Is this the end of my marriage?

[P17]

P, I thought you meant "we" as in you and your wife.

I did! I suppose it could be "we" as in all of us here too though.

Do you read other infidelity forums?

Which ones? I read other forums on here.

Truth is, she may just give up on contacting you for awhile...

I think she will.

but from what I read it's not permanent. They tend to reach out for some reason.

I've actually read the same things. They seem to get a longing for something whether it's just the comfort of the 'devil you know' or something else. I know that my sitch isn't unique, but I just can't help feeling W will not do this.

However, after she moved out but before OM was here I was getting 1-2 texts per day which wasn't expected so maybe ....

The LBS is better off assuming they won't hear from the WAS again so they can detach and get used to not expecting to hear anything.

Do you want hope or to move on? I just have a feeling that people have a harder time moving on if they still hold onto hope.

I actually want to move on. I would like to think (notice that I didn't say hope) that one day we would get a chance to sit down and talk. But it's not a hope. Just a good ending to the M.

In the last few days, I have been detaching more and more. I have accepted that the M is over. I have accepted that W and I are just not right for each other in her current state. I kind of think I made a mistake.

No sure if that is good or bad. But that's what I'm looking at just now.

I was in the shop today where W works with D and D's mum. This is probably the most relaxed I've felt in the shop in a long time. Never looked for W's car. Never looked for her when we were in there. Actually couldn't care less. That was a big step for me.

Another big step in the last few days - no longer looking at car registrations as they pass me so I can see if it's W or not.

No longer have any urge at all to drive down her street and see if her / his car is there. Just not interested.

No longer care where she is. What she is doing or who she is doing it with.

Sure I get my moments where I have a little bit of wonder or anxiety but they are the exception rather than the rule.

Would I like to think that this all had a happy ending? Sure, wouldn't we all. Am I going to wait on it? No. I'm going forward to get a life.

The trigger for all of this?

I was in the city I came from (about 300 miles from here) on Thursday. Without being too coarse, I was like a kid in a sweet shop - the number of attractive women walking around was unreal. You don't get that here as it's a much smaller place. I visited some of my old haunts, got a Starbucks (White Chocolate Mocha) and actually really enjoyed myself. The 6 hour drive down and the 6 hour drive back (in the same day) was good. Gave me plenty of time to think and reminded me when I did that every second weekend to see D.

That for me was the start of me really detaching. And it feels good.

[Day by Day]

Wonderful! You do sound like you are detaching. Your long drive did a lot for you to get great focus. I hope to feel like you soon.

BTW, thanks so much for all your feedback... and the focus you are helping me with!

[avermont]

you want hope or to move on? I just have a feeling that people have a harder time moving on if they still hold onto hope. [/quote]

I am making a tiny bit of progress on detaching--still am looking at all cars driving by to see if it is X or OW, but the quote above is the crux of the problem.

I am trying to move on, but because I am still struggling with the tantrum feeling of "I don't wanna and you can't make me!" (insert voice of 2 year old here) I am looking for the balance of accepting the end of it in my heart and head--and yet I am still looking for DB tips. So I haven't given up hope. If I could, I think it would be much easier.

I went on a date today--a little walk in a park with a perfectly nice guy I met through Match.com. We both were happy to say at the end--let's do this again! And I meant it, cause it was a nice time.

But then I got in my car and sobbed. And will cry again when I start the chores of cleaning the house. Why? Because I don't want to date, I don't want to move on, I don't want this or that...I want what I can't have. I want my old life back.

And that can't happen, so I must just persevere with detachment, right? Is there a good mantra for that? That I can repeat 2000 times a day, or maybe get tattooed on my hand?

[P17]

I am trying to move on, but because I am still struggling with the tantrum feeling of "I don't wanna and you can't make me!"

The best tip I got about this is to accept that the situation is what it is and go along for the ride. Don't resist it. Accept it. You don't have to like or agree with it, but accept it.

That is assuming you want to move on and are not going to DB. I can't see how you could do both. You could detach and DB, but not move on.

(insert voice of 2 year old here) I am looking for the balance of accepting the end of it in my heart and head

That is one of the most difficult things to do. The head wants to move on, but the heart still yearns and pines for WAS. They both need to work together for you to be able to move on.

And that can't happen, so I must just persevere with detachment, right? Is there a good mantra for that? That I can repeat 2000 times a day, or maybe get tattooed on my hand?

