New here, this is my story...

[ClingingToHope]

I'll be interested to see how it goes. Good luck.

[HelpMe!]

Well, I went to church ts morning and didn't take the kids, my w is not comfortable with it. Now, sunday dinner at grandma's.

I need to avoid my w for the next few days, see if she reconsiders counseling on wed. I'm not holding my breath.

I have worked hard to understand what I did wrong, and as I learn what I did wrong, I learn to forgive myself. If she chooses not to, I can't help that. If she won't file because it is not convenient, then I am not okay with that.

If there is no hope, she won't go to counseling, she would rather rip me down and says that she wants a divorce...THEN FILE!

Am I wrong? Why would I continue this fight if there really is no hope?

[HelpMe!]

Fellow Dbers,

I'm not sure what to do. Let me back up and explain the turn of events this weekend.

My W agreed to go to counseling, we went last Wed. We were there for 2 hours. In that time, I remained calm and listened to her tell me about everything I did wrong. I had some oppertunity to talk about my progress in counseling; but it was mostly her rehashing everything I did wrong. I did have a chance to tell her this is not all my fault and that she has blame in it too...she did agree.

She started the session by talking with the counselor seperatly. When she did, she said that she missed me sometimes; but not all the time.

She repeated that when I was in there, talking about the Olidays being our favorite time, etc...

At the end of the session she was angry. She said that she needed to come to counseling to "get this off her chest"; but it was nothing I hadn't heard before.

She got very angry that I wasn't fighting back. She told me to yell because it felt good. I told her I saw no value in that and if divorce was our only choice, I was not going to get angry with her.

It was emmotional, very emmotional at times, esspecially when I had to rehash the things that happened to me as a kid.

At the end, the C asked if we would like to come back next week, we have an appt for this wed. She replied "I don't see the point, there is nothing left here". He asked me and I replied that I would come back. he closed by asking us to think about it and call if we wanted the appt. He also added that love is a choice and so is divorce. Love isn't either there or it isn't, it is a choice.

This Friday my W had a sleepover for our 11 yo daughter. 5 11 yo girls. She didn't tell me about it (but I knew) until Friday morning when she needed help. like a fool, I agreed. I bought supper, snacks, movies and even breakfast. I worked with her and her sister and it went pretty smooth. I was feeling pretty good. I left early, didn't linger. I did tell her that if she needed anything to call. our little boy was pretty sick and we thought he might need to go into the dr.

Sat morning she called ans said they needed eggs. like a fool again, I ran and got eggs and went over and made breakfast.

I stayed to finsih cleaning up the yard for winter and was asked to watch our little boy while she took the girls out. I agreed.

Before she left she was asking about bills. I was explaining things to her and things got heated. She mentioned advertising the house more and I asked her to suggest where we put it in the budget. She got angry that I wasn't just figuring this out for her.

I asked her if she would consider counseling this week and she flat out said no. She got upset and yelled at me to get upset. I asked her if it would help if I got upset, because if it would, I would get very upset. Well, I got upset. We argued and I asked her if she was not willing to go to counseling and if things were "over" and there was "no chance" why she hadn't filed yet. She said she would file when she was "damn good and ready". We argued some more, but I felt I was very fair in the discussion. At one point she said "If we get divorced..." and I stopped her. I told her she keeps telling me there is no hope, but she says things like that all the time. She asked "like what" and I repeated what she said "IF we get divorced". She got angry and said "WHEN we get divorced".

I should have walked away. I didn't.

I told her that we had two choices. We can go to counseling and fix this marriage or we can get divorced. I would like to go to counseling. She again said no. So I said "then file, I can't stay in limbo any longer".

She got very angry and said "I've been in limbo for 4 years, do you think I give a sh!t that you've been in limbo for 2 months?".

I asked her if she was waiting for me to file. If that is what she wanted. She said no.

She was leaving, upset, and I let her go.

While she was gone, I got really angry. I filled out my petition for divorce online and emailed it to myself to print. I was going to end this. I was going to take control and do what she says is the "only choice".

When she came home, I was getting ready to leave. I asked her if she would file this week and she talked about money problems. I told her that was fine, I would do it then. She said she had the paperwork all ready. I told her I did too and she looked like she would kill me, so I left.

I went to work and printed two copies; one a joint petition and the other a individual petition for me. I was going to get this process started one way or the other this week.

I went back home and gave her the papers and told her we can go to counseling or you can review these papers and we can file this week. If you won't do either, I will file on my own. Then I left.

Then I posted on her, and if you've been reading along, I suspect you were confused. I was too.

Today I went to church and spent the day with family, talking. They are supportive of me filing, but they all also said that I had done very well to this point and that only I would know when it was right to end it.

I saw Christmas commercials today and got very sad.

I don't want a divorce, but this limbo is killing me. I leave for 7 days and go to the old house and sleep on an air mattress. She leaves for 7 days and goes to her parents and has their food to eat, supplies to use, etc... Yet SHE is the one with money problems?

