Moving on with my life!

[Startingover2]

Babys dedication went super well. I was so stressed on how the pastor would handle it because we are divorced. Usually he talks about the M being a solid foundation, but he worded things so good. Exh was happy and we both stood there for our daughter. The whole time exh had his hand on my back and then at the end when I went up for communion, he held my hand and went with me. I was shocked but didn't pull away as it was in front of the entire church. I did wonder through the whole service what exh was thinking. Did he feel convicted at all? Did he feel like everything he has done is ok? I just wondered.

[Startingover2]

He does have alot of problems and he won't deal with them. I wish I could bottle up the man he was today and I would be happy. How long would it be before he got bored, lonely, angry, irritated or whatever and he was right back to being unfaithful again?

He wanted to spend the day with us today, but I was busy with my older kids. Need some space to think. He still is drinking so I can't even go there anyway, but this sucks big time. I feel myself caring again.

[S.T. _I Made It!]

S.T, your statement about Tiger Woods affair.... not so true. It doesn't take 2 people in all cases to cause one to have another affair. Even if there is something lacking, that should not drive someone to an affair. And to have something lacking while his wife is pregnant? There will always be something lacking in everyones life. That is not a reason to have an A. Some people are simply never ever happy no matter what. You can be the perfect wife/husband, but if you lack in moral and values, you will do what you want.

My ExH is one that will never, ever be happy. I could have been perfect, but he still would have done what he did because he wasn't getting what he wanted. And what he wanted was only obtainable in a perfect world, and we do not live in a perfect world.

I can never see an excuse for an affair. I may be able to forgive and move on and work on both of us like you did (and I totally commend you) But when entered into marriage, nothing should drive one to cheat. It is just a sad excuse for not dealing with the issues at hand.

I think you may have misunderstood my point. If you had been a perfect person, your H probably still wouldn't have stayed. It's not about you being perfect for THEM, especially in your case, I believe you needed to be more true to yourself and stand up for that,(but, you are right, as I will say further down some people never realize what they need to do inside themselves and are never happy with what they have),

There are so many things involved with this. The thing is, when people are getting their needs met inside their marriage, they don't look outside the marriage to try to fill those needs. The bottom line is people do have affairs because they are lacking something in the marriage. Is it an excuse to have an affair?? of course not! But because we are all imperfect people, we all can take part of the blame for the breakdowns of our Rs. Even when it has to do with addictions, the other person can influence problems because they can end up being the enabler. for example, a woman who is abused. I have a friend who was for many years. Because she allowed his abuse and believed the lies, she became an enabler. I don't blame her for it, but there are always alternatives, ways to change ourselves to make our sitch better (or worse). That is what DB is all about.

Now the other point is, both people need to be healthy in their own skin. And sometimes even if the other person changes, the person who is stuck doesn't know how to get out, and sometimes you just have to wait, or they never get it. Like SO2 exH.. he has no worth or self respect whatsoever right now, so no matter who he falls for, it will never work because he needs to fix himself.

In regards to Tigers sitch. Do you think it was possible for Tigers wife to be selfconscious? I mean, with all the women Tiger could get at the drop of a hat? That would be an extremely difficult position, to be pregnant and married to such a superstar, and one that is away many times. I'm not saying that he didn't start any of the problems, but I would almost guarantee she started some of her own along with him. Then the cycle begins. Is it her fault he had an affair? no, but she is a part of the R which means she made mistakes too and was a part of the breakdown of their M. the breakdown happens BEFORE the Affair. the A is just a symptom of the problem.

And, this discussion will also depend upon what we consider to be a "wrong". let's say for example she was someone who would complain and talk bad about her husband in front of him and another people...in a way being abusive with words, and compare that to him having an affair. Is one worse than the other? are they both detrimental to the marriage? is one okay and the other not? See, there is going to be a line that some people draw, and others don't. In my opinion, I look at them to both be detrimental and both hurt the other person. And in fact, I could explain why the words could even potentially hurt more (looking back at my verbally abused friend).

So, this is where we may differ in opinions and so they cannot be argued against one another. But, I understand where you are coming from, and I appreciate your comment G and it's nice to see you here.