No. Nothing like that or we'd all be doing it. There is no golden rule, golden arrow, one shot pill etc. You just get over this in your own time at your own pace and in your own way.

The best book I have bought on this is 'Men Are From Mars, Women Are From Venus - Starting Over' by John Gray (recommended by Sandi2 I think).

You need to heal in your own time. The four healing emotions are anger, sadness, fear and sorrow. You must feel all of them at your own pace for you to grieve.

I don't want to repeat the book here. I'd buy it and give it a read. It's tough reading (I like reading but I found this book tough to go through) but it makes a lot of sense.

If you don't want to date, then I'd stop before you get too attached to this guy or he get's too attached to you. That's not fair.

[avermont]

[/quote]The best tip I got about this is to accept that the situation is what it is and go along for the ride. Don't resist it. Accept it. You don't have to like or agree with it, but accept it.

This is Buddhism in action. Non-aversion, non-attachment; neutral acceptance of what is. I know the theory; it's the practice I have trouble with.

That is assuming you want to move on and are not going to DB. I can't see how you could do both. You could detach and DB, but not move on[quote].

This is what I don't get. My X is totally with the OW. So I am GALing, acting as if, acting cheerful around him-but we have almost no contact. So those are DB techniques, but as others have advised, while he is actively in the A, there is no R to work on.

Cutterbug seemed to be advocating moving on with a tiny little spark of love for your X locked in your heart--just in case. But this also seems to lead to emotional limbo land.

As for dating--I would rather do what pearlhbr recommends and just hang at the bar with some single gal pals, so there can just be fun casual interaction. I am working on trying to find those gals.

So I am totally conflicted about dating. I don't want to lead anyone down any garden path, and if I am not ready to date, I shouldn't. I said a little bit about still being in an emotion ping-pong state, just putting myself out there to see what it's like--trying to give a gentle clue that I am not REALLY ready to start an R, but am trying to see what the world is like.

Assuming we will see each other again--and I think we will-I will try to find some way of saying that more clearly, without dumping a lot of too much personal info on him. Then he could--or I could-say--well, then it isn't right, I don't want to drive over here, or have you drive over here, for someone who really isn't into this.

Is that fair enough? I DO NOT want to be a jerk!

[P17]

This is what I don't get. My X is totally with the OW. So I am GALing, acting as if, acting cheerful around him-but we have almost no contact. So those are DB techniques, but as others have advised, while he is actively in the A, there is no R to work on.

GALing is not about the OP. It's about you. You GAL to make YOURSELF feel better. If it affects him then great, but it's nto for him.

Cutterbug seemed to be advocating moving on with a tiny little spark of love for your X locked in your heart--just in case. But this also seems to lead to emotional limbo land.

Moving on is not an emotional limbo land. Not at all. What you do is you stop the rollercoaster and say 'Im getting off'. You get off and you keep that little bit of love you had for your WAS locked away in your heart. You keep it there for you. You don't keep it there for them. The alternative to not having that love is indifference, apathy or hate. None of them you want in there. You are a good person. You had good times. You were in love.

You walk away with that love and those memories and you walk away with a heart that contains love, not hate.

If, one day, the WAS wants to talk then you can deal with them in a loving caring way as you still have a little bit of love for them.

The alternative is to get bitter, twisted and filled with hate and anger. And if one day the WAS comes back to talk, you explode that hate and anger all over them.

Hate and anger destroys you. Locking the love away keeps the hate and anger away.

So I am totally conflicted about dating. I don't want to lead anyone down any garden path, and if I am not ready to date, I shouldn't. I said a little bit about still being in an emotion ping-pong state, just putting myself out there to see what it's like--trying to give a gentle clue that I am not REALLY ready to start an R, but am trying to see what the world is like.

There is nothing wrong with seeing what is out there. Are you strong enough to resist temptation though?

Is that fair enough? I DO NOT want to be a jerk!

IMO, you shouldn't date until you are ready. The first thing a man wants to do when an R ends, is replace it with another one. It's the wrong thing to do. It's also one of the hardest things to resist (read some of my older posts and you will see).

[chatterbug]

Avermont. I believe in a parallel path. You heal yourself. You move on. If you kept contact with the WAS. You would slowly deplete all love you have for that person. I don't know about you. But if I was chasing ladybug everysingle day since D-Day , I would have hated her by now.

