying to re-establish her dominance, she had that control for a while, she's trying to get you back in line. Another example of this, recognize these attempts by her to control you, when it comes up again, just tell her matter of fact without showing a whole lot of interest in the topic "fyi, you can stop attempting to control me, what I do and when I do it, it's getting a little old, you either talk to me respectfully or don't talk to me at all"
I wouldn't bother saying things like "I thought you liked it when I wasn't around", it's almost as if you are doing her a favor and doing things for her, remember you do things for you not to get a reaction from her, if she reads that as your intent, she'll catch wind of your motives and she'll react & respond accordingly.
When you told her: "....If you want to talk to me anymore you will do it in a civil manner and we will continue in private.”, I'll tell you that was gold, you do that as much as you need to and I'm letting you know now, the opportunity will come up alot, she'll continue to test you, you know that every interaction with her now will be a test, to see if you can handle her reactions, see if you can handle her pushing you, see if you can maintain your dominance around her, these are her challenges to you, handle them easily because you are now expecting them, just smile, weather the storm, be confident when you look at her, you know she's doing this because she's insecure, she has lost her whipping boy and she has lost the doormat she was wiping her shoes on.
Feels good to have a backbone doesn't it.
When you asked "how do you think life would be different if you were divorced?”, I would have phrased it like this:
"... how do you think life would be different when we're divorced? This is what you wanted, I won't be around to help you when this is done, you'll have to rely on the OM for that and maybe you should get used to that, maybe you should start asking him for more help”
Ending conversations is another big victory for you, "I think I've heard enough.... I've decided I'm done talking... You keep repeating the same thing, unless you have anything new to add, there's no sense in continuing this discussion", etc.
Continue doing that.
You're in control of you now. You're not controlling her.
She's angry because she was controlling her life and controlling yours - don't allow her to control your life again. EVER!
"...She says that she still hates me, I am like her prison guard! She says I speak like a politician now and all the books I read are psychobabble which were written on the first grade level. The sad fact is she hasn’t read one book on relationships or even made an effort to listen to or cooperate with a marriage counselor. She has her issues but blames her problems on me. Well, I’m not taking it anymore and she sees that now. I think she is in for a life of misery if she doesn’t get her act together. Yeah, she will be a lot happier without me around."
Tell her to keep the "I hate you" talk to herself, you don't want to listen to that crap. You aren't her prison guard, if that was the case you wouldn't have allowed her to hook up with the OM, she's been in control of her life and if she doesn't like the current situation she needs to look in the mirror and discuss it with the person who came up with this great plan in the first place. Her problems are her own, don't allow her to put her problems on you and tag you with the responsibility, as an adult she could have discussed her problems with you, she could have been mature and responsible about all of this but she chose to have an affair with the OM, you didn't make those decisions for her, she did and her response that it's your fault sounds like a little kid throwing a temper tantrum because they aren't getting what they want anymore. She can still have what she wants but she can't have it at your expense, remember that. As for the psychobabble, just smile at her - she's just mad because you finally got a CLUE, it was bound to happen eventually, I'm glad it was sooner than later for you.
As for you being prepared for anything, we shall see soon enough ;-)
All in all, good job thus far, you've taken the advice and directions well and you've rec'd results that show that you have changed the momentum, doesn't that make you feel better that things are turning around? You stopped doing what you were doing previously because it wasn't working, you changed, you did different things and achieved different results, I wish alot of the LBH's on these forums can take this advice and act on it, they would be in far better situations if they did this.
Have a great day Tri, continue posting more status updates, we want to hear more as things happen.
She is dealing with a lot of inner turmoil. However, she keeps repeating and maintains that she wants out of this marriage.
Notice how she has to keep repeating that to herself, I don't think she's trying to do that to convince you, I think she's trying to convince herself - you have changed the momentum of everything that's been going on.
The idea is to stop pursuing her altogether, you actually have to move in the opposite direction, she's used to you pursuing, she's used to you wanting to fix this marriage, she's used to you wanting her, now you have to do the opposite.
She wants out of the marriage - you agree. She tells you that you guys could never work things out - you agree.
YOU (as in you tridoc) don't want to be with anyone that isn't with you by choice (quoting Gucci on this one as it's so important to understand).
She doesn't want to be with you, you get it, you understand, you were foolish for trying to hold on to someone who doesn't want to be with you. You get it now, you don't want to be in this marriage anymore either, why would you want to be with someone who doesn't want to be with you?
You've done good, keep up this momentum.
Robx,,, what would your response be to the W if the W then states, "well H, since you agree, then lets go and get this D done ASAP, over and done with right now!" I'm asking because that is something along the lines my W would probably say..
DD my response would be "what's holding you back? you don't need my help anymore and I know I'm not holding you back from doing this, go for it, I don't care what you do and this isn't something we need to do together - what are we going to go out for lunch/dinner afterwards too LOL!"
You don't have to act. You don't have to do anything. She wants this so much, let her do it, why would you need to help her? She's a big girl, I'm sure she can figure this out on her own. Plus you're busy, you're going out tonight, you met a nice person that you're having dinner with, life is short and you're not wasting it doing things for her - that's the old you, the new you can't be bothered to waste his time on things that she wants especially when you're not getting anything out of it except for spending your cash - let her take care of it.
That's the mindset, without that mindset, you'll never be able to move in a different direction.
After that, I had an appointment with my therapist for an hour, told him the good news about my moving back to the MB. Funny thing.....I didn’t get as much from him as I am getting from all of you in this forum. He seems to be just a “yes” man then I hand him the check. Thanks to all of you who have piped in on my thread and given me the courage to do this.
maybe this is something else you need to change.
yup, either that or electronically transfer funds that you pay this guy to us, at least we reply back when you ask questions and give back useful advice.
Thanks Robx for all your input. It helps a lot. I'm at work on my iPhone so my responses are short, but I will be sure to keep documenting my updates.
I'm trying to figure the rationale behind this approach. You break off, don't persue, and move on with your life. The WAS response is to reality, fear, it gives them a sence what divorce is really like before the fact? Just trying to figure it out. I like to have an idea of what I am trying to achieve.
I feel so much more confident and I do feel the momentum has changed in my favor.
Me:49 W: 41 Kids=D14/D14/S10 Married: 15 Together: 16 Bomb: 08/26/09 Currently: separated but in the different houses.
