Help... I need to stop reacting!

[Puppy Dog Tails]

The hard part is, that because of her (potential) unstable mental and emotional state, he is very fearful to provoke her in any way and is therefore still not willing to cut things off. Is still hoping she will...
What do I do with that?

Help...?

You treat it as you would any other addiction, Rocked. You say "I'm sorry to see you in pain, and I'm REALLY sorry to hear you're not willing to end what you yourself admit is a destructive addiction to you. I've already told you that I won't share you, so I guess I have my answer. I have some decisions I need to make."

And you keep it open-ended.

Yes, everything he admitted to you was good, but he's now doubled-down on the OW. He's saying "I'm a pyromaniac, I REALIZE I'm a pyromaniac, but I won't give up my matches." So you need to let him know that you are considering removing yourself from the situation.

It is a chicken-and-the-egg when a fogged-out spouse says "I'm not willing to give up OW/OM, because I'm not yet ready to recommit to the marriage. The marriage commitment is a DECISION, and he cannot make that without giving up the contact with OW -- he himself is telling you this.

So you need to stand your ground, in my opinion.

Puppy

[rockedworld]

OK.. clearly getting the same message from you guys...

My C had a slightly different perspective, although ultimately with the same goal...

I just need to process this a little more, still struggling...

[rockedworld]

OK, so here is the thing my C helped me identify about why there is so much fear and anxiety here for me...

As my H has shared with me more about OW and her behavior, it seems very likely that she has a personality disorder and is capable of fairly extreme behaviors. It is very likely if H cuts off contact suddenly and dramatically, she will act out of spite, likely making things public. My H has a high profile job in which it is very likely he would lose it if this happens. This makes me fearful of two things: 1. what is she capable of and is my family potentially at risk? and 2. if H suddenly loses his job we are in immediate financial crisis.
Both of these fears impact my kids, and I can't tolerate that. If this was just about H and me it would be a diff. sitch.

This is where I feel stuck about demanding the zero contact boundary.

C encouraged me instead to start with a boundary around how much I can tolerate hearing about OW and "helping" H sorting this out. I can communicate the importance of ending contact asap, especially given her potential mental illness, but need to keep putting that back on H to figure out for himself. In the meantime, I maintain the boundaries already established which minimize (but don't eliminate) the cake eating.

I know it is not ideal, but I am really concerned about my kids here... make sense?

[Gardener]

rocked,
I don't know what to tell you, but what did stand out was:
1) When would "asap" be?

Alternately, if he ends it gradually:
2) When is "gradually"?
3) A last contact is a last contact. OW's potential reaction(s) would still be an unknown, would they not?

"I know it is not ideal, but I am really concerned about my kids here... make sense?"
Of course. Perfect sense.
Anyway...just thinkin'

Have a Happy Thanksgiving, Rocked.

[PainfulDusk]

(((rocked)))

How do you feel about hearing about OW? It makes me sick everytime my h mentions her. SO when he does, I dont answer. Thats my boundary. For now anyway.

I tend to agree, no contact is NO CONTACT. SHe is unstable..ok but you dont really know how she will react. She may do nothing. From my chair wayyyy over here, it looks like h is trying to make an excuse. I could be wrong.
"i cant not contact her! She may do <fill in the blank>" "it would ruin us!" You cant live in that kind of fear. Because now who has control of how you are reacting. Not you...you are making decisions based on hearsay from your h about his OW. She' unstable? Even MORE reason for no contact.

Many many hugs hon...hope you have a great Thanksgiving.

Dusk

[chatterbug]

RDW. Your husband can always get another job. But what he cannot get is another you.

Do not let him control you with OW. She will do what she will do. You cannot control that.

You know you both do not even begin to heal until there is No Contact with strong boundaries and full transparancy in place.

Choices and respect. Perhaps it is time for your Husband to start stepping up and making some and showing some respect.
You lead by example here.

Below is a quote for you today because you are a great person and need some strength today.




I am strong because I am weak.
I am beautiful because I know my flaws.
I am a lover because I am a fighter.
I am fearless because I have been afraid.
I am wise because I have been foolish.
& I can laugh because I've known sadness.