Going dark is a parallel path. You protect yourself. But at the same time you protect what little love you have left for that person. A small opening in your heart for that day when you both decide to begin a new journey together. They will need that footing more than you. We were betrayed. Remember the following sentance.

1. You know that your lover will make decisions that impact your wellbeing and future without your input. Without dicussion. Without consent.
2. You know that your lover has boundary issues with the opposite sex.
3. You know that your lover has the capacity to become a phycological liar to support these decisions.

This is what we have to forgive. Do not freely give this away. This must be earned. True Remorse for ones actions.

You give this away. And you will have learned nothing. The only gift you gave will be bitterness. By one of you or both.

We were placed on this planet to live a fulfilling life.

Not to carry a torch for the person who lacerated our hearts.

Parallel path.

Its a very basic concept. One I choose to follow. Either way. I am victorious. The choices in this journey are many.

A choice in paths

1. Wait hope he takes me back.
2. Wait get bitter ( which has the following )
2a. he takes me back and it does not work out
2b. he takes me back and you spend the rest of your life walking on egg shells because you have not delt with your issues and the adultry
2c. he does not take me back so you remain alone
2d. he does not take me back so you repeat the same mistakes. Same bed , different body.


Or.

Heal myself. Grow and learn. Accept ones faults for the failure of relationship. Learn. Grieve the loss of the relationship.

Reborn. I am in control of my life. I am the only person I need for true happiness. I have surrounded myself with family and friends. I have healthy boundaries in place for those relationships. I am healed and prepared to determine the next phase in my life.

Life alone.
Meet someone.
Determine if their goals match yours. Set healthy boundaries and commit to a relationship that both of you want or end it and meet someone determine if their goals match yours. Set healthy boundaries and commit to a relationship that both of you want or end it and meet ...


Nowhere is it written who that someone may be. Could be someone you already know, who has touched your heart, who has lacerated your heart , who is a complete stranger.

[P17]

Avermont. I believe in a parallel path. You heal yourself. You move on. If you kept contact with the WAS. You would slowly deplete all love you have for that person. I don't know about you. But if I was chasing ladybug everysingle day since D-Day , I would have hated her by now.

This also allows the WAS to live her life fully without you around. That is a double-edged sword though, as is everything else with going dark.

[Gnosis]

Cutter, nice post to read. P I'm kinda half following along... (sorry) One thing I can say is I'm impressed about how far you've come from day 1 here.

With that said oh wise ones... (because I'm having extreme difficulty updating my thread - I'm currently still in a rapid state of high/low flux and trying to calm down)

Here's my question... because the answer currently eludes me and my mind refuses to unlock the knowledge today:

How does one combat/neutralize hatred? (In the WAS)

[chatterbug]

As for dating.

Dating is full of expations.

Set your expations. Set your boundaries.

A date is not a relationship.

A date is a enjoying some company , some conversation , some activity and perhaps some food.

Something you could do with a friend or a stranger.

Nowhere are we saying have sex or fall in lust.

We are saying. Enjoy your life. Live. A very hard part of depression is dealing with pleasures. We turn them off. I bbq. I love to cook. I have not bbq'd once since D-day. Not once. I have just started to cook again. I invite friends over and I make them diner. If its just one I treat it as a date. I expand my circles of friends. I meet new people.

Maybe one day I go for a coffee with one of them. I prepare for this evening as it was a date. Then I go and enjoy coffee. I engage them in conversation. I enjoy myself. I go home. If I had a good time and I find the person interesting. I call them up and say I had a good time and would like to do that again sometime with them or with a group of friends. Thats a date as well.

Maybe someone goes... Hey I have a friend and they seperated or they are single and never married. Would you like to meet them. I say sure. But let them know that I am only interested in good food, good company and good conversation. Nothing more.
If they agree to this then I have a blind date. If I enjoy it. Then I had a good evening. Perhaps I will do this again.

I am living my life. Enjoying the company of others. Some old, some new in my life.

Nowhere have I fallen in love , lust. I am healing. This is helping.

And if by chance I do get emotionally attached to some one at this time ( and yes I have , and realized it because I am healing and learning about relationships and myself )I space out the meeting with this person. Hell if I am strong enough I use these feelings to help heal. But I deploy DB on that person and loving detatch from them. Deal with my co-dependancy issues.

Then test the water again with them. But always keeping to my boundaries on friendships and dating.

I live my life.

Then a funny thing happens.

While I am living my life.

Life happens.