[S.T. _I Made It!]

have you thought to ask exh what he thought of the dedication?

I would wonder too. but stop wondering!!

and I agree with mostly everything G said too.

I would imagine that exh lack of selfworth is not because of SO2, unless of course she was a wife, like the one I explained above, always complaining and talking bad...but I don't think that. My opinion is that SO2 was selfconsious herself. Because, SO2, of how you are with exh these last years, and I could be wrong.. I have always sensed that you didn't have confidence in yourself and didn't truly love yourself, and these things can be detrimental on a M too. I know, because that was me. Because you have struggled with keeping your focus off of exh, I sense that at some point in your M, you lost your confidence. Now, perhaps it was because exh was mean to you, or never complimented you, but WE still get to choose how we react to those issues. In my own experience, that was me, never getting complimented, feeling unloved (because WOA is my 5LL) and therefore losing self esteem and confidence and etc. Which in turn led H to believe he didn't love me anymore, and when the OW came into his life, it was easy to jump on board...literally. lol

okay, I totally didn't mean to go blab blab blab tonight, especially all over your thread SO2!!! I'm sorry.

I hope that didn't offend you. I think your doing really good, and you are getting better at trying to take your focus away from him. I'm glad the dedication was nice and the pastor had great things to say. I would have been happy with the arm thing too if I were you I'm sure. Just remember, no expectations, and you never know WHAT your exh will do next, so don't let what he does-if he does anything- ruin your mood!!

[Startingover2]

I did ask him what he thought. Actually after we all left and went our separate ways I sent a text thanking him for coming and how much it meant to me. He said he liked it and it was nice. There were a few men he knew and they approached him and really welcomed him which was nice too. Oh, before the service started the pastor came to us and met exh. I think he sensed we were nervous and he calmly told exh what was going to happen and that was good for both of us.

I am trying not to have expectations. He did say a week or so ago that he liked how things were and he wanted to "do more things with us and see where it goes from there". Now being the control freak that I am, that statement bugged me. Its so non committal! Given our situation that we were married, we have a child together, and 5 other kids between us it would seem that to date causually and without a purpose or goal is sorta scary. Its almost like exh has an out if he needs, or an excuse to go another way. I would rather hear...i want to try. I want to make the commitment to try and see if we can put this back together. Maybe its just me.

Oh, and my daugher was looking at his fb page last night and he still has "in a relationship" as his status. Why? I know MGF would flip out if she saw it but so what? MGF also has a picture of he and her on her fb page and the same status. I know they haven't seen eachother and he is still giving her excuses..but the door is cracked open. But then again....with our non committal status what can I say? Nothing!

I also have to keep in the forefront of my mind the fact that unless some miracle has occured he is still drinking at the very least. If he hasn't seen MGF he hasn't done many pills.

Why does he have to be so charming? Why does he have to be saying and doing all the right things? It was much easier when he was obviously doing other things?

[Startingover2]

I would imagine that exh lack of selfworth is not because of SO2, unless of course she was a wife, like the one I explained above, always complaining and talking bad...but I don't think that. My opinion is that SO2 was selfconsious herself. Because, SO2, of how you are with exh these last years, and I could be wrong.. I have always sensed that you didn't have confidence in yourself and didn't truly love yourself, and these things can be detrimental on a M too. I know, because that was me. Because you have struggled with keeping your focus off of exh, I sense that at some point in your M, you lost your confidence. Now, perhaps it was because exh was mean to you, or never complimented you, but WE still get to choose how we react to those issues. In my own experience, that was me, never getting complimented, feeling unloved (because WOA is my 5LL) and therefore losing self esteem and confidence and etc. Which in turn led H to believe he didn't love me anymore, and when the OW came into his life, it was easy to jump on board...literally. lol

I think you are right on ST with the self confidence. It has been shattered in the past few years. I wasn't a complainer at all with exh, in fact I sat back and watched alot of stuff I shouldn't have with him for a long time. Things were fine then....but when I started speaking my mind about his drinking and putting up some boundaries he didn't like it and that is when he looked elsewhere. If you guys remember OW finally approached me last March and did the big sobbing apology to me. Well one of the things she said was things were ok with her and exh UNTIL she started mentioning his drinking and how it seems out of control and he immediately started pulling away from her. Within a month she caught him cheating. OW and exh was a good type of relationship for exh...she always had her kids so their time was sporadic at best. He likes to have his alone time to do whatever...maybe hide and drink, be a recluse, feel like crap about himself. I know exh hates who he is. When he was drinking he would always call himself a loser.

