Think OW is here in my house right now!

[CityGirl]

In my case my H's dirtball of an attny tried to play hardball but he didn't do a very good job. He has a horrible reputation of being a snake. When things didn't go his way he would ask for a judge change. My attny and I consented once and after we got a new judge and my H and his attny got backed in a corner again they asked for another judge change. The judge said no way.

My attny actually had to do very little because the judge was FED UP with my H and his attny. Every time we went to court it was *something*. My H's attny didn't show up, he was late, forgot to bring the Agreement and my H's own attny actually threw him under the bus several times, lol!

I can only speak from my experience but judges tend to get fed up with the constant BS. I would assume even if you and your H settle out of court (no trial) some sort of court official or judge will have to sign off on the Agreement. Judges see right through BS and from the two judges our case went through they don't take kindly to having their time wasted.

[Gnosis]

Ok, thought about it more - I will hang onto letter and use later if needed.

I'm happy to hear that.

Dear H –

I have withdrawn $1,000 from the joint checking account for the sole purpose of retaining legal counsel.

I am willing to set up a meeting with you to discuss the terms of our divorce settlement agreement.

Hmm... too business-like and you're still revealing your cards. You don't want him to know you're getting legal advice at the moment.

How about this:

------------
H,

Something important came up this weekend. I needed to take $1000 from the joint account.

I've had some time to think about the recent events and would like to share my thoughts with you. Let's have coffee tomorrow at 12:00 at XXXXX.
------------

Non-confrontational, friendly, calm. Non-business like.

After sending you go: NO CONTACT. Do not reply to his calls, emails, texts etc. You meet him for coffee.

At coffee you tell him:
AFG: I think its time we went our separate ways. I'm sure you do too. <pause and wait for confirmation>
AFG: Good, I'm glad you feel that way (or) I'm sorry you feel that way, but this is what's best for me.
AFG: Let's do this the cheapest, quickest way possible. I'm going to find a lawyer and see which is the best way possible.
AFG: Thanks for listening to me.

Then get up and leave. Do NOT argue or become adversarial.

[Gnosis]

One more thing... in an ideal world the convo will go as above... but we all know that we don't live in one. Keep the conversation to "What AFG wants" without giving a hint that you're gearing up for war.

When your H hears you've already been to see a L he's going to interpret it as an "act of war." Your goal is to defuse the situation as much as possible.

And if there is one lady who's opinion on legal matters I respect it's CityGirl.

but you have such a position of power here and the best way to use it is to give him NO INFO!

Hey CG, if I've not told you this before... RESPECT.

[Kimmie Lee]

I don't know why you need to explain the withdrawal at all. It is a marital asset that you have every right to.

You are still a wife, not a child, not a slave.

[aflowergurlie]

Ok, thought about it more - I will hang onto letter and use later if needed.

I'm happy to hear that.

Dear H &#150;

I have withdrawn $1,000 from the joint checking account for the sole purpose of retaining legal counsel.

I am willing to set up a meeting with you to discuss the terms of our divorce settlement agreement.

Hmm... too business-like and you're still revealing your cards. You don't want him to know you're getting legal advice at the moment.

How about this:

------------
H,

Something important came up this weekend. I needed to take $1000 from the joint account.

I've had some time to think about the recent events and would like to share my thoughts with you. Let's have coffee tomorrow at 12:00 at XXXXX.
------------

Non-confrontational, friendly, calm. Non-business like.

After sending you go: NO CONTACT. Do not reply to his calls, emails, texts etc. You meet him for coffee.

At coffee you tell him:
AFG: I think its time we went our separate ways. I'm sure you do too. <pause and wait for confirmation>
AFG: Good, I'm glad you feel that way (or) I'm sorry you feel that way, but this is what's best for me.
AFG: Let's do this the cheapest, quickest way possible. I'm going to find a lawyer and see which is the best way possible.
AFG: Thanks for listening to me.

Then get up and leave. Do NOT argue or become adversarial.

Ok - but this isn't going to work because then H knows I myself don't have more money to retain a lawyer if I just used the money for whatever. And then H will be mad about me taking money (regardless, I know by law it doesn't matter, it is 50/50 here), but will go open another bank account and then I will have to go through all legal process of getting his statements and all that mess - it will just drag on and on. If I tell him right up front it is for legal fees so we can get the divorce, he is not going to object because it is perpetuating the divorce he wants to be done as well. He wants the divorce he just doesn't want to have to do all the stuff involved to get one. He avoids all conflict by nature and would rather bury his head in the sand than go through this stuff.