I'm so frusterated I don't know what to do. I have IC on Wed morning and we do have a Pm appt on Wed for btoh of us, if she decides to go. On top of that, we have a 2 hour appt with a FC for our daughter Wed. afternoon.

What do I do? I melted down, but I don't think I regret it. She needed to know where I stood. She really feels like I have had all kinds of affairs, like I am just waiting for someone better to come along and that we have been "nothing more than friends" for years. I just don't buy it.

She agreed that she did love me at one time, but that it was many years ago.

She said she doesn't have the energy or desire to fix our marriage; and won't.

She said that I am a differnt person and she doesn't know me anymore.

She says that we need to sell the house before filing for divorce.

What am I supposed to do? I'm at the end of my rope, and I really felt like I let go on Saturday, but today I'm not so sure.

I can't imagine those of you who have been doing this for month after month. It is so hard to leave your kids and not see them. To only hear them on the phone. To not be with my wife, who I miss more than I ever thought I would.

I do know that if we divorce, I can move on. I do know I will be okay and will meet someone else someday; but the waiting is killing me.

Everyone keeps saying "I wish there was something I could say or do". I really wish there was; but the sad fact is, there is nothign anyone, including me, can do or say to change this.

I'm very confused and will wait to see my IC on Wed before doing anything and I am going to try to avoid my W until then. Let both of us cool down and see if she does reconsider going to the counseling session.

I could use some advice. I appreciate any feedback.

[TrentC]

She got very angry that I wasn't fighting back. She told me to yell because it felt good. I told her I saw no value in that and if divorce was our only choice, I was not going to get angry with her.

This is good. If you don't fight back, she can't push away from you. (It's also childish to say that you should yell because "it feels good"; not everyone has to throw a tantrum to express their emotions. Good for you for not rising to the bait.)

This Friday my W had a sleepover for our 11 yo daughter. 5 11 yo girls. She didn't tell me about it (but I knew) until Friday morning when she needed help. like a fool, I agreed. I bought supper, snacks, movies and even breakfast. I worked with her and her sister and it went pretty smooth. I was feeling pretty good. I left early, didn't linger. I did tell her that if she needed anything to call. our little boy was pretty sick and we thought he might need to go into the dr.

Sat morning she called ans said they needed eggs. like a fool again, I ran and got eggs and went over and made breakfast.

I stayed to finsih cleaning up the yard for winter and was asked to watch our little boy while she took the girls out. I agreed.

OK, I have to ask; what exactly was your thinking here? You basically rolled over and showed your belly here. This might be part of the reason your wife has no respect for you; because she can treat you like crap, and you come back asking for more.

Before she left she was asking about bills. I was explaining things to her and things got heated. She mentioned advertising the house more and I asked her to suggest where we put it in the budget. She got angry that I wasn't just figuring this out for her.

But you did the next best thing. She's a grown woman, she should be able to figure out how to pay bills. Worst-case scenario, you give her copies of the past few months' worth of bills and tell her to figure it out yourself.

I asked her if she would consider counseling this week and she flat out said no. She got upset and yelled at me to get upset. I asked her if it would help if I got upset, because if it would, I would get very upset. Well, I got upset.

That was f*cking stupid. Why in the hell did you do that? She's been trying to push you into a shouting match for days, why did you have to go and give it to her?

We argued and I asked her if she was not willing to go to counseling and if things were "over" and there was "no chance" why she hadn't filed yet. She said she would file when she was "damn good and ready".

Then you say "fair enough", walk out of the house, and don't speak to her again unless it has to do with kids. You don't freakin' clean up her yard for her, you don't run errands for her.

At one point she said "If we get divorced..." and I stopped her. I told her she keeps telling me there is no hope, but she says things like that all the time. She asked "like what" and I repeated what she said "IF we get divorced". She got angry and said "WHEN we get divorced".

So you pushed her, and got the answer you apparently wanted. Congratulations.

I should have walked away. I didn't.

I told her that we had two choices. We can go to counseling and fix this marriage or we can get divorced. I would like to go to counseling. She again said no. So I said "then file, I can't stay in limbo any longer".

She got very angry and said "I've been in limbo for 4 years, do you think I give a sh!t that you've been in limbo for 2 months?".

I asked her if she was waiting for me to file. If that is what she wanted. She said no.

She was leaving, upset, and I let her go.

And this is why you don't initiate R talks, and you try to shut them down as fast as you can (unless they are of the "I want to work things out" variety). You pushed and pushed, and played right into her script.

When she came home, I was getting ready to leave. I asked her if she would file this week and she talked about money problems. I told her that was fine, I would do it then. She said she had the paperwork all ready. I told her I did too and she looked like she would kill me, so I left.

I went to work and printed two copies; one a joint petition and the other a individual petition for me. I was going to get this process started one way or the other this week.

And now you're even going to let her off of the hook by busting your marriage up for her.

Again, it's no wonder that she has no respect for you; she can make you dance to her tune, and thank her for the privilege.

[HelpMe!]

TrentC,

A couple of things...

First, I do appreciate honesty :-)

In regards to cleaning up 'her' yard for her, it is my yard too, we still share the house...but you are right, those roles that we both had before now need to be shared.