Ok, writing all of this is making me wonder what the heck I am thinking right now? I am looking at all the good things in him, but not the bad. Of course he is only coming around completely sober, saying and doing all the right things. I like this man! Who knows who he is after he drives away?

[Startingover2]

Ok..I just saw an email from mgf to exh.She is leaving today for her surgery and will be gone for a few days.

"After I talked to you on the phone, I realize that I should have said a few things. First of all, thank you for opening up a litttle bit. I am sorry that you are going through so much and I am sorry that you are going at it alone. You really are a good person and I admire your dedication to your family. I am glad to at least know why things are this way. However, I am sorry for the tough times you are dealing with. The most important thing that I left unsaid is that I love you. No matter what happens you can always count on the fact that I do love you with all of my heart. You will be with me in my thoughts and in my heart this week and that will be some of my strength when I feel weak. I am going to be just fine so please don't worry about this surgery. This is the first step in feeling much better and it will be worth it! Please try to have a good week and hang in there. I will be thinking about you. Talk to you soon. I love you always"

What do I make of this? Obviously they talked on the phone today which bugs me. I wonder what he told her about why they are not together? She mentions family, but that could be just his kids and guaranteed he never mentioned me to her. He also makes it sound like he is some down and out guy doing things alone. I don't get it! This is what I am talking about when he leaves the door open just in case.

[Startingover2]

Hes weird! He was just here for his visit with baby. Very strange though. He doesn't act overly interested at all in person. I mean he is friendly and chatty etc, but all the personal talks we have are via text message.

[Startingover2]

It is freezing here! What is happening? Good thing we only have to go out a few times today.

Soooo....after I made my above post exh started texting again about something random we talked about earlier. I went about my evening and then he sent one saying how much he wished he was here with us. So I let him come over for awhile before baby went to bed. It was so fun. She loved it and so did I. After awhile he helped me put her to sleep and I thought he was going to go. We watched part of a movie and then started messing around! I stopped after a bit and told him exwives don't make good booty calls and I would seriously freak out if I heard something in a few weeks that he was with someone else. He said he wasn't. Don't worry..I don't put a ton of faith in what he says yet. So messed around some more and I stopped and told him not yet. He was ok with it. He said he enjoyed just being here with us. We just hung out and then he left a few hours later.

Sort of mad at myself. I thought I was so much stronger and doing better. Any little crumb he throws I take.

My head knows nothing has changed. He has a long way to go, but UGGHHHHHH! I so wanted to let it all go.

[S.T. _I Made It!]

oh, before I read your posts SO2...

I did want to clarify, that I really don't know Tiger's sitch..haven't heard anything except that a woman or 2 came out.

And because I don't know his wife either, everything I said was just an assumption, or an example...so I have no idea what happened. I just wanted to show that just because we see these big things on the outside of the M, we have no idea what has happened on the inside, and what has been happening for years even.

I'll give another ex. My sis. she is a good person, and to make the story short, her H has lots of issues, has a problem holding down a job, resorts to alcohol, smokes pot too, doesn't know how to spend his money right..etc. BUT, I've heard my sis talk AT him. she is constently speaking loud, basically yelling and talking down at him. I don't think she realizes this, and I didn't think a whole lot of it before I read For Women Only, but then I noticed things. When she was away from him she would call him stupid, or an idiot.

So, my point is that she is just a part of the cycle. no matter who started the problem, no one is creating a solution, and therefore my sister is also a part of the problem. Instead of encouraging him to do better, she is pushing him down even further into his problem, and perhaps it was even her attitude towards him that had created his insufficiency? who really knows. There are many other things too, like she has no pride in herself or confidence, she's very heavy, obese actually, but doesn't do anything about it, and her house has always been mostly trashed.

and again, no matter who started what, the solution is for someone to break the cycle.


okay, gonna read your updates. that post was mostly for G