So I would rather just tell him that it is for legal fees right up front and that it will help in getting this done in the quickest, cheapest way possible.

And I would rather just tell him first before he discovers it so it doesn't look like to him that I was trying to do something to get back at him.

[CityGirl]

Here is an idea... is there anybody you could borrow the retainer money from? That way your H won't have to know a thing about what you are doing legally.

I don't know how your state works but once D papers are filed/served there is a time frame for response. If your H is not expecting them then he will have to scramble for an attny and chances are he will be so out of sorts about what he knows you know already he might panic and just choose *any* attny and we all know how important choosing the right attny is.

Personally I would not tell him you are retaining legal counsel but that is just me. I would take it a step further when ya'll meet for coffee and have a settlement drawn up (that you made, not your attny) and tell him this is what you expect if he would like to keep this out of court. Give him 24 hours to accept or decline your offer. People make very bad decisions when they are backed in a corner. If he declines your settlement offer, well, you know what you need to do.

I made it very clear to my H that I would not negotiate as I was given no negotiating power when he walked out on me for an affair. Negotiations go both ways and your H set the tone for NONE to occur when he began his affair. Too bad, too sad for him.

[aflowergurlie]

Thanks CityGirl! - that's what I'm going to do - I'm presenting H with the settlement offer that I come up with. If he accepts and we can agree, then I will use money to go to uncontested lawyer for us and have them do the paperwork. If he disagrees, then I will take the money and go get myself a contested lawyer.

If he asks about the money in the meantime - I will tell him it is going to be used for our legal fees in getting this divorce done.

[Kimmie Lee]

AFG, just withdraw the $$ and do what you're going to do. No need to over-complicate things, right?

I guess I just wish you could get past the notion that you are somehow not entitled to money in the joint account. You are HIS WIFE until a judge says you're not!

I hear you say that it is "his" money. Sweetie, it's YOUR money too! Has it always been the dynamic in your marriage that you think that he has more say over things just because you don't make the same salary, or any salary at all?

It doesn't matter! Start thinking of yourself as an equal partner. Because YOU ARE!!

[CityGirl]

I guess I have to ask how retaining legal counsel to get out of a marriage that HE ENDED is "getting back at him"? That is how divorce works, right?

Unless you both waive your rights to full financial disclosure or reach a settlement prior to attnys getting involved you will have to go through discovery anyhow (it might be called something different in your state but its basically a full disclosure financial document). Also, I know in NY whomever files for the D must provide their spouse with an affidavit outlining what they did based on the grounds you are filing under.

My H thought he was so safe because in NY to file under Adultery you must have a 3rd party witness in court say they saw with their own eyes the cheating spouse and their affair having sexual relations (if it's contested and when you file for divorce using Adultery it's always contested as it's very hard to prove). What my H's attny never told him was I could use the grounds of Cruel and Inhumane treatment as having a sexual relationship outside of marriage *is* cruel and inhumane.

You must play hardball. It's NOT easy, I know. I had a little saying I said to myself every time I had to deal with all this legal BS... "bitch aint playing". I had to go "ghetto" on my H!

[Gnosis]

If I tell him right up front it is for legal fees so we can get the divorce, he is not going to object because it is perpetuating the divorce he wants to be done as well. He wants the divorce he just doesn't want to have to do all the stuff involved to get one. He avoids all conflict by nature and would rather bury his head in the sand than go through this stuff.

So I would rather just tell him that it is for legal fees right up front and that it will help in getting this done in the quickest, cheapest way possible.

AFG, you have proven yourself very smart and resourceful. You know your H better than us. In light of the above, it looks like the right way for you.

You're giving him what he wants. He's lazy and gutless. This is why he brought the whore into your house while you were sleeping in the next room. He expects YOU to do the legwork.

I'm sad to see the SOB getting what he wants, and in the easiest, most convenient way for him. He's not as dumb as he looks.

((((AFG)))) Get what you need. I don't have any 2x4's for you, just moral support.