First Piecing Thread

[pearlharbr]

Have you thought about buying her new lingerie to replace the A undies? Maybe as a New Year's present to start 2010 out with a bang.

[Hope4us]

I've tried Pearl. I even told her I'd pick her up some that were the same style, just not the same color and I get the "that's stupid" response.

Yes, even though she's figuring this out, she still doesn't get some things. And of course, when you've been thru what we've all been thru, it makes you wonder. And that is the hard part about Piecing. You have to give your spouse a certain amount of trust, even when you're still not in a very trusting mode, if that makes sense.

Like last night. W and I went out for dinner, had a really nice evening. About 10:15, I told her I was going to bed and asked if she wanted to join me. She said she'd be up in a minute after she had a smoke. Now I know she's PMS'ing and wouldn't be in the mood for , but I really wanted to just snuggle. So an hour and a half later she comes to bed. I said "that must have been some smoke" and she replied "I didn't even go out". So I asked her why she didn't come to bed and she replied that she feels like I'm pressuring her.

And I don't know what I've done to pressure her. If anything, I've been the anti-pressure person of the year. For 2 years as a matter of fact. So is it really me or is it her still dealing with her demons?

I tried to talk to her and ask why she feels pressured and she replied that she just feels like every time we go to bed I want sex. I said to her that that offends me and makes me feel like I'm some sort of deviant because I want to be close to my wife. And I just don't get where she could feel that from. We typically only ML once a week, maybe twice. Yes, I want it more than that, but I've been so careful to not make her feel like that's all I want, because it's not. But she has it in her head that it is.

She said "I don't think you're a deviant, I just don't feel sexy". So there it is....again. I've heard that from her at least 3 times in the last few months. So what is it? Guilt? How can I help her get past that guilt when it's in the paper and on the news every single day?

Stuff to ponder.

[Freckle6]

Can you ask her what are some things you do that make her feel pressured or what you could do to not make her not feel pressured? Most of it is probably built up in her mind and not because of you, but that doesn't make her feelings any less real. I can kind of relate to the pressuring thing from years back. With my H, and probably with most men, something as minor as a hug could lead to sex, if I responded the right way. I'm assuming most men are the same and if you are affectionate to your W and she responds enthusiastically, you're game, right? Even if that's not what you were going for to begin with. Well, when the woman is feeling fragile or unsure or whatever in the R, it starts to feel like the H is only initiating those affections in the hopes that he might strike gold X% of the time and it makes all affection start to feel tainted with pressure and expectations which may or may not be there in reality.

Do you think it might help if you took sex off the table for a period of time (letting her know that) and then spent that time focusing on her love language(s) and being affectionate and cuddly to show her, and maybe "reset" her perceptions that your affection doesn't have any strings attached.

[pearlharbr]

Good question, what is keeping her from feeling sexy? You mentioned she's PMSing...could it be hormonal? I hate that that sounds sexist, but I just found myself in the same sitch after changing BC methods in the summer. I never experienced PMS before but now I can definitely tie mood swings and overeating to that time of the month. Just one guess.

I think Freckle's idea about taking sex off the table for a while is a good one. I know that before the bomb when BF and I were having problems, a big one was that I felt the same way--that every time he approached me he wanted sex. It totally turned me off and I felt very pressured. If I knew ahead of time that that night we would just be cuddling I would feel a lot safer (we do that occasionally now and we both enjoy it).

[rockedworld]

Hi Hope,
Haven't had time to read your whole thread but wanted to check things out as you've been so helpful to me.
As you said about my H in my sitch, you can't quite relate... I also can't quite relate to how your W might be feeling. lol

But... the discussion you brought up on my thread about guilt must be a factor.

I know that as a woman, I like to know my H finds me sexy, whether I feel that way or not. Maybe you can communicate that to her, while doing the backing off. Let her know something like, "You are very sexy to me, and I would love to show that to you whenever you are ready and open for that. In the meantime, I respect how you are feeling and I won't pressure you. Let's focus on cuddling and holding each other for now and you can take the time you need..."

Just my two cents....?

[pearlharbr]

Rocked, that sounds great to me. That's exactly what I would have wanted to hear pre-bomb when I thought BF was always pushing for sex. (Now I just to hear that I'm sexy and he's going to do something about it. )

[Hope4us]

Ya know ladies, I get that. I'm constantly complimenting her, flirting with her, etc. But like she's said to me, it's hard for her to hear it and believe it when she doesn't feel sexy.

And she's damn hot. 49 yrs old, two kids and I find her more attractive than I did when we married. People are always stunned when she tells them she's 49. She looks more like mid 30's.

