I bet she has a lot of resentment about the move and her quitting her job. Especially if she thinks that you made the decision to move unilaterally. I'm not saying she is right, I'm just saying she probably blames you for the move.
Perhaps it is time to tell her parents and his about the affair. They may be able to apply some pressure on her to do the right thing and work on her marriage. If not, at least they will know the truth about what is going on in your marriage.
No you don't need to be feeble at all. Tell her exactly what she needs to do to come home. End her affair. Perhaps go to marriage counseling. If she thinks that you will hold this over her for the rest of her life she will be very reluctant to end the affair. You need to enticed her back and I know that it sucks that you have to do it. But you do for now.
Finally, you would be surprised about how little someone in an affair actually thinks about their spouse. She isn't doing this to disrespect you or the marriage. She is doing it because she is addicted to his affection. It really has little to do with you.
I'm a man . . . But I can change . . . If I have to . . . I guess . . .
If her mother is financing her while having the A, then she is clearly not able to make it on her own. I doubt her lover makes much as a full-time school teacher, either. In due time, she will begin to feel the pressure of not having the nicer things in life that you were able to give her (unless mom continues to dish it out). Just one of the sad facts about A's is after reality sets in and her brain is dried of those false "in-love" chemicals that's been flooding it....then she will see the disaster she's made of her life & her family. By this time, you may or may not want to consider having her back into your life, but there can be another chance even after D.....in some cases. As it has been said, it takes so long for most WAW's to finally come out of the fog that things have changed and LBH has moved on and doesn't want a reconciliation.
FWIW, I think you've handled yourself well. With holidays ahead, it will be a very difficult time. Be with friends & family as much as possible. Stay focused and enjoy your kids to the fullest.
BTW, did you figure out anything by reading up on emotional abuse....and how your W thought you had abused her?
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
My WAW claimed for the entire summer that her unhappiness was absolutely not related to the move or her having to seek full time teaching work. Then two days after she moved out, she screamed that she had to subordinate her career to mine.
I told her Mom about the EA soon after the first admittance of the EA in Sept. what her daughter was doing. Her response was "she hasn't done anything wrong" because it wasn't PA then. Her Mom has $$$ and is funding her life without any moral compass attached. It is the easiest thing for Mom to do, and Mom must think this is the fastest way for her daughter to "get away from the pain."
WAW has minimized or failed to mention the affair to anyone in our lives who would object.
I have not talked to the OM at all. My WAW was always the one pushing the EA. Her phone calls and texts were 90+% outbound to him when she was here. He was meeting her at whatever EA level she wanted but not escalating. Now, who knows?
I will let her know that if she ends her affair I will absolutely not hold it over her head for the rest of her life when the time is right.
I am just short of gleeful that the affair has become an "open secret" at the middle school where OM teaches full-time and WAW substitutes.
If WAW's wake up realization happens much beyond the D and she is still with OM, I don't believe I can keep DBing by then.
I am astounded how many great people (M and W) I have met while GALing. So now, I believe when I will be ready if a D happens, I will be able to find many W friends and when the time comes, a companion.
I have my S4 and S7 the entire Christmas week - she chose to have them at Thanksgiving. WAW will be very lonely with OM while we fill our house with love and laughter. I pray the wake up begins then, if it hasn't before.
I appreciate you bringing up emotional abuse. I did a lot of asking WAW when she was here about specifics, soul searching and relating these episodes to my counselor (who earlier met once with WAW). There were few specific episodes that she could name. The ones she mentioned I related to my counselor. The counselor scoffed at all of them. Counselor characterized them as not great but not emotional abuse.
Related to emotional abuse, WAW started an "always mad" mantra for the last month she was in the house. When we last spoke (about getting L's), I kindly told WAW the boys and are going to cut a Christmas tree in the forest this Sat and invited her to come. I said we could even get two-one for WAW's apt and one for our home. WAW said no because "I was mad the whole time when we cut one last year." I don't recall being or thinking I was mad, and I recall the day really clearly. The "mad" thing seems to be a final blast of the shotgun of justification.
Never did hate, b#*tch, ugly, fat, stupid or any classical emotional abuse words come from my mouth to her. Of c ourse, never any physical abuse of any kind.
Furthermore as related to emotional abuse: I am guilty of being a Mars-direct communicator.
I am guilty of having ideas on how we should live our life and saying those ideas.
I am guilty of not being empathetic to her feelings at times.
I am guilty of trying to solve her problems when she wanted someone to just listen.
I am guilty of blaming her for buying more house than we need because she wanted a big yard.
I am guilty of not going to MC when she wanted to in May.
I am guilty of not agreeing our marriage was in trouble in April when she said so.
WAW complained about many of my guilty statements above. I do not believe those things rise to emotional abuse. They were not always the loving thing to do, but they were not emotional abuse.
WAW is a "words of affirmation" along with "quality time" woman, both of these things I am certain the OM figured out pretty quickly. I found out too late.
Sounds as if you are "guilty" of being a man. Don't worry about the emotional abuse claims b/c she has to find something to try to justify her reason for leaving you and finding OM. Is the OM M?
Her mother is a fool if she doesn't realize what her D is doing. People who think EA's are not wrong or not serious has a lot of shock in store for them.