[Puppy Dog Tails]

Sorry, Rocked, but I'm with everyone else. No contact and FULL transparency, or it will never work.

If you do this, the OW may react in an unstable manner.

Then again, she may NOT, and she may ALSO behave in that same unstable manner even if your husband begins to LIMIT his contact with her, or -- as someone else said above -- if and when he finally does cut off all contact, and then what have you gained? You'd just have lost several months of potential healing and restoration for your marriage.

Being the weather geek for our baseball league, they picked me to make the weather calls of whether or not to cancel games, umpires, etc. In Florida, with our "afternoon pop-up thunderstorms," that can be difficult. I made a decision early on never to cancel the games based on a FORECAST (what MIGHT happen), but rather by what the situation is on the ground at the moment.

I think it works pretty well in Life, too.

In 5 years of doing this, and studying hundreds (thousands?) of cases, and being personally involved in a dozen or so, I have YET to see one where the betrayed spouse regretted being TOO strict with their boundaries, especially as it relates to no-contact and transparency. Those that have regrets about being too LENIENT, however, are legion.

Happy Thanksgiving,

Puppy

[Coach]

[quote]Being the weather geek for our baseball league, they picked me to make the weather calls of whether or not to cancel games, umpires, etc. In Florida, with our "afternoon pop-up thunderstorms," that can be difficult. I made a decision early on never to cancel the games based on a FORECAST (what MIGHT happen), but rather by what the situation is on the ground at the moment./quote]

I flew for 9 years in the Air Force and that was our rule, "Never cancel on the forecast."

You are imagining the worst case scenario (catastrophizing)what might happen. The OW has all the control in this sitch if she knows you two are afraid. She can blackmail your family because of your fears. She might be a bunny boiler and she might not be. But letting her call the shots makes you feel hopeless, scared, and out of control. You control your thoughts and actions. Think thru this, get help and stay aware. You can handle it.

Cheers

[rockedworld]

OK my friends....

First... thank you. For being firm and supportive to me at the same time. Thank you. I do NOT know what I would do without this forum right now.

Thanks for the quote Cutter.... that is very powerful.

Second... the update:
H and I talked again last night and apparently he and OW have ended the R. BUT, she does still have a part time contract where H works and it is not done til January. So, there will be "work related" contact until then, and this is unavoidable.

In describing where he and I are at, he says, we are in a "commited faithful M" for now... but still need to address the issues that pre-existed the A. Which I have always said I am willing to do.

Now... the tough issue... transparency. We discussed it. I was clear how essential it is. We were both exhausted at 1:00 am at this point and we agreed to discuss it further.
I know I will get resistance... and what does this mean? He wants to keep the door open for ongoing contact. I know this. I am not stupid.

I have, until now, taken a stand that I am not in favor of a separation of any sort and if H chooses to leave, then that is his choice and will need to own it to kids and everyone else. However, I feel this is the only leverage I have to enforce this boundary. If he is not willing to have complete transparency, then I ask him to leave? Is that my only option for enforcing this? If anyone else has other ideas, I am open.

Also - I do not want him to know about this forum and one friend that I have confided in about my sitch thru email. If we have complete transparency both ways, I feel I am jeopardizing my few support systems. What would I do about that?

Anyway.... Hope everyone has a Happy Thanksgiving. We all have much to be thankful for even in the roller coaster of various sitches we live in....

[Gardener]

rockedworld,
Well, mostly good news and progress. Good for you. I have not been in your position, so just by what I've learned here, and my gut instinct:

If he is not willing to have complete transparency, then I ask him to leave? Is that my only option for enforcing this? If anyone else has other ideas, I am open.

No, you tell him to leave "I will not share you with another woman. At all,etc"

Also - I do not want him to know about this forum and one friend that I have confided in about my sitch thru email. If we have complete transparency both ways, I feel I am jeopardizing my few support systems. What would I do about that?

I never got the impression on this forum that the transparency is a two-way street. What trust did you violate? Dunno, I may be wrong here.
But if you do it jointly, I'd insist on keeping this board out of it, much as you wouldn't include your diary (innermost thoughts and feelings), had you been keeping one during this period. Is the one friend male?

I now defer to Coach, Puppy, et al.

Happy Thanksgiving, rocked.