And here's what makes it all so confusing for me. A couple weeks ago W was telling me about a friend of hers at work. This friend is close to becoming a WAW because her H is off the deep end. Constantly rips on her, treats her like chit, etc. The other day, this friend was getting ready for work and was standing there primping in just a pair of undies, no bra. Now this friend has....how should I say it? A nice rack. She is an attractive woman and her H came up and started laughing at her because she was primping while partly naked. And it really hurt her. So my W tells this friend that if she did that that I would be all over her.

So my W knows I find her attractive, but she still struggles with feeling sexy. And the only thing I can think is the problem is the guilt.

I really don't pressure her and I'm constantly trying to think of ways to show her how sexy I think she is without pressuring her, but she still struggles.

And Rocked, since you said you haven't read my whole thread, we are intimate probably once a week. I would like it more and I think she would too if she'd let her self go. But there's something holding her back. I think because she's still got something going on in her head that she can't "feel sexy" because she's still punishing herself? I don't know. Some deep seated stuff going on there.

And one other thing I mentioned a long time ago that I'm sure affects her without her knowing is when she was in college, she was pretty much raped by 5 guys one night. One was her "BF" at the time and he set it up so him and his buddies pretty much all had their way with her. She didn't want to, but there was so much pressure that she told me she didn't feel like she had a choice so she went along. And I wonder if that's part of where the "pressure" comments come from, like if it's not totally her idea, then she feels pressured and can't handle it.

And there's other stuff as well. Her mom and dad D'd when she was 5 months and her mom married step dad who was a totall azz so mom wasn't the best example for a healthy marriage and I'm sure some of the things mom told W have put crimps on our being as close as we could be.

Oh well, that's never going to get solved unless she see's an IC and I don't see that happening as until W figures out on her own that she needs to talk to someone, it'll never happen.

Ok, done with the psycho babble for the day. Thanks for the suggestions.

[rockedworld]

Hmmmm.... it is too bad she is not open to IC at this point, it sounds like there are some unresolved issues there for sure. From everything I have read, it seems clear that for women, sexuality has a lot to do with psychology more so than for men. We seem to have a harder time putting aside unresolved issues to embrace our sexuality, whereas for men it seems often to be more instinctual. How's that for psycho babble? lol

How long has it been since the A is over and you have reconciled? What was your sex life like before the A? (Sorry, you've probably already posted all that... just don't quite have the time to go back....) I'm asking these questions out of curiosity from a woman's perspective but also to help me with my own sitch.

If your W is not open to IC, is she open to other ways to embrace her sexuality or to "free" herself a bit...? There are some good books out there, and also doing things like taking belly dancing or yoga often helps women get in touch with feeling good about their bodies.

Also - has she ever talked to her Dr.? At 49 there might be beginnings of hormonal changes with meopause that affects libido.

Just some ideas I've picked up from my own journey to self improvement....

[pearlharbr]

Wow, it definitely sounds like W needs to talk to IC to resolve those issues. They are serious and coupled with the guilt over the A I'm sure she would benefit from someone helping her to deal with them. Guess all you can do on that front is wait until she's ready to talk then be supportive of her getting counseling.

I would mention the hormones if she hasn't already looked into that. I know it's a sensitive subject for some women who aren't ready to face that part of their lives, so you may have to wait for the right moment. I'm not pre-menopausal yet but the years of being on BC pills basically eliminated my testosterone level. When I stopped taking them I definitely noticed an increase in my libido. As far as I'm concerned, hormones are a medical issue that can and should be addressed.

Back to the lingerie...I had a thought. Perhaps you can just start buying her new lingerie with no expectation that she will get rid of the offending set. Just do it because you think she'll look hot in that new bra and panties and you enjoy admiring her body. After adding a few new things to her repertoire the old ones will be relegated to the back of the drawer and neither one of you will think about them--out of sight, out of mind.

[Hope4us]

Rocked,

No problem. Her A has been over for about a year and a half, but it's only been about 8 months or so since I began to see her start to figure it out. Yes, she was in deep. Late August is when she told me she'd F'd up and was sorry although just not too long ago she told me she realized probably back in April she wanted to stay but didn't know how to say it to me.

As far as our sex life prior to the A....probably a couple times a week, some times more, some times less. Pretty decent. But she never had a problem letting go before and I never heard her say she didn't feel sexy before this mess.

Don't get me wrong, she'll let go now. In fact, we've had some of the hottest sex of our marriage in the last year. But it's mainly when we're out of town or when she's had a few drinks and isn't THINKING about stuff. That's what makes me think the guilt is killing her.

And yes, I've thought about the hormonal changes. And she is VERY thin. I know that can affect a womans drive also. Now I'm not going to tell her to gain weight cause she likes who she is and she looks damn hot, but it could be part of it although I truly believe she's dealing with the recent demons and that could be coupled with things that have happened in her past.

Thanks for the comments. I appreciate them.