I think the more you physically detach yourself from your W, the better. She won't miss you as long as you communicate with her or try to be with her.....even for the kids' sake. I don't think she will change her mind before Christmas b/c that is too soon and she's in too deep. She's ruined her reputation so she feels that she needs to go all the way with her plans, now.
Talk to you later.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
After I honestly looked at myself and talked to my counselor at great length, I also believe the emotional abuse was WAW's attempt to justify the unjustifiable EA/PA. I wanted to put it on here, worms and all, to get more opinions. Thanks.
Her Mom thinks she is doing the loving thing for my WAW by funding her new life. I am not going to bother attempting to talk to her Mom - it will be seen as manipulative.
It kills me inside, but I am physically and emotionally detaching from WAW as much as I can without appearing rude. I will drop our S4 and S7 at her apt. in the morning when I go run a 5K (GALing at its best!) in -20F wind chill here in MT.
At drop offs now, I say goodbye to my boys while they are in my car to avoid having to go in her apt. Also I can control leaving the drop off rather than have have to talk to her or a "goodbye" scene with the boys. Interestingly, she makes a point of coming in our home and looking around when she drops off our boys for me.
I don't know if WAW is aware that others at the school know of her EA/PA. Her "thought" processes revolve around one thing (the EA/PA) right now.
Her higher order thinking appears distorted to me. She actually told me last weekend with a straight face that she didn't think H1N1 shots were needed for our S4 and S7. I stuck to my guns that H1N1 kills kids.
From what I understand, the H1N1 symptoms appear flu-like then morph quickly to something deadly. Our S7 has Aspergers and is not good at telling us when something is physically wrong with himself. She said our S4 goes to a small daycare so won't be exposed. However, the S7 goes to a 1500 kid school and wrestles his little brother every night. It seemed obvious to me to get them both the free shots.
She finally agreed that I could take them to get the shots since I think it's a good idea. I must say I completely broke down when WAW couldn't see me walking to the car with our boys because I could see how much she has lost it.
I will not keep my hope and expectation that she will come around by Christmas. You hit it square on the head - WAW is in deep. Thanks for the reality.
Interestingly, she makes a point of coming in our home and looking around when she drops off our boys for me.
Yes. Do you realize the several reasons for her coming in the house and looking around?
Disagreements over the kids will arise at even unimportant things.
I think you are doing very well. The holidays will be tough on you & the kids, but I have a feeling that if things are done right.....it is going to hit your W's emotions big time. But, OTOH, if she's involved in an A......a WAW can actually just slide over the emotional attachments to the past and think only of OM and get all fogged out in her fantasy. Do you know how things are going in that department? If she is involved with OM.....then you may want to think long and hard on what you will say and the decisions you make. Let me know.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
I think WAW comes in my (our) house to look around to keep the anger high about how much I have changed the decor of the house and how clean and tidy it is without her. Last summer, WAW told me and anyone else who listened that when she saw me doing housework (part of my 180s), it just made her angry because I didn't do it before.
Thanks for the sanity check on disagreements. Before the MLC, what was best for our kids was always paramount to both of us. It still kills me when I think of her not wanting the shots. She has drifted so far...
She got angry about my reasonably pleasant manner on the phone last night when she almost rudely asked if I would bring some things to her when I dropped off our boys this morning at her apt. She didn't even bother with a please for any of the requests. I pondered pointing out the disrespect but did not do so. Should I have?
Just picked up my S7 and S4 from her apt. She also got angry at my business-like manner towards her. I'm friendly enough at this point with a "hi" and "bye" but only reasonably pleasant words about business topics. Again, should I ask about the anger?
She is definitely emotionally invested in the OM. Not a lot of eye contact when we are together -- a clear sign of guilt during the past few months. I am trying to minimize all contact at this point. When she says a sentence, I say a few words, etc.
I have a lot of activities planned for Christmas week with our boys. I am on vacation that week. I plan to have them take ski lessons, go snowshoeing, do a little bit of volunteer work, attend church services, play lots of games, and open presents on Christmas morning. All will be sprinkled with lots of love and hugs. WAW was once invited to all of our activities, but I will rescind if needed. My parents will be visiting the whole week too (part of my 180s). I am so pumped up for a great time. Just need snow...
Sure enough. After talking with our boys before bedtime, my WAW attacked me about not chit-chatting and being overtly talkative at her apt. when I picked up the boys. I mentioned in my previous post that I just stick to business while being reasonably pleasant. Again, using fewer words than she does, etc.
When we first separated (before DBing) and I picked up boys or she picked up boys, I would almost always be sugar sweet, talk about us and how she could come home anytime, and how we need to end this separation, etc. Maybe she misses my groveling now that I am DBing. Man I was a world class groveler... Sometimes so much she teared up - which I understand from this forum is more about guilt than about feelings for our marriage.
She likes to project onto me that my silence and few words are "anger" I suppose. Really, it is disinterest in her WAW behavior. I am always extremely conscientious of being pleasant and involved with our boys at pickup. These transitions are very hard on our S7 and S4. I wish she could she the devastation she is causing. If she saw a movie of her behavior starring someone else, I believe she would scream at the WAW to get a grip.
Anger is one of her things she likes to project onto me. I believe to keep up the venom in her mind to "justify" the EA/PA.
Thoughts? Is her projecting "anger" just a typical WAW thing?