I talked with my Pastor about the DB idea after church on Sunday. She understood the concept and mostly agreed; but also said that when it involves the kids, she thought it was over the line. As an active father, I will help with the kids; but there are things I can do to make her realize the role I play; for example, when she emails me at lunch and says she can't get the kids, I need to say that I can not either. But if it is a b-day party for one of them, I will help. I can DB in lots of ways, but it won't be by involving the kids.

Yes, I did fight; but one of the issues was that she wanted to see my emmotion, something I have done a damn good job of hiding over the last 2 months. I showed it, but also showed her that I am okay moving on; but prefer to fix the marriage. If there is a chance to fix it, then I want to fix it. If there is no chance at all, then she needs to file.

I agree, I do regret the ultimatum. I regret the argument, somewhat; but even if we file, there is no divorce for 4-5 months. I've said from the begining that my W will need to file to know that she can, before there is any chance of reconsilliation.

I won't file on my own. I should have known better. I let my emmotions control me and convinced myself it was what I now wanted. It isn't. But I am closer to that then I ever have been.

My current approach is to completly withdraw from contact with her unless it involves the kids and see if she reconsideres counseling on Wed. If not; then I need to move forward with planning for what to do next; and initially that will be holiday child placement. That sucks; and I wanted to avoid that; but at this point, I don't think I can.

[TrentC]

Yes, I did fight; but one of the issues was that she wanted to see my emmotion, something I have done a damn good job of hiding over the last 2 months. I showed it, but also showed her that I am okay moving on; but prefer to fix the marriage. If there is a chance to fix it, then I want to fix it. If there is no chance at all, then she needs to file.

There are ways to show emotion other than what you chose. You let her push you into a confrontation.

I won't file on my own. I should have known better. I let my emmotions control me and convinced myself it was what I now wanted. It isn't. But I am closer to that then I ever have been.

Good luck, then. I'm not convinced that your approach will work, but you gotta do what you gotta do.

[HelpMe!]

Yes, I did fight; but one of the issues was that she wanted to see my emmotion, something I have done a damn good job of hiding over the last 2 months. I showed it, but also showed her that I am okay moving on; but prefer to fix the marriage. If there is a chance to fix it, then I want to fix it. If there is no chance at all, then she needs to file.

There are ways to show emotion other than what you chose. You let her push you into a confrontation.

I won't file on my own. I should have known better. I let my emmotions control me and convinced myself it was what I now wanted. It isn't. But I am closer to that then I ever have been.

Good luck, then. I'm not convinced that your approach will work, but you gotta do what you gotta do.

Can you give me an example of how I could have shown emotion other than the way I did?

[HelpMe!]

We will see what tomorrow brings.

She is supposed to call the counselor by noon tomorrow if she wants to do counseling on wed.

If not, I am not sure what is next.

She called tonight for help with our son tomorrow, who is sick and needs to see the dr. I am busy...but it is killing me not to help.

[Gardener]

HelpMe,
My quick, short advice?

She says that we need to sell the house before filing for divorce.

(1)This is simply not true. You can and probably should divorce first (I am). All the legalities, distribution of proceeds, living arrangements can be written into the divorce decree to be enforced when the house is sold.

(2)There's nothing wrong with anger. Is it detachment? No, but detachment is a process, not an event. Maybe it's good you gave it right back at her.Besides, you're human, a good man, frustrated, upset, and hurt.

(3)I think you should file.

IMHO

Keep going.

[HelpMe!]

Well, to say that I am confused is an understatment.

I have IC tomorrow, FC with our oldest D and W tomrrow, and hopefully, MC in the evening. However, my W has yet to call to say she will be there. I should know by the end of the day if she will be.

I don't want a divorce, but I am growing very tired of this setup. Moving in and out of the house every week. Not having a real "home". Only seeing my kids half time. This isn't what having a family is supposed to be like. I know millions of people go through this each year. I know everyone will be okay; but I also KNOW we could fix this marriage; the right way, this time.

I think I have a pretty good shot at being served divorce papers this week, because I pushed her. We will see. We're at a tipping point.

I am focused on tomorrow for right now. I need to talk this through with my IC and see if my wife reconsiders MC or simply goes to file; or even worse, does nothing at all.

Last night I talked to a guy who was divorced after 13 years, similar situation to mine. He said marriage the second time around is much better because he learned how to be married the first time and spent a lot of time in C to learn what he did wrong before remarrying. I certainly intend to do just that if I do end up divorced.

I talked to another guy who was seperated from his wife for 3 months, they were filing for divorce, had assets figured out, etc... Then one day she changed her mind, agreed to C for 6 months and 11 years later they are a picture of happiness, and he says they have never been happier.

So what is in the cards for me? I believe in God and do believe that we don't get more than we can handle; but it does seem like I am getting EVERYTHING that I can handle and I feel like I am about sink.

I know I have decided that I won't file. I plan to tell my W that when we get into heated arguements, we say things we don't mean, which is why I had refused to fight. She may have gotten me to fight last weekend, but I won't do that again. There is no point.